The Nehor Posted January 26, 2012 Posted January 26, 2012 Well according to the OT institute manual, they would be at least Melchizadek Priesthood holders, which either makes them not Jewish religiously or is a form of Judaism which does not presently existHey man, what do I know? Being Jewish is not just a religious belief. As much as I love McConkie I am not sure he was right on this one.
mfbukowski Posted January 26, 2012 Author Posted January 26, 2012 Being Jewish is not just a religious belief. As much as I love McConkie I am not sure he was right on this one.Yes, I think I have heard that it is not just a religious belief.
rongo Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 A related "crazy idea" on my part is that the Jerusalem Center will be the prophesied temple in Jerusalem. No need to antagonize Jews and Muslims about the Temple Mount and Dome of the Rock; it can just be dedicated and become a temple ---- just like that.I know it's not technically on the Temple Mount (although within view of it, I've heard). It's on Mount Skopus, isn't it? It's close enough for me to qualify as a remarkable fulfillment if/when it happens.Similarly, I think the Church can buy the Temple Lot from the Hedrickites pretty much whenever it wants to, so we're pretty much just waiting for the word to come.Thoughts?
mfbukowski Posted January 27, 2012 Author Posted January 27, 2012 A related "crazy idea" on my part is that the Jerusalem Center will be the prophesied temple in Jerusalem. No need to antagonize Jews and Muslims about the Temple Mount and Dome of the Rock; it can just be dedicated and become a temple ---- just like that.I know it's not technically on the Temple Mount (although within view of it, I've heard). It's on Mount Skopus, isn't it? It's close enough for me to qualify as a remarkable fulfillment if/when it happens.Similarly, I think the Church can buy the Temple Lot from the Hedrickites pretty much whenever it wants to, so we're pretty much just waiting for the word to come.Thoughts?Wow- good idea! (Agree with you that it might not be doctrinal but it sure helps our story line )Isn't there something about the restoration of animal sacrifice? Is the Jerusalem Center properly "zoned" or whatever they call it there- to burn animals.Good thing the temple is not to be in Southern California- such a thing would violate every clean air law known to man in these parts! They even want to outlaw fireplaces hereabouts!
The Nehor Posted January 27, 2012 Posted January 27, 2012 A related "crazy idea" on my part is that the Jerusalem Center will be the prophesied temple in Jerusalem. No need to antagonize Jews and Muslims about the Temple Mount and Dome of the Rock; it can just be dedicated and become a temple ---- just like that.The rumor that the Jerusalem Center was specifically built to be transformed into a temple quickly has been kicking around since it was built. I doubt it is true.
rongo Posted January 28, 2012 Posted January 28, 2012 Why do you doubt it's true? I have no problem with that; I just wonder specifically why.
rongo Posted January 28, 2012 Posted January 28, 2012 Isn't there something about the restoration of animal sacrifice? Is there any other source for this besides the sons of Levi "offering again an offering in righteousness?" I can conceive of this having meanings other than animal sacrifice. I can't think of any reason why God would reinstitute animal sacrifice after the atonement was fulfilled.
mfbukowski Posted January 28, 2012 Author Posted January 28, 2012 Is there any other source for this besides the sons of Levi "offering again an offering in righteousness?" I can conceive of this having meanings other than animal sacrifice. I can't think of any reason why God would reinstitute animal sacrifice after the atonement was fulfilled.Yes, that's what I was talking about. I don't understand that passage either, but yes I am sure there are other ways it could be fufilled. But isn't that the whole reason that there needs to be a temple built in Jerusalem in the first place? I am probably showing my ignorance here; the "healing of the waters" from the Gihon spring could probably happen if there was a temple in that location or if it was elsewhere- is there something else I am missing here?
Maidservant Posted January 28, 2012 Posted January 28, 2012 Is there any other scriptural source for the "prophecy" the OP refers to other than Isaiah 51:17-20? Because I cannot recall another at the moment, so anybody can steer me in the right direction? And if this is the only one, it is not referring to two individual persons. In any case, there are already two sons in Jerusalem if you will think very carefully on that.
mfbukowski Posted January 28, 2012 Author Posted January 28, 2012 Is there any other scriptural source for the "prophecy" the OP refers to other than Isaiah 51:17-20? Because I cannot recall another at the moment, so anybody can steer me in the right direction? And if this is the only one, it is not referring to two individual persons.In any case, there are already two sons in Jerusalem if you will think very carefully on that.This is a quote from the article linked to in the OP: (I-6) Gog Will Be Thwarted by the Power of Two WitnessesOne question that arises as one studies the prophetic picture is, How could a nation as tiny as modern Israel stand against the combined armies of the world? The answer lies in an understanding of the role of two important participants in these great events.John the Revelator gave the most detailed picture of these two participants. They are called the “two witnesses,” the “two olive trees” and the “two candlesticks” ( Revelation 11:3–4 ). Latter-day revelation teaches that they are “two prophets . . . raised up to the Jewish nation” who will “prophesy to [them] after they are gathered and have built . . . Jerusalem” ( D&C 77:15 ).Elder Bruce R. McConkie wrote:“These two shall be followers of that humble man, Joseph Smith, through whom the Lord of Heaven restored the fulness of his everlasting gospel in this final dispensation of grace. No doubt they will be members of the Council of the Twelve or of the First Presidency of the Church. Their prophetic ministry to rebellious Jewry shall be the same in length as was our Lord’s personal ministry among their rebellious forebears.“The two olive trees, and the two candlesticks [are] symbols of the two witnesses; meaning, perhaps, that as olive trees, they shall provide oil for the lamps of those who go forth to meet the Bridegroom; . . . and that as lamp stands they shall reflect to men that light which comes from Him who is the Light of the World.” ( Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 3:509–10.)These prophets will have power to pronounce great judgments upon the earth (see Revelation 11:5–6 ).“They shall have power like Elijah who called down fire from heaven to consume his enemies, and who sealed the heavens that it rained not in all Israel for the space of three and a half years ( 1 Kings 17 and 18 ; 2 Kings 1 ), and like Moses by whose word blood and plagues lay heavily upon the Egyptians. ( Ex. 7 , 8 , 9 , and 10 .)” (McConkie, Doctrinal New Testament Commentary, 3:510.)Their miraculous power seems to be the force preventing Gog and his army from succeeding in annihilating Israel. Elder Parley P. Pratt wrote: “John, in the eleventh chapter of Revelation , gives us many more particulars concerning this same event. He informs us that after the city and temple are rebuilt by the Jews, the Gentiles will tread it under foot forty and two months, during which time there will be two prophets continually prophesying and working mighty miracles. And it seems that the Gentile army shall be hindered from utterly destroying and overthrowing the city, while these two prophets continue.” ( A Voice of Warning, p. 33.)Isaiah called these prophets “two sons” and said they were the only hope of deliverance for Israel because they would be “full of the fury of the Lord” (JST, Isaiah 51:19–20 ; see also JST, Isaiah 51:17–18 ).
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