tyler90az Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 The part about loud laughter threw it over the edge. I do not understand why that part is in the Endowment from a spiritual point view. From a human creating the Endowment I can understand. Think I will have to study up on that more.Not trying to say too much, but that should be noted.
KevinG Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) The part about loud laughter threw it over the edge. I do not understand why that part is in the Endowment from a spiritual point view. From a human creating the Endowment I can understand. Think I will have to study up on that more.Not trying to say too much, but that should be noted.My understanding is that loud laughter and lightness of mind does not refer to a good belly laugh but instead getting to the point of "loss of control over ones judgement". Like when I have to remind the boy scouts telling jokes around the fire to keep it appropriate for a PG-13 audience. Edited July 20, 2012 by KevinG 1
Garden Girl Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 Going through Temple Baptisms and Confirmations is another good introduction to the Temple. I don't think we can depend on the curricula and HP group teachers alone to prepare people adequately for the unique and very symbolic and sacred experience.When I was an ordinance worker, one of my special assignments was to work in the baptistry for the youth temple trips. It was one of my favorite assignments... and I agree it is a very good way to introduce the youth to the temple. I loved how they would gather in their white clothes and their leader would give a brief talk about the ordinance and doctrine... the kids were always enthusiastic yet reverent. We also had a lot of "walk ins," i.e., people who would be travelling and would bring their family names with them so they could do the work, and we'd work them in with the youth. My favorite was when we'd get the family reunions where part of the reunion activities was to bring their family names to the temple as a group and do the work together, including the recordings and confirmations. That was when the Spirit was the strongest and the group closest as family.GG 4
Popular Post volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Popular Post Posted July 20, 2012 The part about loud laughter threw it over the edge. I do not understand why that part is in the Endowment from a spiritual point view. From a human creating the Endowment I can understand. Think I will have to study up on that more.Not trying to say too much, but that should be noted.I can see what you saying. If I had to teach about it, I would explain that loud laughter is not the volume or intensity of laughter, it is, rather, a flippant or frivolous attitude towards anything sacred. I would then use Psalm 1 to illustrate the kind of behaviour expected of us. I'd also bring up similar things when teaching D&C 59. 5
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 When I was an ordinance worker, one of my special assignments was to work in the baptistry for the youth temple trips. It was one of my favorite assignments... and I agree it is a very good way to introduce the youth to the temple. I loved how they would gather in their white clothes and their leader would give a brief talk about the ordinance and doctrine... the kids were always enthusiastic yet reverent.We also had a lot of "walk ins," i.e., people who would be travelling and would bring their family names with them so they could do the work, and we'd work them in with the youth. My favorite was when we'd get the family reunions where part of the reunion activities was to bring their family names to the temple as a group and do the work together, including the recordings and confirmations. That was when the Spirit was the strongest and the group closest as family.GGI had a wonderful experience like that in my youth, when I had the chance to do baptisms for the dead in the Preston temple. A Welsh family had collected names which went back quite a few generations, but there were very few people in the baptistry that day. I was fortunate enough to be able to do the lion's share. There was a tangible feeling that the spirit of Elijah was there. 2
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 My understanding is that loud laughter and lightness of mind does not refer to a good belly laugh but instead getting to the point of "loss of control over ones judgement". Like when I have to remind the boy scouts telling jokes around the fire to keep it appropriate for a PG-13 audience.Whatever you do, no Mel Brooks moments, and don't even quote the little ditty in All Quiet on the Western Front. 2
tyler90az Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I can see what you saying. If I had to teach about it, I would explain that loud laughter is not the volume or intensity of laughter, it is, rather, a flippant or frivolous attitude towards anything sacred. I would then use Psalm 1 to illustrate the kind of behaviour expected of us. I'd also bring up similar things when teaching D&C 59.Thanks
tyler90az Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I have read that some apostles believe the Temple stuff is literal. Such as, we need to perform a certain ritual to get into Heaven. That does not go with what I understood of the Temple Endowment. Is that an official belief of the church or is the belief it is just symbolism?
ERayR Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I have read that some apostles believe the Temple stuff is literal. Such as, we need to perform a certain ritual to get into Heaven. That does not go with what I understood of the Temple Endowment. Is that an official belief of the church or is the belief it is just symbolism?Symbolism is a representation of something real. 1
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I have read that some apostles believe the Temple stuff is literal. Such as, we need to perform a certain ritual to get into Heaven. That does not go with what I understood of the Temple Endowment. Is that an official belief of the church or is the belief it is just symbolism?There is an abstract symbolism, and then there is ritual symbolism, in which acts are performed that have symbolic meaning. The temple, as far as I can tell, is the later. 1
tyler90az Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I wonder how long it takes for my activity on this forum to be reported to my Bishop. When I was on lds.net it took all of about five minutes. Was suppose to go to Temple in August, guess I will have to wait another year.Thanks for the information though Volgadon, you have been a big help.
Popular Post mfbukowski Posted July 20, 2012 Popular Post Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) I can see what you saying. If I had to teach about it, I would explain that loud laughter is not the volume or intensity of laughter, it is, rather, a flippant or frivolous attitude towards anything sacred. I would then use Psalm 1 to illustrate the kind of behaviour expected of us. I'd also bring up similar things when teaching D&C 59.As an ordinance worker I get to hear discussions about "temple stuff" from a member of the temple presidency weekly, including a recent discussion about this.That is EXACTLY what he said.It has nothing to do with a good belly laugh!He also mentioned not using common temple phrases outside of the temple. Descending a stairway, wherever I might be, even just with my family, I would sometimes use a line we all know from the temple, in a joking way, and he specifically mentioned that that was not a good idea. He saw that as joking about sacred matters.I think he is right, and I have repented of that practice!"Light mindedness" is a general lack of reverence and respect for the sacred, and not being concerned with being open to revelation at all times. We are instructed to always have a prayer in our heart. "Light mindedness" is the antithesis of that. Edited July 20, 2012 by mfbukowski 6
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I wonder how long it takes for my activity on this forum to be reported to my Bishop. When I was on lds.net it took all of about five minutes. Was suppose to go to Temple in August, guess I will have to wait another year.Thanks for the information though Volgadon, you have been a big help.Wow, you were reported? I haven't seen anything horrible from you on lds.net. I really dislike tattle-tells. Oh well, on the bright side, you have a chance to better prepare. If there are any questions that can be discussed outside the temple, feel free to ask! I'll answer to the best of my ability. 1
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 As an ordinance worker I get to hear discussions about "temple stuff" from a member of the temple presidency weekly, including a recent discussion about this.That is EXACTLY what he said.It has nothing to do with a good belly laugh!He also mentioned not using common temple phrases outside of the temple. At the top of a stairway, wherever I might be, even just with my family, I would sometimes use a line we all know, and he specifically mentioned that that was not a good idea. He saw that as joking about sacred matters.I think he is right, and I have repented of that practice!"Light mindedness" is a general lack of reverence and respect for the sacred, and not being concerned with being open to revelation at all times. We are instructed to always have a prayer in our heart. "Light mindedness" is the antithesis of that.I have to smile, because I have very similar feelings on using temple phrases. One of the few things that really gets to me. 2
CASteinman Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 There is an abstract symbolism, and then there is ritual symbolism, in which acts are performed that have symbolic meaning. The temple, as far as I can tell, is the later.So being the latter, -- having symbolic meaning -- it would have abstractions as well?
mfbukowski Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I have read that some apostles believe the Temple stuff is literal. Such as, we need to perform a certain ritual to get into Heaven. That does not go with what I understood of the Temple Endowment. Is that an official belief of the church or is the belief it is just symbolism?There are many layers of understanding of everything in life. Just because something is symbolic that doesn't mean it is not also literal.This is very common in the scriptures where certain individuals, like Abraham and Issac for example, are seen as "types" for God the Father and the Savior.One gets to the point in life where one becomes convinced that it really doesn't matter much which is which- if these things ever happened or will happen or if they are symbols. It is the lessons they teach that are important.If you think about it, every sentence we utter contain symbols- called words- about reality as we experience it. The line between what is literal and what is symbolic is largely in the eye of the beholder. 3
CASteinman Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I wonder how long it takes for my activity on this forum to be reported to my Bishop. When I was on lds.net it took all of about five minutes. This seems pretty unlikely.
mfbukowski Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 Wow, you were reported? I haven't seen anything horrible from you on lds.net. I really dislike tattle-tells. Oh well, on the bright side, you have a chance to better prepare. If there are any questions that can be discussed outside the temple, feel free to ask! I'll answer to the best of my ability.Me too! I always shoot off my mouth, whether invited or not!! 1
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) So being the latter, -- having symbolic meaning -- it would have abstractions as well?I'm sure there is a better way of formulating what I'm trying to see. Abstract symbolism views the instrument, or, vessel, of the symbol as irrelevant. In ritual symbolism, the act, the vessel, is vitaly important. Take, for example, baptism. The mere act of raising an arm, reciting a fomrula and immersing in water won't save a soul. However, he who is baptised not... Another example, consecrated oil. We know that the oil itself doesn't heal the sick, that a priesthood blessing is efficacious even without it, if said in faith. Yet, we still use the symbol of anointing. Edited July 20, 2012 by volgadon 3
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 This seems pretty unlikely.I've been on it for a while, doesn't really surprise me all that much. 1
CASteinman Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 I've been on it for a while, doesn't really surprise me all that much.Really? How would anyone know who your Bishop is sufficiently to call him within 5 minutes?
tyler90az Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 Really? How would anyone know who your Bishop is sufficiently to call him within 5 minutes?My in-laws know my username and I do not do much to keep myself anonymous.
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 Me too! I always shoot off my mouth, whether invited or not!!What else was the internet invented for, if not that? 3
bjpascoal Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 The temple is a huge Catch-22.You go in not knowing exactly what specific covenants will be made. No one can tell you ahead of time what those covenants are unless within the walls of the temple. So really there's absolutely no way to prepare yourself for the temple. Everyone goes in blind and it's really not fair to the first time temple patrons. Sometimes they end up agreeing to the covenants more from peer pressure than from a desire to commit.
volgadon Posted July 20, 2012 Posted July 20, 2012 The temple is a huge Catch-22.You go in not knowing exactly what specific covenants will be made. No one can tell you ahead of time what those covenants are unless within the walls of the temple. So really there's absolutely no way to prepare yourself for the temple. Everyone goes in blind and it's really not fair to the first time temple patrons. Sometimes they end up agreeing to the covenants more from peer pressure than from a desire to commit.There is no way to prepare 100%, but there is still a good deal that can be explained beforehand. 3
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