Gaining All Knowledge, And Increasing Intelligence

[Ahab]

I've been impressed with a thought lately and I thought it would be a good idea to see what others think about this.

 

I once thought that to know everything about everything I would need to learn every little thing there is to know and somehow store that knowledge in my own mind, or spirit.  But what if the way to gain all knowledge about everything, and thus increase our own intelligence, comes through having access to all of the knowledge and information of all other people?  As long as we know how to sort out what is true from what is false and we somehow have access to the knowledge of all other people wherever they are. 

 

Like what if the personal urim and thummim people of celestial glory will get is a device that has access to something like an internet?  But with even more knowledge that people of celestial glory have?

 

I know what I want for Christmas, or as soon as I can get one.

 

 

[thesometimesaint]

I'm not sure that God needs an internet type device. But while we're in mortality we're dependent on technologies(From Clay Tablets, to Quantum Computers).

[Ahab]

I'm not sure that God needs an internet type device. But while we're in mortality we're dependent on technologies(From Clay Tablets, to Quantum Computers).

We're all the kind of being we refer to as God, but in this case I'll suppose you're referring to our Father.  And you're probably right.  He's probably matured to the point where his mind or spirit has absorbed everything that would appear in his personal urim and thummim, maybe because he used it so much when he had one and all of that knowledge is now in his memory so that he can recollect any portion of it whenever he wants.

 

But what if for us that urim and thummim will be a learning aid, until we get it all in our own mind (spirit) and memory?  Or what if whenever we want to know something we can communicate with our Father so that our Father can tell us what he knows?  A wireless type of "internet" connection, where we can interconnect with the mind of our Father through the Holy Spirit.

 

If we won't ever need any kind of machine, then why will we get one?  Referred to as a crystal, or a urim and thummim.

[thesometimesaint]

I don't know as God needs a U&T, but I suppose it is possible that the white stone we will be given will act like one. It could also be that the stone is just a stone, that acts like a focal point. Kinda like the glasses I have to wear. They don't have any knowledge in and other themselves, but they do allow me to focus on the information available. I'm just speculating here.

Edited November 26, 2013 by thesometimesaint

[Ahab]

I don't know as God needs a U&T, but I suppose it is possible that the white stone we will be given will act like one. It could also be that the stone is just a stone, that acts like a focal point. Kinda like the glasses I have to wear. They don't have any knowledge in and other themselves, but they do allow me to focus on the information available. I'm just speculating here.

The "information available" is what my mind was focused on when I started the OP.   As it is now we can communicate with our Father through the Holy Spirit and find out what he knows about something, even though we don't currently have access to all that he knows, but I think we can also benefit from learning from each other as each one of us shares what we have learned from our Father, similar to how we share our knowledge on this message board and in books and blogs some of us have written.  Even though some of the information in the world is false, we can learn to discern what is true, so all we need now is that ability to discern all the information we have, collectively, while we continue to learn even more.

[Darren10]

 

I know what I want for Christmas, or as soon as I can get one.

 

Yeah, my son wants a PlayStation3 as well.

[Rob Osborn]

We're all the kind of being we refer to as God, but in this case I'll suppose you're referring to our Father.  And you're probably right.  He's probably matured to the point where his mind or spirit has absorbed everything that would appear in his personal urim and thummim, maybe because he used it so much when he had one and all of that knowledge is now in his memory so that he can recollect any portion of it whenever he wants.

 

But what if for us that urim and thummim will be a learning aid, until we get it all in our own mind (spirit) and memory?  Or what if whenever we want to know something we can communicate with our Father so that our Father can tell us what he knows?  A wireless type of "internet" connection, where we can interconnect with the mind of our Father through the Holy Spirit.

 

If we won't ever need any kind of machine, then why will we get one?  Referred to as a crystal, or a urim and thummim.

I had a dream. In the dream I had this urim and thummim. It was indeed a white stone worn around my neck. In the dream it was used as a device that could transport me anywhere in the universe. My mission was to visit worlds/prisons where I was to rescue people who were good and in danger. I would hold the stone up to my eye and I would see things, people, places, etc. as they really were. I could then transport my being through some kind of conduit to that place instantly but it worked also on my faith for it to happen. I remeber very vividly going to one world where an evil group were trying to capture a person who was good or had changed from bad to good and there wasnt much time. I remeber telling him and maybe one other to touch me. As soon as they touched me I again held the stone to my eye and saw where I wanted to go and then my faith recharged and with no time to spare we were all transported to another world very very far away in the universe but it happened almost instantly through this vision conduit.

Not sure if this means anything to you but for me that dream was very real, vivid and felt like it actually happened in my past.

[Ahab]

I had a dream. In the dream I had this urim and thummim. It was indeed a white stone worn around my neck. In the dream it was used as a device that could transport me anywhere in the universe. My mission was to visit worlds/prisons where I was to rescue people who were good and in danger. I would hold the stone up to my eye and I would see things, people, places, etc. as they really were. I could then transport my being through some kind of conduit to that place instantly but it worked also on my faith for it to happen. I remeber very vividly going to one world where an evil group were trying to capture a person who was good or had changed from bad to good and there wasnt much time. I remeber telling him and maybe one other to touch me. As soon as they touched me I again held the stone to my eye and saw where I wanted to go and then my faith recharged and with no time to spare we were all transported to another world very very far away in the universe but it happened almost instantly through this vision conduit.

Not sure if this means anything to you but for me that dream was very real, vivid and felt like it actually happened in my past.

Very cool.  Your faith led to things you could know and then through your faith/knowledge you were able to go to someplace you knew was there through that faith.  And also to someone who you knew was there through the faith you had which led to that knowledge.  I can see how faith/knowledge could lead you/someone to someplace or someone else.  And maybe that was from a past experience you had before you came here.  I'm sure we knew and did a lot of things before we were born on this planet.

[Rob Osborn]

Very cool.  Your faith led to things you could know and then through your faith/knowledge you were able to go to someplace you knew was there through that faith.  And also to someone who you knew was there through the faith you had which led to that knowledge.  I can see how faith/knowledge could lead you/someone to someplace or someone else.  And maybe that was from a past experience you had before you came here.  I'm sure we knew and did a lot of things before we were born on this planet.

I will share one more dream I had. I had a dream i was in this big school and my teacher was the Savior. In our class we were learning the physics of planetary systems using miniature real 3d systems complete with real tiny planets, etc. In the dream I felt like I knew a lot about how planets work to make and provide life. At one point it was time for me to leave, perhaps to come to mortality (who knows), but I remember being given a 2d star of rather crude construction by the Savior to take with me. From this I gathered that during our mortality we would have knowledge but that it would be far vastly insuperior to what we already know and perhaps "viewed" differently through mortal eyes. I came away with the knowledge that we had such great access to real knowledge and we were ll so very very advanced intelligently and that this life isnt so much about gaining what we call "knowledge" as much as it was about gainging a knowledge of wisdom and experience and that in time, if we took our gifts, and magnified them through Christ by building his kingdom that we could once again attain all our real knowledge and truth of what we already know.

Of interest here is that God has given to each of us divine desires pertaining to different aspects of real knowledge of the which we were highly advanced with , some more than others, before we came here. Our life here is an extension of those gifts but on an almost entirely elementary level.

[Ahab]

Thank you, Rob.  I can also see that is true and that we have been told about those things, in principle, while we've been here.

 

Who knows, maybe some of us already know everything there is to know and we just can't remember how much we know.  Maybe only intellectually, or in theory, and what we're getting now is a deeper understanding of what it feels like to not know about something.   I'd hate to be ignorant forever, and I'd like to think that I learned a lot before I agreed to come here to learn more than I already knew.

[guerreiro9]

Yeah, my son wants a PlayStation3 as well.

You should be able to find one easy enough, they were released 7 years ago. If you mean a PlayStation 4, those are more difficult. If you get him a PS4 you should put it in a PS3 box and tell him you thought that was what he wanted. See if he even opens it before going bezerk.

-guerreiro9

[BlueDreams]

Hehehehe....celestial google. 

 

Ok, I'll be an adult now. I don't think it will be a device but a change in being and our environment.

 

DC 130 and revelation 2:17 and the temple are probably where I get my idea about this the most. The white stone is symbolic (as is the new name, for that matter) of an integral change that takes place in how we go about living, acting, and seeing things around us. It's not separate from us, it is us. Similar to how we are given bodies or how we were initially clothed with spirit. We don't think of those things as separate to who we are.

 

Likewise the white stone symbolizes a capacity given to us that was not capable previously. The story of the brother of Jared in Ether 3, represents this symbolically...from molting plain rock into white and clear rocks (cleansing and sanctifying) that were to be filled with the light of God (exalting/taking new life) to make their journey from one of darkness to one filling their vessels with light. The symbol of what is received through this is given in 2 ways: the Bro of Jared receives astounding knowledge and the promised land is given at the end of their journey.

 

The entire journey from leaving the tower of babel to their coming to the promised land can be one long symbol for our journey here on earth and the purpose of the temple in it.

 

With luv,

BD

Edited November 27, 2013 by BlueDreams

[Rob Osborn]

The white stone is a physical object that we will indeed hang around our necks

[pogi]

The white stone is a physical object that we will indeed hang around our necks

 

Is this knowledge based on your dream?  You should note that dreams in scripture are always symbolic.  There is no actual iron rod. 

[Rob Osborn]

Is this knowledge based on your dream?  You should note that dreams in scripture are always symbolic.  There is no actual iron rod.

A well thought out calculated answer. Was it a dream or a vision? I believe it was a vision of actual reality.

[pogi]

A well thought out calculated answer. Was it a dream or a vision? I believe it was a vision of actual reality.

 

You can believe what you want to believe, but I would caution against teaching it as factual doctrine as you did here:

 

The white stone is a physical object that we will indeed hang around our necks

[Rob Osborn]

You can believe what you want to believe, but I would caution against teaching it as factual doctrine as you did here:

Why? the church teaches that it is an actual object. In fact, they don't teach it as anything less than that

[Rob Osborn]

D&C 130:10. What Is the Destiny of All Celestial Beings?

Angels are in a state wherein they possess “all things for their glory” (D&C 130:7). The same is true of God and all exalted beings. Those who obtain celestial glory obtain knowledge of all inferior kingdoms, or “kingdoms of a lower order” than the one on which they live (D&C 130:9). They also receive, as verse 10 makes clear, a personal Urim and Thummim in the form of a “white stone.” This stone becomes the means “whereby things pertaining to a higher order of kingdoms” are placed in their possession (v. 10). Individuals are initially prepared for these great blessings by keeping God’s commandments and receiving an endowment in the house of God, as President Joseph Fielding Smith explained: http://www.lds.org/manual/doctrine-and-covenants-student-manual/sections-122-131/section-130-items-of-instruction?lang=eng&query=white+stone

[Ahab]

Hehehehe....celestial google. 

 

Ok, I'll be an adult now. I don't think it will be a device but a change in being and our environment.

 

DC 130 and revelation 2:17 and the temple are probably where I get my idea about this the most. The white stone is symbolic (as is the new name, for that matter) of an integral change that takes place in how we go about living, acting, and seeing things around us. It's not separate from us, it is us. Similar to how we are given bodies or how we were initially clothed with spirit. We don't think of those things as separate to who we are.

 

Likewise the white stone symbolizes a capacity given to us that was not capable previously. The story of the brother of Jared in Ether 3, represents this symbolically...from molting plain rock into white and clear rocks (cleansing and sanctifying) that were to be filled with the light of God (exalting/taking new life) to make their journey from one of darkness to one filling their vessels with light. The symbol of what is received through this is given in 2 ways: the Bro of Jared receives astounding knowledge and the promised land is given at the end of their journey.

 

The entire journey from leaving the tower of babel to their coming to the promised land can be one long symbol for our journey here on earth and the purpose of the temple in it.

 

With luv,

BD

So you think t;he change in our being  will be that we'll change from NOT  knowing everything about everything to the state of knowing everything about everything?  And do you suppose that change will happen all at once, or we will gradually learn everything there is to know?  And if gradually how would we learn?  All from our Father or from all  other  celestial  people, as well,  and possibly terrestrial and telestial people, too?   And how would we learn from each other? How would we communicate?  By physically going to each place where someone  is or by having some kind of communication device?  And would we only hear them, or see them too?

 

I'm thinking that to know everything about everything I"ll also need some way to learn about the experiences of other people, like Rob's dreams and whether or not things like that are possible, and true.  And maybe not  just true, generally speaking, but whether or not Rob actually experienced what he said he experienced, so that not only will I hear him and see him tell me that story but I will also see that it actually happened as he said it happened, perhaps even seeing it happen.

[pogi]

Why? the church teaches that it is an actual object. In fact, they don't teach it as anything less than that

 

I don't see where the churh teaches this, all I see is your interpretation of scripture.  You seem to be combining scripture (which is often metaphorical) and your dream (which is almost always symbolic) and teaching it as literal doctrine.  First, you said it was a dream, then you said that it was a vision.  Were you asleep or not?  Slumbering nocturnal visions would be appropriately termed, dream.  I don't see anywhere where it says they will be hanging around our necks, that is straight out of your dream and should not be taught as fact.  That is how Mormon folk doctrines get started.

 

The scriptures often use heavenly objects as metaphor for other things.  For example, the "many mansions" are not to be taken literally, but are given as metaphors for different degrees of kingdoms and glory.

http://www.lds.org/topics/kingdoms-of-glory

Edited November 28, 2013 by pogi

[omni]

You should be able to find one easy enough, they were released 7 years ago. If you mean a PlayStation 4, those are more difficult. If you get him a PS4 you should put it in a PS3 box and tell him you thought that was what he wanted. See if he even opens it before going bezerk.

-guerreiro9

Ha ha! Put it on YouTube and you could probably garner enough views to actually pay for the system.