Joseph Smith And Mohammed

[Anakin7]

LDS critics show a parallel between Joseph Smith and Mohammed and there non christian simularities. Has there ever been any studies on this ?. Thank you in advance.

In His Debt/Grace

Anakin7

LDS JEDI KNIGHT

[Daniel Peterson]

A sad story. I wrote a very lengthy paper on this very issue many, many years ago. Personal computers were in their infancy.

One day in Berkeley, after finishing the last sentence, I saved it. The computer failed at that precise moment, and I lost both original and back-up. And, though I took it around to various specialists there in Berkeley, nobody could recover it.

It's been twenty-three years. I'm finally in the psychological position where I may try it again.

[RobertAC]

I don't know if there are studies, per se, but if I recall correctly, laws concerning plural marriage were similar between Mormon and Muslim faiths.

Religions share many similarities between themselves. Muslim sharia is similar to the Amish code of conduct. Some of the esoteric beliefs of Mormonism appear similar to Eastern religions such as Hinduism and Buddism (at least to me). However, if critics are trying to draw a link between JS and Mohammed, the link will be frayed and tenuous at best.

[MormonMason]

A sad story. I wrote a very lengthy paper on this very issue many, many years ago. Personal computers were in their infancy.

One day in Berkeley, after finishing the last sentence, I saved it. The computer failed at that precise moment, and I lost both original and back-up. And, though I took it around to various specialists there in Berkeley, nobody could recover it.

It's been twenty-three years. I'm finally in the psychological position where I may try it again.

Did you save the computer and the hardware? The 3.5" diskettes/5.25" floppy disks? Someone I know might possibly be able to recover the file for you, if you still have the disks. Data recovery has come a long way since then.

[David T]

A sad story. I wrote a very lengthy paper on this very issue many, many years ago. Personal computers were in their infancy.

One day in Berkeley, after finishing the last sentence, I saved it. The computer failed at that precise moment, and I lost both original and back-up. And, though I took it around to various specialists there in Berkeley, nobody could recover it.

It's been twenty-three years. I'm finally in the psychological position where I may try it again.

For a couple of years before I changed my major, I was planning on being a 3D computer animator. In my first 3D character animation class, a teacher told a story, of a competition between Jesus and Satan, as to who could create the best 3D world in the quickest amount of time.

Satan hurries on, modeling and shading like mad. It's a masterpiece. Meanwhile, Jesus is going very slowly, but surely. Satan's masterpiece is brilliant, and complicated beyond belief. Minutes before the timer runs out and the winner is declared, the electricity flickers, and both computers shut down, and then reboot.

"All is lost!" Satan rants and raves, "But at least it's a stalemate. Neither of us can win."

That's not true, the judge noted. Jesus won.

"What? Did you not see mine? It was grander, more magnificent, and far more complex!"

Yes, but yours was lost. You have nothing to show.

"Why?! Why not? What happened?!"

Well, you all know the answer. The difference is... Jesus Saves.

*badum-ching!*

Edited February 27, 2013 by David T

[Maidservant]

There are some interesting bits.

For example, in my experience, when a Muslim shares with you the Prophethood of Mohammed, saw, she will point to the Quran as the foundational sign of that prophethood. While there are innumberable distinctions to be made between the Quran and the Book of Mormon; how they respectively came to be; and the storyline of each prophet;, I nevertheless find it telling that we also as a people use the Book of Mormon as the foundational sign of Joseph Smith's prophethood. In my own mind, just my opinion, sometimes I think this concept is in place in our Church so that when it becomes time to share the gospel more widely in the Muslim world, there will be something there that is understandable to them.

"Joseph Smith was a prophet."

"He cannot be. Did he produce a book? Because the Quran is the miracle from Muhammed."

They will be expecting you to answer No, because no sectarian Christian can answer Yes that there is a prophet who produced a book, to be a sign for their religion or a prophet at all.

So when we say, "Um . . . well, actually . . . yea, there's a book," then this may actually be a way to open hearts.

But all that bit is just my own opinion on that.

[David T]

There are some interesting bits.

For example, in my experience, when a Muslim shares with you the Prophethood of Mohammed, saw, she will point to the Quran as the foundational sign of that prophethood. While there are innumberable distinctions to be made between the Quran and the Book of Mormon; how they respectively came to be; and the storyline of each prophet;, I nevertheless find it telling that we also as a people use the Book of Mormon as the foundational sign of Joseph Smith's prophethood.

Which is interesting, because the Qur'an is far more similar to the Doctrine and Covenants in terms of style, and content.

[Anakin7]

I would be interested in that paper Bro. Peterson

In His Debt/Grace

Anakin7

LDS JEDI KNIGHT

Edited February 27, 2013 by Anakin7

[EllenMaksoud]

LDS critics show a parallel between Joseph Smith and Mohammed and there non christian simularities. Has there ever been any studies on this ?. Thank you in advance.

In His Debt/Grace

Anakin7

LDS JEDI KNIGHT

I wish I had written down the similarities between Mormonisim and Islam that I saw as I came out of Islam and converted to the church. Somewhere in my books, I have two that note the similarities. I believe that the Islam that Muhammad PBUH practiced is vastly different from what some of the sects practice today.

My own issue with Islam was that they did not put Jesus Christ in his proper place. Today, there is a lot of uninformed hate between Islamic cultures and the Western Christian cultures.

[EllenMaksoud]

There are some interesting bits.

For example, in my experience, when a Muslim shares with you the Prophethood of Mohammed, saw, she will point to the Quran as the foundational sign of that prophethood. While there are innumberable distinctions to be made between the Quran and the Book of Mormon; how they respectively came to be; and the storyline of each prophet;, I nevertheless find it telling that we also as a people use the Book of Mormon as the foundational sign of Joseph Smith's prophethood. In my own mind, just my opinion, sometimes I think this concept is in place in our Church so that when it becomes time to share the gospel more widely in the Muslim world, there will be something there that is understandable to them.

"Joseph Smith was a prophet."

"He cannot be. Did he produce a book? Because the Quran is the miracle from Muhammed."

They will be expecting you to answer No, because no sectarian Christian can answer Yes that there is a prophet who produced a book, to be a sign for their religion or a prophet at all.

So when we say, "Um . . . well, actually . . . yea, there's a book," then this may actually be a way to open hearts.

But all that bit is just my own opinion on that.

It is my dream that one day Elders will stand in Makka and share the gospel of Jesus Christ. When I was Muslim, I loved the modesty and protection of my Hijab and Abaya. I never felt closer to Allah SWT (God) than when I was doing the prayers, never. I loved being protected from the men at Jumah.

I agree that the Holy Qur'an is not an easy book. You can't just read it like the BoM or the Bible. It is for meditation.

[EllenMaksoud]

I would be interested in that paper Bro. Peterson

In His Debt/Grace

Anakin7

LDS JEDI KNIGHT

It's sad that Evangelicals seem to come at so many things from the point of view of hate. I only got as far as the first paragraph.

When Jesus Christ returns, there will be only one religion, yet I suspect that some individuality will remain.

[nosmelone]

It is my dream that one day Elders will stand in Makka and share the gospel of Jesus Christ. When I was Muslim, I loved the modesty and protection of my Hijab and Abaya. I never felt closer to Allah SWT (God) than when I was doing the prayers, never. I loved being protected from the men at Jumah.

I agree that the Holy Qur'an is not an easy book. You can't just read it like the BoM or the Bible. It is for meditation.

How would you advise someone who is new to the study of Islam who is interested in reading the Qu'ran to approach their first reading of the it?

[EllenMaksoud]

How would you advise someone who is new to the study of Islam who is interested in reading the Qu'ran to approach their first reading of the it?

First, keep in mind that the original Qur'an is written in classical Arabi. No one speaks classical Arabi now days. It takes a scholar to interpret it. An example is in Surah 4:34, where the Qur'an seems to plainly give the husband permission to beat his wife. In my experience, upon talking to Saudis, Iranians, Turks, and Jordanians they told me that the beating of the wife is with a pencil sized stick and there is no injury allowed. If you speak to a wahabist, he will something much more harsh, however.

Most Muslims I know will tell you that the Yusuf Ali translation is the best. It is not a story, like most of the Bible. Try to remember to keep what seem to be extreme statements in context, and you may have to read explanitory books to gain that context. In the Bible, Joshua is told to exterminate various populations, but taken in context with what was happening at that time, it is easier to see what Heavenly Father was trying to accomplish.

Please keep in mind that I am not expert in the Qur'an, the Bible or the Book of Mormon. I am simply devout. I have no university credentials. I only have experience.

[MormonMason]

How would you advise someone who is new to the study of Islam who is interested in reading the Qu'ran to approach their first reading of the it?

While I am not Muslim and never have been, but as one who has read the Qur'an multiple times, from several different Islamic perspectives (Wahhabi (Sunni with an extremist twist), Sunni, Shi'a, Ahmadiyya, Sufi, and so forth), I would advise reading it carefully and chronologically, always being aware that there is a concrete historical context underlying each Surah and parts thereof. So many errors of interpretation have been made from the work for failure to do this. Also, don't fall for much of the nonsense-talk about the principle of abrogation. One verse does not abrogate entire Surat. That sort of nonsense is what has gotten both extremists and critics of Islam into trouble. Edited February 27, 2013 by MormonMason

[MormonMason]

First, keep in mind that the original Qur'an is written in classical Arabi. No one speaks classical Arabi now days. It takes a scholar to interpret it. An example is in Surah 4:34, where the Qur'an seems to plainly give the husband permission to beat his wife. In my experience, upon talking to Saudis, Iranians, Turks, and Jordanians they told me that the beating of the wife is with a pencil sized stick and there is no injury allowed. If you speak to a wahabist, he will something much more harsh, however.

Most Muslims I know will tell you that the Yusuf Ali translation is the best. It is not a story, like most of the Bible. Try to remember to keep what seem to be extreme statements in context, and you may have to read explanitory books to gain that context. In the Bible, Joshua is told to exterminate various populations, but taken in context with what was happening at that time, it is easier to see what Heavenly Father was trying to accomplish.

Please keep in mind that I am not expert in the Qur'an, the Bible or the Book of Mormon. I am simply devout. I have no university credentials. I only have experience.

Or a finger. That is part of the interpretation regarding disciplining one's wife for obstinate behavior and rebellion. It is supposed to be more of a reminder of right action rather than an actual, painful punishment. Yusuf Ali is good. Muhammad Asad is another one. Both of these are quite scholarly if you get the editions that have many footnotes. Prepare yourself to be barraged by statements that are anti-Christian teaching in nature, and that denigrate Jesus as nothing more than a mortal man who died. My preference has been Muhammad Asad, followed by my close second preference, Yusuf Ali. Another advantage to Muhammad Asad is that it has English transliteration of Arabic words on the same page as the English translation and the original Arabic text. Muhammad Asad also expands and unfolds the multiple layers of meanings of the Arabic as best as one can into English, whereas Yusuf Ali tends toward the more literal in most but not all instances. There are others out there but these two are the best for new readers. Avoid like the plague those with a Wahhabi bent. These insert all sorts of parenthetical and bracketed interpretations directly into the English text, making for clumsy reading and often forcing the reader to follow Wahhabi thinking concerning the meaning of the Qur'an. Edited February 27, 2013 by MormonMason

[EllenMaksoud]

While I am not Muslim and never have been, but as one who has read the Qur'an multiple times, from several different Islamic perspectives (Wahhabi (Sunni with an extremist twist), Sunni, Shi'a, Ahmadiyya, Sufi, and so forth), I would advise reading it carefully and chronologically, always being aware that there is a concrete historical context underlying each Surah and parts thereof. So many errors of interpretation have been made from the work for failure to do this. Also, don't fall for much of the nonsense-talk about the principle of abrogation. One verse does not abrogate entire Surat. That sort of nonsense is what has gotten both extremists and critics of Islam into trouble.

It is also frustrating that Fatwas and Hadeeths given recently can conflict with the Qur'an. I am very interested in a group called "The Quranist Network" based in the UK. They have thrown out all the Fatwas and Hadeeths. It is a small group. I have not been able to find anywhere to contact them here in the US.

I've been trying to get at the reasons for such horrible conflict between Muslims and Christians. At first I thought that the Crusades caused it but then I found out that the Ottoman Turks invaded Jerusalem and cut off access to it to anyone but Muslims. I do not know much but it sure is interesting to read on the subject. To me, it seems that once the Ottomans took over, the face of Islam changed completely.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

LDS critics show a parallel between Joseph Smith and Mohammed and there non christian simularities. Has there ever been any studies on this ?. Thank you in advance.

In His Debt/Grace

Anakin7

LDS JEDI KNIGHT

I don't view then alike, bt in but one way; they both started a religious movement. As for their differences, one denied Christ as our Saviour and the Son of God...the other made it clear he is our Saviour and the Son of God.

[David T]

I am currently reading and very much enjoying the M.A.S. Abdul Haleel translation of the Qur'an published by Oxford. The hardcover edition contains the Arabic on the facing pages, but the paperback and kindle contain just the english. Very clear, smooth and modern english, with helpful (but not too many) notes.

[EllenMaksoud]

I am currently reading and very much enjoying the M.A.S. Abdul Haleel translation of the Qur'an published by Oxford. The hardcover edition contains the Arabic on the facing pages, but the paperback and kindle contain just the english. Very clear, smooth and modern english, with helpful (but not too many) notes.

While these Western translations may be held in high esteem by Westerners, it would be interesting to see what a Moderate Saudi or Egyptian Muslim would have to say about them.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

While these Western translations may be held in high esteem by Westerners, it would be interesting to see what a Moderate Saudi or Egyptian Muslim would have to say about them.

Having know a few, they don't think much of English translations.I had a British friend who said the same. I have a copy he gave me.

[Tacenda]

I don't view then alike, bt in but one way; they both started a religious movement. As for their differences, one denied Christ as our Saviour and the Son of God...the other made it clear he is our Saviour and the Son of God.

Thanks for this differentiation. I've struggled with the thought that we're too much like the Muslims in beng too legalistic, polygamy etc. Of course there are different of factions of both religions. This helped me to see it in a better light!

[canard78]

I don't have any comparisons, but I do appreciate this quote:

On 15 February 1978... the First Presidency, consisting of President Spencer W. Kimball and his counselors, President Marion G. Romney and President N. Eldon Tanner, issued an official statement regarding the Church’s position toward other religions. The statement reads:

“Based upon ancient and modern revelation, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints gladly teaches and declares the Christian doctrine that all men and women are brothers and sisters, not only by blood relationship from mortal progenitors, but also as literal spirit children of an Eternal Father.

“The great religious leaders of the world such as Mohammed, Confucius, and the Reformers, as well as philosophers including Socrates, Plato, and others, received a portion of God’s light. Moral truths were given to them by God to enlighten whole nations and to bring a higher level of understanding to individuals.

“The Hebrew prophets prepared the way for the coming of Jesus Christ, the promised Messiah, who should provide salvation for all mankind who believe in the gospel.

“Consistent with these truths, we believe that God has given and will give to all people sufficient knowledge to help them on their way to eternal salvation, either in this life or in the life to come.

“We also declare that the gospel of Jesus Christ, restored to his Church in our day, provides the only way to a mortal life of happiness and a fullness of joy forever. For those who have not received this gospel, the opportunity will come to them in the life hereafter if not in this life.

“Our message therefore is one of special love and concern for the eternal welfare of all men and women, regardless of religious belief, race, or nationality, knowing that we are truly brothers and sisters because we are the sons and daughters of the same Eternal Father.”

https://www.lds.org/ensign/1988/01/i-have-a-question?lang=eng

[EllenMaksoud]

Having know a few, they don't think much of English translations.I had a British friend who said the same. I have a copy he gave me.

I do not have academic credentials in Islam. I lived it for 6 years, so my reference is cultural. One example of the variance in the various beliefs is that every Muslim man I ever met will tell you that he can have 4 wives. Yet if one investigates about what the Qur'an actually says about it, the book starts out saying that man can only have one wife, but later, it says that because of the weakness of men, he may have 4. So, it is clear that one wife is Allah's SWT first preference. Were I a man, I would only have one wife, knowing what was the preference of Allah SWT.

[MormonMason]

I am currently reading and very much enjoying the M.A.S. Abdul Haleel translation of the Qur'an published by Oxford. The hardcover edition contains the Arabic on the facing pages, but the paperback and kindle contain just the english. Very clear, smooth and modern english, with helpful (but not too many) notes.

I'll have to take a look at that one in the near future. Thanks making mention of it. I do not think I have ever read a translation of the Qur'an by an Egyptian. Does he use the Egyptian text (regarded the most accurate) of the Qur'an as his basis for his English version?

[Questing Beast]

A sad story. I wrote a very lengthy paper on this very issue many, many years ago. Personal computers were in their infancy.

One day in Berkeley, after finishing the last sentence, I saved it. The computer failed at that precise moment, and I lost both original and back-up. And, though I took it around to various specialists there in Berkeley, nobody could recover it.

It's been twenty-three years. I'm finally in the psychological position where I may try it again.

That has to be one of the saddest stories I have ever heard. The closest I come to experiencing the same thing was saving my book files on Zip disc, and having the "click of death" manifest, thus wiping out access to entire chapters, which, thank goodness, were already in hard copy, and I could transcribe the lost parts. It took many, many months, a little at a time, rather like eating that proverbial elephant....