Simple Question: Is Polygamy Still Church Doctrine

[soccermom32]

I wonder how the church would view the practice of polygamy if it were made legal. I suspect that it still wouldn't be allowed. But was it not for legal reasons that polygamy was discontinued in the first place?

Any thoughts on this?

[guerreiro9]

I only have two posts and I found a typo in both of them. So much for the start of my illustrious career on the forum.

Sine Saw Square,

You have to either be a physicist or an electrical engineer given your screen name. I don't know many people who know what a square or saw wave are otherwise. I've probably spent too much time in front of a signal generator, but your screen name and image made me chuckle.

[Craig Paxton]

Marriage is a mortal construct. Sealing is eternal.

Then being a mortal construct...the church should have no difficulty with a gay mortal construct marriage right?

[Sine Saw Square]

Wish I knew something useful like electrical engineering. I came by the name through my hobby of programming synthesizers and producing electronic music.

Don't worry bout the typos we all mak them.

[Craig Paxton]

To Craig, if the Church were to again institute polygamy in all its glory,would you then rejoin the saints and live the laws as defined by the Brethern? If so, then perhaps we should petition Salt Lake to quickly follow your suggestion.That way they would be guided by the Saviors admonition to leave the 90 and 9 and seek the lost sheep......dern the torpedoes.

Being a polygamist would be my version of hell. While I dearly love my wife...one wife is enough for me...did I mention that I dearly love her?

[Craig Paxton]

Wish I knew something useful like electrical engineering. I came by the name through my hobby of programming synthesizers and producing electronic music.

Don't worry bout the typos we all mak them.

True true...but I'm the only one who seems to get my misspelling pointed out....

[Hamba Tuhan]

I wonder how the church would view the practice of polygamy if it were made legal. I suspect that it still wouldn't be allowed. But was it not for legal reasons that polygamy was discontinued in the first place?

Any thoughts on this?

Branches and wards of the Church exist in a number of countries where polygamy is legal, including one in which I previously lived. Nothing changes. Craig's assertions notwithstanding, monogamy is the default setting for Saints unless commanded otherwise, as clearly taught in the Book of Mormon.

Insisting that creating the mere potential for multiple marriage relationships to survive after death is somehow the same as practicing polygamy is disingenuous at best.

[smac97]

A simple yes or no will do...

Well, maybe not, as your question is somewhat ambiguous.

and I say a resounding YES... polygamy is still church doctrine and is still practiced in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

How do you account for the Manifesto, then? Particularly the part that states: "I (Wilford Woodruff), therefore, as President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, do hereby, in the most solemn manner, declare that these charges are false. We are not teaching polygamy or plural marriage, nor permitting any person to enter into its practice, and I deny that either forty or any other number of plural marriages have during that period been solemnized in our Temples or in any other place in the Territory."

And this part: "Inasmuch as laws have been enacted by Congress forbidding plural marriages, which laws have been pronounced constitutional by the court of last resort, I hereby declare my intention to submit to those laws, and to use my influence with the members of the Church over which I preside to have them do likewise."

And this part: "There is nothing in my teachings to the Church or in those of my associates, during the time specified, which can be reasonably construed to inculcate or encourage polygamy; and when any Elder of the Church has used language which appeared to convey any such teaching, he has been promptly reproved. And I now publicly declare that my advice to the Latter-day Saints is to refrain from contracting any marriage forbidden by the law of the land."

So why all the denials and attempts to distance themselves from this foundational doctrine?

Please clarify what you mean when you say that "polygamy is still church doctrine and is still practiced in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints."

Is it still doctrine? Well, yes. We believe God can institute it among His children from time to time, and forbid it at other times.

Is it "still practiced?" Nope. So you'll need to explain your assertion to the contrary.

Why not own it and proudly proclaim to all of the world this most wonderful doctrine of God's one true church?

We don't make burnt offerings, even though that practice is "doctrinal." We do not spend much time on it for the same reason as we don't presently dwell on polygamy: It's not a law currently in force among the Saints.

So what say you...good and faithful member/posters of the MD&D?

I say I'm suspicious of this thread.

Thanks,

-Smac

[Calm]

We are not teaching polygamy or plural marriage

Perhaps this declaration influences how much time the Church leadership feel it is appropriate to spend on the topic today.

[smac97]

Ok I'll lift the nuance ban...nuance away. My point was that it seems to me that the church is somewhat embarrassed of its polygamist past

I think there is probably some embarrassment over polygamy amongst the church membership. It's a challenging doctrine and was a challenging practice.

But are the Brethren "embarrassed?" I see no evidence of that. However, i think there are folks like you who like to harp on it when it does not have much relevant the LDS Church in 2012.

Are Jews harangued for their prior pactice of burnt offerings? I suspect not, and would be a bit puzzled about someone making an issue of this practice in 2012.

For that matter, are Jews and non-LDS Christians constantly reminded of their previous history with polygamy? I doubt it.

and its current polygamist practices done even today in temples throughout the world...

It is misleading and dishonest to make such statements. Stop it.

I guess...I'd would just like to see the institutional church take ownership of this practice and proudly claim it.

Do you have the same expectation of Jews and their prior practice of burnt offerings? How 'bout Jews and Christians and their "ownership" of polygamy? I suspect you don't have the same expectations as to other religious groups, so why us?

There are, if memory serves me correctly, two current members of the 12 apostles who are polygamist today...Nelson and Oaks.

It is misleading and dishonest to make such statements. Stop it.

My grandfather was a polygamist...as currently practiced and authorized by the church...as are several members of my former ward.

It is misleading and dishonest to make such statements. Stop it.

The concept of Celestial/polygamist marriage is a key doctrine of the church...I'm just surprised that the concept of multiple eternal wives isn't more fully celebrated/taught in the church....rather than being hide under a bushel.

I do not believe you are speaking in good faith. You are attempting to mislead.

Thanks,

-Smac

Edited July 11, 2012 by smac97

[smac97]

This ^^^^^^ We obtained a sealing clearance for a man in our ward who was sealed to two other living women (civil divorces, both of them). While the CHI says that this cannot be done, I am aware of other exceptions to this. There is nothing that the keys of the President of the Church cannot authorize, as an exception.

It is silly to claim that these people, or Mark Beesley, are polygamists. The connotation of bringing up polygamy is simultaneous cohabitation.

Yep. Hence the dishonesty inherent in the OP's question.

-Smac

[smac97]

Then being a mortal construct...the church should have no difficulty with a gay mortal construct marriage right?

Huh? Where'd you get that idea?

The more of your posts I read, the less inclined I am to give you the benefit of the doubt. You are not participating here in good faith.

-Smac

This does appear to be a bait and switch thread with no purpose other than to pick fights.

[Craig Paxton]

How do you account for the Manifesto, then? Particularly the part that states: "I (Wilford Woodruff), therefore, as President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, do hereby, in the most solemn manner, declare that these charges are false. We are not teaching polygamy or plural marriage, nor permitting any person to enter into its practice, and I deny that either forty or any other number of plural marriages have during that period been solemnized in our Temples or in any other place in the Territory."

Well we know that that statement wasn't entirely true don't we....ever heard of the second manifesto? It wouldn't have been necessary if polygamy had actually stopped in 1890 as is the popularly held belief.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Craig Paxton