CQUIRK Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Here.A new book digs into the Republican frontrunner's controversial history, including his time as a Mormon lay leader in the 1980sMitt Romney's Mormon faith, long considered a potential issue in his presidential campaign, came under scrutiny this week whenVanity Fair published excerpts from an upcoming book that delves into Mitt's history as a lay leader in the church. The Real Romney, authored by Boston Globe reporters Michael Kranish and Scott Helman, suggests that Mitt once threatened a single mother with excommunication if she didn't give her soon-to-be-born baby up for adoption — an account the Republican frontrunner denies. Here, a brief guide to this unsettling story:What does the book claim? In the early 1980s, Romney wasserving as bishop of a Mormon congregation near Boston. Peggie Hayes, a 23-year-old divorced single mother, became pregnant with her second child. Knowing she needed help, Romney arranged for Hayes to get odd jobs from other church members. But as bishop, Romney also bore the responsibility of briefing Hayes on church doctrine. As quoted in the book, she claims he showed up at her apartment and encouraged her to give her baby to the church's adoption agency. According to Hayes, Romney said: "This is what the church wants you to do, and if you don't, then you could be excommunicated."Excommunication is a big deal, right? It sure is. "This is not playing around," Hayes said. "This is not like, 'You don't get to take Communion.' This is like, 'You will not be saved. You will never see the face of God.'"Does Hayes have an ax to grind? That's unclear. She does have some nice things to say about Romney. But in the end, Hayes had the baby — and left the church shortly afterward. When her child needed a risky surgery, Hayes says she called Romney for a blessing, and he dispatched two church members who Hayes didn't know. "I needed him," Hayes said. "It was very significant that he didn't come."Did this all really happen? Romney says it didn't. And as bishop of Hayes' ward, Romney didn't have the power to kick anyone out of the church. That power belongs to a council of church officials. The church does encourage adoption in cases where "a successful marriage is unlikely," the book says. But keeping a child to raise in a single-parent home isn't considered a sin grave enough towarrant getting booted from the church, which the faithful believe cuts off the path to heaven.Will the story affect Romney's campaign? It probably won't help. Romney has been careful to avoid saying or doing anything that could stir up the already pervasive uneasiness about Mormonism in the general population, particularly among evangelical Christians who make up an important part of the GOP's base. And it won't help him with skeptical women voters, either, says Eeasha Pandit atFeministing. "First, he's not sure about contraception. And now this. Regardless of whether this is fully accurate... if Romney makes it to the general election, he's going to have to do some serious work to convince any women at all to vote for him."I think the main question of this topic should be- is this Peggie Hayes a anti-Mormon liar, or someone that's lying for political, or even financial gain?
Jeff K. Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 The article seems balanced enough. It brings out the discrepencies in the story.
Jeff K. Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Or maybe someone that remembers things the way she wants to. I can see a misinterpretation which doesn't necessarily make her malicious.
CQUIRK Posted January 12, 2012 Author Posted January 12, 2012 Even malicious people can behave, or appear, otherwise, Jeff.
LeSellers Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 This is old news. I remember hearing it years ago.Lehi
CQUIRK Posted January 12, 2012 Author Posted January 12, 2012 Does Martha Nibley Beck seem malicious at first glance, Jeff?
CQUIRK Posted January 12, 2012 Author Posted January 12, 2012 This is old news. I remember hearing it years ago.With Romney running for president- anything bad from before will get recycled.
LeSellers Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Does Martha Nibley Beck seem malicious at first glance, Jeff?Well, anyone named "Beck" is malicious, as we all know. Lehi
frankenstein Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 How does a unmarried single woman get pregnant? Perhaps the episode did happen but not as remembered. Being excommunicated may have been raised but in relation to premarital sex. Though even if the around is true I do not see as being of much concern for romney's electability
CQUIRK Posted January 12, 2012 Author Posted January 12, 2012 How does a unmarried single woman get pregnant? Perhaps the episode did happen but not as remembered. Being excommunicated may have been raised but in relation to premarital sex. Though even if the around is true I do not see as being of much concern for romney's electabilityI 85% agree with you.
Jeff K. Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Does Martha Nibley Beck seem malicious at first glance, Jeff?How could I know given I do not have a following:1-A fimiliarity as to who she is2-Knowledge of her past history3-Additional evidence that contradicts her4-Personal aquaintance and knowledge of how she reacts to crisisFirst glance I would say she is adamant and mistaken.
Pahoran Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 How does a unmarried single woman get pregnant? Perhaps the episode did happen but not as remembered. Being excommunicated may have been raised but in relation to premarital sex. Though even if the around is true I do not see as being of much concern for romney's electabilityWhen you're right, you're right, and for once I think you may be right.However, what is more likely to get this person Victim[tm] status and instant sympathy?"We had a wide-ranging discussion on a number of subjects, including the need for sincere repentance, the possibility of Church discipline to assist in that process, and the advisability of placing my child for adoption so that both she and I would have the best possible prospects going forward;" or"He threatened to excommunicate me if I didn't give up my baby?"Regards,Pahoran
Pahoran Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 However, what is more likely to get this person Victim[tm] status and instant sympathy?"We had a wide-ranging discussion on a number of subjects, including the need for sincere repentance, the possibility of Church discipline to assist in that process, and the advisability of placing my child for adoption so that both she and I would have the best possible prospects going forward;" or"He threatened to excommunicate me if I didn't give up my baby?"And the next question is: which of the above tales is likely to sell the most books?Regards,Pahoran
Avatar4321 Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 How does a unmarried single woman get pregnant? Perhaps the episode did happen but not as remembered. Being excommunicated may have been raised but in relation to premarital sex. Though even if the around is true I do not see as being of much concern for romney's electabilityThat's what I'm thinking.And why exactly would it be odd for him to send her home teachers to bless her? The man is busy.
CQUIRK Posted January 13, 2012 Author Posted January 13, 2012 You hit the nail on the head twice, Pahoran!
Calm Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 That's what I'm thinking.And why exactly would it be odd for him to send her home teachers to bless her? The man is busy.It also would be a good opportunity for home teachers to ask what else she needed at that time which is their stewardship and not the bishop's.I have known women who have chosen to have a closer relationship with their bishop than their home teachers and in general it hasn't turned out well. It is a good idea to expand a support system rather than being primarily dependent on one man that is trying to be available to hundreds of members.
thesometimesaint Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 calmoriah:I've have two times when my Bishop was my hometeacher.
Jeff K. Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 I think desiring a closer relationship with a bishop vs hometeacher or others may stem from an instincto to orbit around the powerful. Especially if one feels less powerful or powerless.
CQUIRK Posted January 13, 2012 Author Posted January 13, 2012 So maybe she's pulling this stunt for her own satisfaction, whether financial, political, or even anti-Mormon?
noel00 Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 I watched Romney on the view greeting the women with the perfunctionary handshake. Most men give each a short hug and kiss on the cheek. Romney has been described as "wooden". He looks even more awkward when trying to look friendly. The video put out by a Pac supporting Gingrich paints him as a ruthless businessman who cares little for the people who lose their jobs as a result.http://www.webcasts.com/kingofbain/Obama worked as a community organiser helping people on the ground while Romney worked to maximise profits for investors meantime getting rich himself and causing people to lose jobs.. This is not "envy". I thought employers would see the benefits of people having decent paying jobs, the money they get is used to purchase the goods produced by businesses.
Daniel Peterson Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 1. The Gingrich video is an inaccurate, ideologically-laden, lethally biased piece of trash. And it's been widely recognized as such.2. I would bet, myself, that Romney's capitalism has done a whole lot more good for more people than did Obama's "community organizing."
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