mfbukowski Posted January 27, 2022 Posted January 27, 2022 (edited) On 1/25/2022 at 2:38 PM, James 1 5 said: I think you would know if he has given you peace before you would be able to trust that he has. If you don't know it then I think you are just hoping he has. The feeling of faith comes with a sense of certainty to help you to be able to know something. Faith from God comes as a feeling of assurance to help you to know what God is giving to you, including a thought to help you know what God is thinking and trying to communicate to you. Many people read scripture without getting their understanding from God. I completely agree about the "before". Then I could trust with absolute certainty. I have had at least three experiences in my life that were instantly life changing and indescribable, and leaving no doubt that it was directly from the Lord. I have no idea why I received these experiences, but they were not from me. Edited January 27, 2022 by mfbukowski
mfbukowski Posted January 27, 2022 Posted January 27, 2022 On 1/25/2022 at 1:38 PM, Navidad said: So who or what is "the world?" Everything that isn't the LDS church? I long for the peace that passes understanding. I long for more of the Prince of Peace right where I am - Mennonite and all. My peace comes from trusting what God gives me, not from knowing it. I have a hard time understanding certainty as a fruit of the Spirit. Let me go back and check Galatians 5 again. Nope, it's still not there. Nah, you did fine. Ironically it is in James 1:5 "5 aIf any of you lack bwisdom, let him ask of God, that cgiveth to all men liberally, and dupbraideth not; and it shall be given him. 6 But let him aask in bfaith, nothing cwavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed." "Never wavering" = absolute certainty
James 1 5 Posted January 27, 2022 Posted January 27, 2022 16 hours ago, Olmec Donald said: I'm not saying sure knowledge doesn't happen, but imo it's probably not a good idea to carve things you "know" into stone, such that they become creeds - that is, fixed and immutable formal beliefs. Creeds are the thing that Joseph was told were an abomination. Creeds set limits beyond which God is not allowed to act or institute changes. An example would be the creed that revelation ceased with the completion of the last book in the New Testament. It was probably well-meaning and intended to elevate the New Testament writings to a place of honor, and was a logical explanation for what had actually happened, but it also effectively banned new revelation for many centuries. Imo as long as God "has yet to reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God", it's probably a good idea to make sure today's certainty doesn't become tomorrow's creed. Note also that Joseph Smith never established a creed, though if anyone was ever in a position to do so, he certainly was. When he wrote down thirteen statements of the fundamental doctrines of the Church, he wrote them as twelve "we believe" statements and one "we claim" statement, rather than as thirteen statements of certitude. Joseph Smith said that "One of the grand fundamental principles of Mormonism is to receive truth, let it come from whence it may." Imo THAT paradigm was one of his great innovations, and it's pretty much the opposite of creedalism. Thank you. You made several good points I agree with. I don't agree that a creed is necessarily a bad thing, but a bad creed is and creeds can often be bad, as when a statement is not true when it is believed to be true. I think to be safe we should not claim there are limits to anything in God's domain unless God has told us there are such limits, and we are certain it was God who told us. We should believe what God tells us. And we should be certain when God is with us. 2
The Nehor Posted January 27, 2022 Posted January 27, 2022 1 hour ago, James 1 5 said: Thank you. You made several good points I agree with. I don't agree that a creed is necessarily a bad thing, but a bad creed is and creeds can often be bad, as when a statement is not true when it is believed to be true. I think to be safe we should not claim there are limits to anything in God's domain unless God has told us there are such limits, and we are certain it was God who told us. We should believe what God tells us. And we should be certain when God is with us. And if your creed is simple like having to hunt a particular albino leviathan of the ocean in an act of vengeance that helps too.
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