bcuzbcuz Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 I didn´t know that the trade in humans was legal in Utah. A surrogate mother of twins recently handed over her 3 month old children to a Swedish company after receiving a rumoured sum of $40,000. The Swedish couple, who have now picked up their new babies, have paid a quarter million US$ for the whole process. Here in Sweden, this story re-ignites the debate about the sale of children. China, Thailand and India have forbidden the sale of children to Sweden but it is still apparently legal to buy children from the US (and the Ukraine). The original article can be read in Swedish from today's (26 October 2016) http://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/nybliven-pappa-kritisk-till-surrogatformedlarna The following is a Google translation: New father critical of the surrogate agency Mathias Liffner is the new father of twins who arrived via a surrogate mother in the United States. His view of the surrogate arrangement has been radically changed by the process and he is critical to a Swedish company now started up an agency for surrogate agency abroad. When the twins Bojanca and Jason was born three months ago by an American surrogate mother, it was a dream come true for their parents. - "My desire for children was extremely strong. I both ate, breathed and slept kids so that was the only thing that was important to me for a very long time", says Mathias Liffner while he cuddles with his daughter on his lap. At his feet is little Jason in a blanket and sucking noisily on the pacifier. The twins have different fathers. The children were added using a US surrogate relay. The eggs came from a donor in Cape Verde. Vitro fertilization was done in the United States and the children born of an American in Salt Lake City. Mathias and his partner are biological fathers to each of the twins.
JLHPROF Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 Disturbing. Kids as commodities. But still a lesser evil than the millions of abortions.
Calm Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 The Church strongly discourages surrogacy for a variety of reasons, this being one of them. They need clearer laws on this, imo. 3
ksfisher Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 9 minutes ago, bcuzbcuz said: I didn´t know that the trade in humans was legal in Utah. A surrogate mother of twins recently handed over her 3 month old children to a Swedish company after receiving a rumoured sum of $40,000. The Swedish couple, who have now picked up their new babies, have paid a quarter million US$ for the whole process. Here in Sweden, this story re-ignites the debate about the sale of children. China, Thailand and India have forbidden the sale of children to Sweden but it is still apparently legal to buy children from the US (and the Ukraine). The original article can be read in Swedish from today's (26 October 2016) http://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/nybliven-pappa-kritisk-till-surrogatformedlarna The following is a Google translation: New father critical of the surrogate agency Mathias Liffner is the new father of twins who arrived via a surrogate mother in the United States. His view of the surrogate arrangement has been radically changed by the process and he is critical to a Swedish company now started up an agency for surrogate agency abroad. When the twins Bojanca and Jason was born three months ago by an American surrogate mother, it was a dream come true for their parents. - "My desire for children was extremely strong. I both ate, breathed and slept kids so that was the only thing that was important to me for a very long time", says Mathias Liffner while he cuddles with his daughter on his lap. At his feet is little Jason in a blanket and sucking noisily on the pacifier. The twins have different fathers. The children were added using a US surrogate relay. The eggs came from a donor in Cape Verde. Vitro fertilization was done in the United States and the children born of an American in Salt Lake City. Mathias and his partner are biological fathers to each of the twins. I'm not sure I understand what the money was charged for. With a procedure like this I'm sure that there are buckets full of medical bills and legal fees that would need to be paid. Is that what the money went towards?
Calm Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 (edited) That is usually how any money being paid in the US is justified, medical, living, food, legal fees for adoption, etc.. never payment for the child itself. Many times it is legit, others not so much. Edited October 26, 2016 by Calm
bcuzbcuz Posted October 26, 2016 Author Posted October 26, 2016 28 minutes ago, ksfisher said: I'm not sure I understand what the money was charged for. With a procedure like this I'm sure that there are buckets full of medical bills and legal fees that would need to be paid. Is that what the money went towards? Are you talking about the money paid to the surrogate mother or the money paid to the agency? There's a difference of roughly 210,000 dollars US.
bcuzbcuz Posted October 26, 2016 Author Posted October 26, 2016 41 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: Disturbing. Kids as commodities. But still a lesser evil than the millions of abortions. Lesser evil? Because two is less than millions? Or because one child sold is a lesser evil than one child aborted? If those children being aborted were sold instead, would that be a lesser sin?
Calm Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 (edited) Utah surrogacy laws: http://dac-law.com/tag/utah-surrogacy-laws/ "Utah’s surrogacy laws were based on this model act and can be found in Utah Code Ann. §§ 78-45g-801 to 809. The law outlines requirements for both the surrogate and intended mother to be able to enter into a surrogacy arrangement. Requirements for the Utah surrogate: Must have had at least one prior pregnancy and delivery May not use her own eggs May not use her husband’s sperm Must be age 21 or older Must participate in counseling Must have been a Utah resident for at least 90 days prior to entering into the agreement Cannot be receiving Medicaid or other state assistance at the time of the agreement Requirements for the intended mother: Must show that she is unable to carry a pregnancy or give birth At least one of her or her husband must provide gametes Must be age 21 or older Must participate in counseling Must have been a Utah resident for at least 90 days prior to entering into the agreement Establishing a Surrogacy Agreement in Utah In Utah, a surrogacy agreement is legally binding as long as the legal requirements have been met. Unlike in other jurisdictions, the surrogate cannot later decide to keep the child for herself. The primary requirement is that the agreement be validated in court. This allows the court to ensure that the requirements for a surrogacy arrangement have been met. An agreement that has not been validated is not enforceable, and parental rights and obligations will be determined under Utah’s Uniform Parentage Act. The Uniform Parentage Act was a model law initially passed in 1973 to give legitimacy to children not born to a married mother and father. Subsequent amendments added provisions for identifying the legal parents in surrogacy arrangements and other special circumstances. A Utah Surrogacy agreement may provide for compensation to the surrogate, but it must be reasonable. This might include things like out of pocket expenses, someone to help the surrogate around the house late in pregnancy, and possibly compensation for unpaid time off from work. A “for-profit” type of arrangement would not be approved. While the intended parents have full parental rights after birth, the surrogate has full control over her healthcare decisions during the pregnancy. This may include, if medically necessary, the decision whether to terminate the pregnancy. One important note is that Utah’s requirement that the intended parents be married limits surrogacy agreements to heterosexual couples. While there is no explicit ban under the surrogacy laws, state law does not permit same-sex marriage, and thus a homosexual couple cannot meet the marriage requirements. Utah courts have previously ruled against equal parental rights for homosexual couples. Cost of Surrogacy Surrogacy can take two forms. Traditional surrogacy is where the surrogate’s own egg is inseminated, and gestational surrogacy is where a woman is implanted with an embryo that does not use her own eggs. Because Utah does not allow the surrogate to use her own eggs, it forces couples to use gestational surrogacy. Since this method requires medical treatment for two women instead of one, the costs can be as much as $13,000 — about 1.5 times the cost of in vitro fertilization. Uncovered Areas Although it may seem like Utah’s surrogacy laws are well-developed, they are still relatively new and don’t cover every possible circumstance. Most notably, the law allows a surrogate to terminate the agreement by providing written notice before she becomes pregnant without being liable. In at least two instances, this happened after the intended parents had spent thousands of dollars in counseling and other preparation costs and also cost them lost time and emotional distress. Other grey areas include who has parental rights if one or both of the intended parents die during the process, who makes medical decisions if health problems in the baby are detected prior to birth, and what happens if a court invalidates a surrogacy agreement based on previously unknown information." Might be out of date given the same sex marriage law is no more. Edited October 26, 2016 by Calm
JLHPROF Posted October 26, 2016 Posted October 26, 2016 (edited) 5 minutes ago, bcuzbcuz said: Or because one child sold is a lesser evil than one child aborted? If those children being aborted were sold instead, would that be a lesser sin? Yes. How is this even a question? Murder, especially of innocent blood, is a worse sin. Edited October 26, 2016 by JLHPROF
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