K-2 Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 "It is the duty of Elders, when they enter into any house, to let their labors and warning voice be unto the master of that house; and if he receive the Gospel, then he may extend his influence to his wife also, with consent, that peradventure she may receive the Gospel: but it a man receive not the Gospel, but gives his consent that his wife may receive it, and she believes, then let her receive it. But if a man forbid his wife, or his children, before they are of age, to receive the Gospel, then it should be the duty of the Elder to go his way, and use no influence against him, and let the responsibility be upon his head; shake off the dust of thy feet as a testimony against him, and thy skirts shall then be clear of their souls."(Joseph Smith, TPJS pg. 87)The above passage refers to the husband as "master of that house" and says that his permission is needed to teach the gospel to his wife or children. It does not say that permission from either husband or wife will suffice, or that permission is needed from a wife to teach the husband.It may be asked, where is there anything in all this [the Irvingite church] that is wrong? First. The church was organized by women, and God placed in the Church (first apostles, secondarily prophets,) and not first women; but Mr. Irving placed in his church first women (secondarily apostles,) and the church was founded and organized by them. A woman has no right to found or organize a church - God never sent them to do it.(Joseph Smith, TPJS pg. 212)In this passage, the Prophet gives an example of the influence of a false spirit - the Irvingite church. He makes clear that Apostles and Prophets lead the true Church, not women. He also says that God never sent a woman to found or organize a church. This would imply that if a woman were to try to lead or organize a church in a different way than the Apostles and Prophets direct, they would have to be doing so under the influence of a false spirit.Do you agree with these teachings from the Prophet? Why or why not?
thesometimesaint Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 (edited) Without getting into the Truth Claims of either religion. That is a cultural affection that may change with the Church. Like Paul's admonition for women to remain silent in church. I'd like to see any Priesthood holder try to enforce that now-a-days. Edited June 14, 2014 by thesometimesaint
Zakuska Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 (edited) Tts I agree.. it sounds very culturally based to me. Edited June 14, 2014 by Zakuska
The Nehor Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 The above passage refers to the husband as "master of that house" and says that his permission is needed to teach the gospel to his wife or children. It does not say that permission from either husband or wife will suffice, or that permission is needed from a wife to teach the husband. Only thing I can equate the phrase "Master of the House" with:
K-2 Posted June 14, 2014 Author Posted June 14, 2014 Lol! He's talking about private houses, not public ones.
ksfisher Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 "It is the duty of Elders, when they enter into any house, to let their labors and warning voice be unto the master of that house; and if he receive the Gospel, then he may extend his influence to his wife also, with consent, that peradventure she may receive the Gospel: but it a man receive not the Gospel, but gives his consent that his wife may receive it, and she believes, then let her receive it. But if a man forbid his wife, or his children, before they are of age, to receive the Gospel, then it should be the duty of the Elder to go his way, and use no influence against him, and let the responsibility be upon his head; shake off the dust of thy feet as a testimony against him, and thy skirts shall then be clear of their souls."(Joseph Smith, TPJS pg. 87)The above passage refers to the husband as "master of that house" and says that his permission is needed to teach the gospel to his wife or children. It does not say that permission from either husband or wife will suffice, or that permission is needed from a wife to teach the husband.It may be asked, where is there anything in all this [the Irvingite church] that is wrong? First. The church was organized by women, and God placed in the Church (first apostles, secondarily prophets,) and not first women; but Mr. Irving placed in his church first women (secondarily apostles,) and the church was founded and organized by them. A woman has no right to found or organize a church - God never sent them to do it.(Joseph Smith, TPJS pg. 212)In this passage, the Prophet gives an example of the influence of a false spirit - the Irvingite church. He makes clear that Apostles and Prophets lead the true Church, not women. He also says that God never sent a woman to found or organize a church. This would imply that if a woman were to try to lead or organize a church in a different way than the Apostles and Prophets direct, they would have to be doing so under the influence of a false spirit.Do you agree with these teachings from the Prophet? Why or why not?In the first quote the prophet seems to be speaking to the culture of his time. All prophets have done this. The revelations given to Moses spoke to a different culture and different time than did those given to Peter or Spencer W Kimball.The second quote seems to be saying that the restoration happened through the priesthood. I'm sure that if the prophet were to make similar comments today that he would choose words that speak to the people today.We can't look at either of these two quotes through the lens of presentism.
ERayR Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 "It is the duty of Elders, when they enter into any house, to let their labors and warning voice be unto the master of that house; and if he receive the Gospel, then he may extend his influence to his wife also, with consent, that peradventure she may receive the Gospel: but it a man receive not the Gospel, but gives his consent that his wife may receive it, and she believes, then let her receive it. But if a man forbid his wife, or his children, before they are of age, to receive the Gospel, then it should be the duty of the Elder to go his way, and use no influence against him, and let the responsibility be upon his head; shake off the dust of thy feet as a testimony against him, and thy skirts shall then be clear of their souls."(Joseph Smith, TPJS pg. 87)The above passage refers to the husband as "master of that house" and says that his permission is needed to teach the gospel to his wife or children. It does not say that permission from either husband or wife will suffice, or that permission is needed from a wife to teach the husband.It may be asked, where is there anything in all this [the Irvingite church] that is wrong? First. The church was organized by women, and God placed in the Church (first apostles, secondarily prophets,) and not first women; but Mr. Irving placed in his church first women (secondarily apostles,) and the church was founded and organized by them. A woman has no right to found or organize a church - God never sent them to do it.(Joseph Smith, TPJS pg. 212)In this passage, the Prophet gives an example of the influence of a false spirit - the Irvingite church. He makes clear that Apostles and Prophets lead the true Church, not women. He also says that God never sent a woman to found or organize a church. This would imply that if a woman were to try to lead or organize a church in a different way than the Apostles and Prophets direct, they would have to be doing so under the influence of a false spirit.Do you agree with these teachings from the Prophet? Why or why not? I agree with our up to date version that if either spouse objects to the others participation then participate they cannot.
Senator Posted June 14, 2014 Posted June 14, 2014 (edited) The above passage refers to the husband as "master of that house" and says that his permission is needed to teach the gospel to his wife or children. It does not say that permission from either husband or wife will suffice, or that permission is needed from a wife to teach the husband.Do you agree with these teachings from the Prophet? Why or why not? Yes, it is in harmony with The Law of the Lord as taught and illusrated in the endowment. Edited June 14, 2014 by Senator
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