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Letter from BYU Student


sjdawg

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I'm curious what everyone's thoughts are on this letter? Also, how do you feel it will be received by BYU Leadership and LDS Church Leadership?

http://universe.byu.edu/node/14309

I do not think this is true. I know of a player on the football team who came back from his mission but is no longer LDS (by choice) he is an evangelical Christian and simply went to his pastor for the ecclesiastical endorsement.

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I do not think this is true. I know of a player on the football team who came back from his mission but is no longer LDS (by choice) he is an evangelical Christian and simply went to his pastor for the ecclesiastical endorsement.

Had he already become an evangelical Christian prior to attending BYU after his mission or did he change religions while attending BYU?

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I'm curious what everyone's thoughts are on this letter? Also, how do you feel it will be received by BYU Leadership and LDS Church Leadership?

http://universe.byu.edu/node/14309

I think that there are plenty of faithful active LDS youth who would be happy to take their place and live the honor code. There are plenty of colleges and universities who don't have such codes. If a student doesn't like the rules get the out to someplace where they would be more comfortable and leave room for someone else who would be glad to have it and more appreciative of the subsidy the church provides for their education.

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I personally know some people who have lost faith in the LDS religion and then have not been allowed to continue their schooling. These are good men and women who still live the Honor Code but are either kicked out or not allowed to renew their Ecclesiastical Endorsements because they felt they should be honest about their unbelief.

I believe this policy is ethically wrong, religious discrimination and against the teachings of the LDS faith.

BYU's Honor Code states in pertinent part (emphasis added):

Students are required to be in good Honor Code standing to be admitted to, continue enrollment at, and graduate from BYU...Former LDS students are not eligible to receive an ecclesiastical endorsement (see Withdrawn Ecclesiastical Endorsement below).

...

A student's endorsement may be withdrawn at any time if the ecclesiastical leader determines that the student is no longer eligible for the endorsement...Excommunication, disfellowshipment, or disaffiliation from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints automatically results in the withdrawal of the student's ecclesiastical endorsement and the loss of good Honor Code standing. Disaffiliation is defined for purposes of this policy as removal of an individual's name from the official records of the Church.

Thanks,

Smac

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Had he already become an evangelical Christian prior to attending BYU after his mission or did he change religions while attending BYU?

He attended a year before his mission and then came home and changed while he was there. I do not know if he had to go to the honor board first. He is a senior now and is still on the team (he starts)he says he is "BYU worthy" and has not violated the HC.

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BYU's Honor Code states in pertinent part (emphasis added):

Thanks,

Smac

Smac, do you know if this also makes it mandatory for the student to be no longer eligible to attend BYU? Because this player I was speaking about is very vocal on his facebook page about how he is excited about his new "Christian religion." If this is so I fear he might be at risk of losing his athletic scholarship and expelled from school. He has never said anything negative about the church.

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Smac, do you know if this also makes it mandatory for the student to be no longer eligible to attend BYU? Because this player I was speaking about is very vocal on his facebook page about how he is excited about his new "Christian religion." If this is so I fear he might be at risk of losing his athletic scholarship and expelled from school. He has never said anything negative about the church.

Maybe starters on the football team are cut a little more slack??

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Maybe starters on the football team are cut a little more slack??

Not true. On any BYU team football, basketball etc. BYU adheres to the HC if it is violated it does not matter how talented you are. BYU has been consistent throughout. Just to be clear, I am a huge BYU fan and agree with BYU about HC violations.

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Not true. On any BYU team football, basketball etc. BYU adheres to the HC if it is violated it does not matter how talented you are. BYU has been consistent throughout. Just to be clear, I am a huge BYU fan and agree with BYU about HC violations.

How else would you explain the status of the player you mentioned then? The portion off the HC stated shows he would not be eligible to attend if he has in fact changed religions. I suppose technically his form of disaffiliation (joining another religion) may not have led to his name being removed from the records of the LDS Church.

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How else would you explain the status of the player you mentioned then? The portion off the HC stated shows he would not be eligible to attend if he has in fact changed religions. I suppose technically his form of disaffiliation (joining another religion) may not have led to his name being removed from the records of the LDS Church.

Good question. I don't know how it applies and it makes me wonder. Perhaps it is that his endorsement is pulled from his Bishop but he he got another one from his new Pastor. I hope he hasn't been hiding it from school, but that seems unlikely on how vocal he has been on facebook (again never negative about BYU or the church, just his excitement for his new faith). Perhaps after his mission he went through the HC board before he came back for his remaining years.

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I think that there are plenty of faithful active LDS youth who would be happy to take their place and live the honor code. There are plenty of colleges and universities who don't have such codes. If a student doesn't like the rules get the out to someplace where they would be more comfortable and leave room for someone else who would be glad to have it and more appreciative of the subsidy the church provides for their education.

ErayE, the author is saying the students continue to live the honor code. So "honor code" isn't a issue it seems.

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I was 1 of 6 LDS at my Highschool, and the only 1 of 2 at my Junior High (6th - 8th grade), 1 of 10 in a Church of Christ School elementary school, I attended a Catholic High school for a stint, where I was 1 of 4 LDS. On my mission I met other missionaries who grew up in "mormon" places, these missionaries seemed to have little knowledge of the Bible or other Religions (little knowledge at all or the only knowledge was standard "bashing" material).

IF BYU is kicking out students who formerly claimed to be LDS, AND ONLY for changing religious status, I think that just smacks of everything the LDS Church does not stand for.

IF changing religious status and being kickout ONLY because of that change, then it is just one more bit of ammo for many claims made against the LDS Church.

-----------------

smac thanks for the honor code info, I always knew there was some kind reason what the thought of attending byu made me not every want to attend.

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First of all do we really know the reasons that someone became ineligible? I knew lots of students who were totally inactive and remained at BYU. I think things like this lead to a lot of speculation and assumptions but unless we know the whole story we really can't judge. It could well be some of these students began proselytizing against the church while still obeying the honor code.

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First of all do we really know the reasons that someone became ineligible? I knew lots of students who were totally inactive and remained at BYU. I think things like this lead to a lot of speculation and assumptions but unless we know the whole story we really can't judge. It could well be some of these students began proselytizing against the church while still obeying the honor code.

I may not know the reasons why someone became ineligible but I can read the Honor Code that was posted earlier. It seems to support what the writer of the letter said.

1. All students must obey the honor code regardless of religion.

2. You can attend BYU if you are LDS and agree to obey the honor code

3. You can attend BYU if you are not LDS and agree to obey the honor code.

4. You can't attend BYU if you were once LDS and had your records removed from the church roll (for any reason) even if you agree to obey the honor code.

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4. You can't attend BYU if you were once LDS and have your records removed from the church rolls even if you agree to obey the honor code.

What I wonder is why anyone would bother to do this at that age given that you can just become inactive. That seems a drastic step for people who are still trying to figure out what to do in life.

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What I wonder is why anyone would bother to do this at that age given that you can just become inactive. That seems a drastic step for people who are still trying to figure out what to do in life.

Inactivity could easily also cause them to lose their endorsement depending on the rigidity of the priesthood leader.

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I'm curious what everyone's thoughts are on this letter? Also, how do you feel it will be received by BYU Leadership and LDS Church Leadership?

http://universe.byu.edu/node/14309

The football player replaced his LDS ecclesiastical endorsement with an EV endorsement before returning to school.

It doesn't read as though expulsion is mandatory.

Since the education is heavily subsidised, I respect their desire to ensure members primarily receive the benefit

Isn't there a different fee rate for non-members? It seems like that should be the primary change for students in good standing who obtained a valid ecclesiastical endorsement from another source.

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Inactivity could easily also cause them to lose their endorsement depending on the rigidity of the priesthood leader.

Do they even continue to check once one is admitted?

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Does this story which just came across the wire pertain to the subject at hand?

http://rivals.yahoo....rn=ncaab-328338

It is interesting but we don't know what the violation was. The letter was about individuals who are following the "behaviors" requirement by the honor code but simply no longer believe in the LDS church for whatever reason.

I have no idea what this basketball payers background is or if he is now or ever was a member of the LDS church

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