What If You Are Wrong

[DonBradley]

In the spirit of JRG's question for Consiglieri and other LDS, I'd like to ask folks to consider the question, "What if you're wrong?" What will happen to you if, upon death, you must face the wrath of an offended Zeus, upon whom you never called, and whose memory you overtly or silently mocked? How will you feel if the Olympian gods consign you to Tartarus to forever roll the same boulder up the same hill? To be eternally tantalized by grapes and clear water to satisfy your ravenous hunger and thirst, only to have them pulled out of reach at the last moment? Or to forever be writing the perfect post to crush your opponent's pathetic arguments, only to have him each time respond with obstinate indifference?

And if the punishments of pagan Zeus don't frighten you, just think how much worse the kindly Shepherd Jesus will torment you if you make honest mistakes in your belief in him! Can't you imagine him intoning over you at the Judgment Bar, "Father, roast them, for they know not what they do"? You'd better be scared of Jesus!

Don

[Tsuzuki]

I would point out that Joseph Smith had a Jupiter talisman.

[helix]

Or to forever be writing the perfect post to crush your opponent's pathetic arguments, only to have him each time respond with obstinate indifference?

Personally, I always wonder what life woud be like if the God of Chick Tracts was real.

[DonBradley]

I would point out that Joseph Smith had a Jupiter talisman.

Hey! Good point!

So maybe Joseph Smith and his followers are alright. But what about the hundreds of millions of traditional Christians who decry this as heathen wickedness? They annihililated the worship of Zeus. He has borne with them for nearly 2000 years. But he will bear no more. I just hope they will consider the awful potential consequences of refusing to trust in the gods in the one true (Greek) way before it's too late. Otherwise, they might end up in as bad a spot as they fear for their LDS neighbors.

Don

[Tsuzuki]

Hey! Good point!

So maybe Joseph Smith and his followers are alright. But what about the hundreds of millions of traditional Christians who decry this as heathen wickedness? They annihililated the worship of Zeus. He has borne with them for nearly 2000 years. But he will bear no more. I just hope they will consider the awful potential consequences of refusing to trust in the gods in the one true (Greek) way before it's too late. Otherwise, they might end up in as bad a spot as they fear for their LDS neighbors.

Don

Well, as a Scorpio with Pluto conjunct the Ascendant in my natal chart, I've always been more a fan of Hades. But Zeus is still welcome to hang out with us in the underworld.

[Bach]

aw I never thought about it like that before!

-------------

Also, Satan is kinda hot, when you think about it. Those well-trimmed brows, those dark, expressive eyes...

...I bet he has a real nice physique from torturing people continuously over the course of several millennia, too.

Bach- no variations of expletives, including using the asterisk for letters. ~mods

[DonBradley]

Good question, Helix.

Personally, I'm impressed with the cartoonist's satirical, if blasphemous, wit in opening the story with Satan sitting on the throne shining like an angel of light while he consigns people to eternal torture, and closing it with a true angel in Halloween garb waiting to receive them and teach them the truth about Jesus. It's almost as if he wants the reader to consider, just for a split second, what it would be like to hold the absurd view that God would send people to eternal torment while Satan would merely receive those God sends him. The man is a comic genius!

Don

[DonBradley]

Well, as a Scorpio with Pluto conjunct the Ascendant in my natal chart, I've always been more a fan of Hades. But Zeus is still welcome to hang out with us in the underworld.

If we're headed for the underworld...! I'm still hoping to be placed among the Pleiades.

BTW, Tsu, I'm a Scorpio as well. I have no idea what planet was ascendant at my birth; but if this determines which god we spend our afterlife with, I'm hoping it's the second planet.

Don

[Tsuzuki]

Also, Satan is kinda hot, when you think about it. Those well-trimmed brows, those dark, expressive eyes...

...I bet he has a real nice physique from torturing people continuously over the course of several millennia, too.

[Tsuzuki]

If we're headed for the underworld...! I'm still hoping to be placed among the Pleiades.

BTW, Tsu, I'm a Scorpio as well. I have no idea what planet was ascendant at my birth; but if this determines which god we spend our afterlife with, I'm hoping it's the second planet.

Don

Not everyone has a planet in conjunction with their Ascendant, though everyone does have a ruling planet or planets. My two are Venus and Pluto. If you want, I can look at your chart and tell you what I find. I'll just need an exact time and place of birth.

[DonBradley]

Am I mistaken, or is Satan in this comic strip depicted as having been disguised as Abraham Lincoln? It could also be Brigham Young--which might account for the 19th-century perception that Mormons had horns; but from the face I'd really have to go with Lincoln. Perhaps the cartoonist was a Southern Baptist.

[Avatar4321]

In the spirit of JRG's question for Consiglieri and other LDS, I'd like to ask folks to consider the question, "What if you're wrong?" What will happen to you if, upon death, you must face the wrath of an offended Zeus, upon whom you never called, and whose memory you overtly or silently mocked? How will you feel if the Olympian gods consign you to Tartarus to forever roll the same boulder up the same hill? To be eternally tantalized by grapes and clear water to satisfy your ravenous hunger and thirst, only to have them pulled out of reach at the last moment? Or to forever be writing the perfect post to crush your opponent's pathetic arguments, only to have him each time respond with obstinate indifference?

And if the punishments of pagan Zeus don't frighten you, just think how much worse the kindly Shepherd Jesus will torment you if you make honest mistakes in your belief in him! Can't you imagine him intoning over you at the Judgment Bar, "Father, roast them, for they know not what they do"? You'd better be scared of Jesus!

Don

Zeus always seemed like the type who wouldnt wait till death to make his displeasure known.

[consiglieri]

And if the punishments of pagan Zeus don't frighten you, just think how much worse the kindly Shepherd Jesus will torment you if you make honest mistakes in your belief in him! Can't you imagine him intoning over you at the Judgment Bar, "Father, roast them, for they know not what they do"? You'd better be scared of Jesus!

Don

When you put the issue in so artful a form, it does look like JRG's version of Christianity may itself contain a restoration of ancient things that had been lost. There really is a strange overlay of conflicting views regarding salvation, isn't there? And perhaps the "genius" of the Jack Chick tracts is that they bring out this dichotomy in Christianity in a stark and unmistakeable manner; so starkly that many Christians who subscribe to the doctrines nevertheless eschew the tracts themselves.

This was a masterful post, Mr. Bradley! And thank you for spelling my name correctly.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[Geaux LSU]

I would point out that Joseph Smith had a Jupiter talisman.

Speaking of this, what's REAL story behind this claim. I found this article but don't know how accurate it is (though it linked from FAIR):

This well circulated claim[2] finds itâ??s origins in a 1974 talk by Dr. Reed Durham. Durham said that Joseph "evidently [had a Talisman] on his person when he was martyred. The talisman, originally purchased from the Emma Smith Bidamon family, fully notarized by that family to be authentic and to have belonged to Joseph Smith, can now be identified as a Jupiter talisman." [3]

The source of the now famous Talisman story, which Dr. Durham bases his findings on, originated from Wilford C. Wood, who was told it by Charles Bidaman, who was the illegitimate son of Lewis Bidaman. Lewis was Emma Smith's non-Mormon second husband. Charles was born out of an affair between Lewis Bidaman and Nancy Abercrombie, which occurred while Lewis was married to Emma. Charles was taken in by Emma at the age of 4 and raised by her until she died 11 years later.[4]

Richard Lloyd Anderson wrote that the Talisman, or silver pocket piece as described in 1937, came up for sale when Charles Bidamon advertised items that supposedly belonged to Joseph Smith. One item listed was "a silver pocket piece which was in the Prophet's pocket at the time of his assassination."[5] Wilford Wood, who collected Mormon memorabilia, purchased it in 1938 with Bidamon's certificate that the Prophet possessed it when murdered. The affidavit sworn to by Charles Bidamon at the time of Wilford C. Wood's purchase was very specific:

"This piece came to me through the relationship of my father, Major L. C. Bidamon, who married the Prophet Joseph Smith's widow, Emma Smith. I certify that I have many times heard her say, when being interviewed, and showing the piece, that it was in the Prophet's pocket when he was martyred at Carthage, Ill."[6]

Anderson noted that Bidamon waited fifty-eight years after Emmaâ??s death to make his certification, which at the time of her death he was but merely a fifteen-year-old boy.

For the rest of the story

http://www.angelfire.com/sk2/ldsdefense/talis.html

[Sargon]

I'm not too worried about Zeus. I have concluded that if we are wrong, then all religions are wrong. If that is the case, then I might as well stay where I am, because I think it has the best chance of being right.

Sargon

[Doctor Steuss]

Hi Don,

This reminds me of a paper I had to do in High School. The teacher (a Jewish man) asked us to write a paper on whether or not the punishment that Sisyphus received was justified. In the paper, I cited multiple Old Testament passages on eternal punishment as a justification for the punishment. I got the paper back with a â??D+â? and a note from my teacher that read â??This is a pagan god weâ??re talking about here.â? I gave the paper back to him with a note in reply to his comment which read: â??Pagan god? Mine, yours, or theirs?â? He upped my grade to a â??B.â?

I just hope that G-d is what He wants to be (in lieu of what we want Him to be), and that what He wants to be (whoever He is) is someone who is compassionate and forgiving. I hope that He wants to be someone who won't "punish" us for what we don't know.

Then again, I often pay homage to Loki, so perhaps heâ??ll put a good word in for me (although heâ??s Norse, but hopefully the Norse gods hang out with the Greek ones on occasion -- maybe playing orbital golf with galaxies or something. Or maybe F

[Tanyan]

Personally, I always wonder what life woud be like if the God of Chick Tracts was real.

Jack Chick Publications is not that far from me. I always asked myself why in the picture of GOD [JESUS who is our final judge] that he has an anthropormorphic figure but "NO FACE". Well you cant have it all I suppose. Tanyan.

[TrashcanMan79]

Personally, I always wonder what life woud be like if the God of Chick Tracts was real.

Wouldn't the 'God of Chick Tracts' be the God of the Bible, as it is the Bible that Chick is quoting in the above panels?

[Tanyan]

Hi Don,

This reminds me of a paper I had to do in High School. The teacher (a Jewish man) asked us to write a paper on whether or not the punishment that Sisyphus received was justified. In the paper, I cited multiple Old Testament passages on eternal punishment as a justification for the punishment. I got the paper back with a â??D+â? and a note from my teacher that read â??This is a pagan god weâ??re talking about here.â? I gave the paper back to him with a note in reply to his comment which read: â??Pagan god? Mine, yours, or theirs?â? He upped my grade to a â??B.â?

I just hope that G-d is what He wants to be (in lieu of what we want Him to be), and that what He wants to be (whoever He is) is someone who is compassionate and forgiving. I hope that He wants to be someone who won't "punish" us for what we don't know.

Then again, I often pay homage to Loki, so perhaps heâ??ll put a good word in for me (although heâ??s Norse, but hopefully the Norse gods hang out with the Greek ones on occasion -- maybe playing orbital golf with galaxies or something. Or maybe F

[DonBradley]

When I was a young man I always thought 'THOR" Son of ODIN ROCKED !!!.

Me too! And given your avatar, I suppose Marvel Comics had nothing to do with this for either of us...

Don

[juliann]

In the spirit of JRG's question for Consiglieri and other LDS, I'd like to ask folks to consider the question, "What if you're wrong?" What will happen to you if, upon death, you must face the wrath of an offended Zeus, upon whom you never called, and whose memory you overtly or silently mocked?

I've been careful to not mock Zeus.

[Severian]

Wouldn't the 'God of Chick Tracts' be the God of the Bible, as it is the Bible that Chick is quoting in the above panels?

Jack Chick lived in an Alternate Universe but his work got smuggled into ours. It made sense in his Universe, but seems twisted and tinged with evil intent in our Universe.

[consiglieri]

When I was a young man I always thought 'THOR" Son of ODIN ROCKED !!!.

To me, my mighty Mjolnir!

This reminds me of a paper I had to do in High School. The teacher (a Jewish man) asked us to write a paper on whether or not the punishment that Sisyphus received was justified. In the paper, I cited multiple Old Testament passages on eternal punishment as a justification for the punishment. I got the paper back with a â??D+â? and a note from my teacher that read â??This is a pagan god weâ??re talking about here.â? I gave the paper back to him with a note in reply to his comment which read: â??Pagan god? Mine, yours, or theirs?â? He upped my grade to a â??B.â?

He probably just wanted to forestall a lawsuit from the litigious Dr. Steuss.

All the Best! And congratulations on your "B."

--Consiglieri

Me too! And given your avatar, I suppose Marvel Comics had nothing to do with this for either of us...

Don

No wonder Don and Tanyan are so cool.

Make Mine Marvel!

--Consiglieri (Italian for "Charter Member of FOOM")

[Tanyan]

And may the Priesthood be with you.

[Doctor Steuss]

He probably just wanted to forestall a lawsuit from the litigious Dr. Steuss.

All the Best! And congratulations on your "B."

--Consiglieri

The lawsuit happened anyway... for sexual harassment (at one time, I was a looker).

--Seuglieri (Greek for "Hasn't aged gracefully")