Discerning Spirits

[inquiringmind]

Hello all.

I'd like as many LDS scripture references (book of Mormon, D&C, Pearl of Great Price) as possible on how we discern whether a spirit is from God.

Also, anything Joseph, other first presidents, or GA's have said on the subject.

Is it always easy, or is it sometimes hard?

Please provide any references you can.

Thank you..

Edited July 3, 2011 by inquiringmind

[Palerider]

I'd like as many LDS scripture references (book of Mormon, D&C, Pearl of Great Price) as possible on how we discern whether a spirit is from God.

Also, anything Joseph, other first presidents, or GA's have said on the subject.

Please help.

Thank you..

Hey inquiring mind,

It seems to me that your education in all things Mormon might be enhanced if you were to apply yourself a little more assertively to your own research. For instance if one simply went to lds.org and found the "scriptures" section on their menu and then typed in "discern" in the search section, that would be a great place to start and you would probably have better retention of what you read.

The way you have stated your desires above almost sounds more as if you're ordering at a restaurant. "All the scriptures on discerning spirits please and an order of fries on the side......."

I'm not trying to be mean here, just pointing out that a modicum of self initiative will go along ways.

Good luck!

[Nathair/|\]

If something entices you to do good and believe in Christ, it is of God. If it entices you to do evil and not believe in Christ it is of the devil, according to Moroni.

[Doctor Ninja]

Inquringmind,

Despite what critics or pseudo-mormons admonish you to do. I encourage you to continue in the way that YOU feel is the most appropriate to gain understanding.

The gift of discerning of spirits allows the faithful to distinguish between the influence of good and evil spirits.

When you experience them both, the feelings are a night and day difference and therefore it becomes easier to distinguish.

Edited July 3, 2011 by Doctor Ninja

[Palerider]

Inquringmind,

Despite what critics or pseudo-mormons admonish you to do. I encourage you to continue in the way that YOU feel is the most appropriate to gain understanding.

The gift of discerning of spirits allows the faithful to distinguish between the influence of good and evil spirits.

D&C 8:9

But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.

2 timothy 2:15

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Underlining added by me. It doesn't hurt to stretch one's self. It also keeps one from relying on the arm of flesh and pseudo-prophets.

[Nathair/|\]

If something entices you to do good and believe in Christ, it is of God. If it entices you to do evil and not believe in Christ it is of the devil, according to Moroni.

Moroni 7:16-7

[Doctor Ninja]

D&C 8:9

But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.

2 timothy 2:15

Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Underlining added by me. It doesn't hurt to stretch one's self. It also keeps one from relying on the arm of flesh and pseudo-prophets.

How predictable. Slide in a "pot shot" towards our current leaders.

Edit: Doctor Ninja. You need to review the board guidelines.

[inquiringmind]

I recall something about a seed, and feeling it grow.

I'm sure it's in the BOM, but I don't know where.

Anyone?

[Doctor Ninja]

I recall something about a seed, and feeling it grow.

I'm sure it's in the BOM, but I don't know where.

Anyone?

Alma 32:

[Palerider]

How predictable. Slide in a "pot shot" towards our current leaders.

At least you have "the philosophies of men, mingled with scriptures" down to the T!

I'm sorry, I believe you incorrectly cast the first stone. Please check the mirror a little more closely.......perhaps if you removed the mask? It allows one to see oneself more clearly.

[inquiringmind]

Hey inquiring mind,

It seems to me that your education in all things Mormon might be enhanced if you were to apply yourself a little more assertively to your own research. For instance if one simply went to lds.org and found the "scriptures" section on their menu and then typed in "discern" in the search section, that would be a great place to start and you would probably have better retention of what you read.

The way you have stated your desires above almost sounds more as if you're ordering at a restaurant. "All the scriptures on discerning spirits please and an order of fries on the side......."

I'm not trying to be mean here, just pointing out that a modicum of self initiative will go along ways.

Good luck!

I tried going to lds.orgs scripture section and typing in "discerning," and got a lot of irrelevant results (and the few relevant results were only those that included the words "discerning," discern," etc.)

Mosiah 7, and Alma 32 are the kinds of passages I'm interested in, and neither contains the word "discerning."

I'm sure there's more on this in the BOM, and other LDS sources, and I once again ask you all to post anything that comes to mind.

Thank you.

Edited July 3, 2011 by inquiringmind

[alter idem]

Hey inquiring mind,

It seems to me that your education in all things Mormon might be enhanced if you were to apply yourself a little more assertively to your own research. For instance if one simply went to lds.org and found the "scriptures" section on their menu and then typed in "discern" in the search section, that would be a great place to start and you would probably have better retention of what you read.

The way you have stated your desires above almost sounds more as if you're ordering at a restaurant. "All the scriptures on discerning spirits please and an order of fries on the side......."

I'm not trying to be mean here, just pointing out that a modicum of self initiative will go along ways.

Good luck!

I have to agree with Palerider on this--I don't see how it will help in your quest to understand this if others do the searching. The 'search' is a large part of coming to understand something--especially when one is talking about spiritual things. Even when it comes to secular topics, the teacher always learns more than the students--because they put in the effort.

I assume you've got a set of LDS scriptures. I'd suggest you look up 'discern' in the Index and the Topical guide--you'll find quite a few references.

Then I think you'll know what you want to discuss on this topic.

[Doctor Ninja]

I have to agree with Palerider on this--I don't see how it will help in your quest to understand this if others do the searching. The 'search' is a large part of coming to understand something--especially when one is talking about spiritual things. Even when it comes to secular topics, the teacher always learns more than the students--because they put in the effort.

I assume you've got a set of LDS scriptures. I'd suggest you look up 'discern' in the Index and the Topical guide--you'll find quite a few references.

Then I think you'll know what you want to discuss on this topic.

Don't be too quick to jump to a conclusion. I once felt the same way with inquringmind until he stated his purpose.

[Palerider]

I tried going to lds.orgs scripture section and typing in "discerning," and got a lot of irrelevant results (and the few relevant results were only those that included the words "discerning," discern," etc.)

Mosiah 7, and Alma 32 are the kinds of passages I'm interested in, and neither contains the word "discerning."

I'm sure there's more on this in the BOM, and other LDS sources, and I once again ask you all to post anything that comes to mind.

Thank you.

I did the same thing only I typed in "discern" as I mentioned in my previous post. Yes some were irrelevant but others were quite pertinent. That's part of the fun. I also found on the left hand column a section from the topical guide..... Discernment, Spiritual. If I were brighter I would give this to you as a link but alas I'm a bit high-tech challenged.

[Palerider]

Don't be too quick to jump to a conclusion. I once felt the same way with inquringmind until he stated his purpose.

I may have missed that.......Please enlighten us......

[Doctor Ninja]

I'm sorry, I believe you incorrectly cast the first stone. Please check the mirror a little more closely.......perhaps if you removed the mask? It allows one to see oneself more clearly.

I apologize that my pseudo-Mormon comment offended you.

[alter idem]

Don't be too quick to jump to a conclusion. I once felt the same way with inquringmind until he stated his purpose.

I must have missed something that you were able to 'discern' from the op--I don't see where he stated his purpose--and even if he did, it doesn't change my position.

[blackstrap]

When confronted with an evil spirit,or discerning such,are we dealing with an actual spirit like is within us,or just a feeling or idea or sense that would lead us astray?It is not always clear ,eg. a "spirit of love" , a "spirit of contention" is most likely an general feeling whereas an "evil spirit" could be one of Satan's minions. What are we discerning when we "feel the S/spirit" in a meeting?

Edited July 3, 2011 by blackstrap

[Doctor Ninja]

Inquiringmind can speak for himself.

[CV75]

Hello all.

I'd like as many LDS scripture references (book of Mormon, D&C, Pearl of Great Price) as possible on how we discern whether a spirit is from God.

Also, anything Joseph, other first presidents, or GA's have said on the subject.

Is it always easy, or is it sometimes hard?

Please provide any references you can.

Thank you..

I’m treating your OP as relating to discerning of spirits being discerning the children of God and their disposition (as opposed to principles and doctrines such as Alma 32 and D&C 50 describe). These spirits can have bodies like we do, or not.

See http://lds.org/scrip...nt=dc-testament

These scriptures show that:

The discerning of spirits is a gift of the Spirit (also see Moses 1:15).

It is one of the keys a bishop holds.

We can ask for and receive spiritual gifts, including this one (also see D&C 46:29-33).

It is related to discerning between the righteous and the wicked for the purpose of gathering and protecting the saints.The Holy Ghost is a Spirit of course, and he is discerned by those with eyes to see by the Light of Christ, leading to a witness or a testimony by the power of the Holy Spirit. This type of discernment has to do with the teachings in D&C 93 and 84:43-53.

The discerning of spirits is also mentioned in Hebrews 14:12 and 5:14. The word of God can pierce the thoughts and intents of the heart, and in this way we can discern our own spirit. Also, spiritual senses can be exercised, which would enable one to recognize good and evil in general, and spirits specifically as occasion requires. At the end of Malachi 3, it is given to some to participate in the final judgment and thus discern the spirits.

For this reason we have the advanced technique described in D&C 129 for those who actually have occasion to use this information.

I think the ease or difficulty of discernment is largely a function of the observer.

Edited July 3, 2011 by CV75

[LDSToronto]

Hello all.

I'd like as many LDS scripture references (book of Mormon, D&C, Pearl of Great Price) as possible on how we discern whether a spirit is from God.

Also, anything Joseph, other first presidents, or GA's have said on the subject.

Is it always easy, or is it sometimes hard?

Please provide any references you can.

Thank you..

"Some revelations are of God; some revelations are of man; and some revelations are of the devil." - Joseph Smith, Jr.

[LeSellers]

"Some revelations are of God; some revelations are of man; and some revelations are of the devil." - Joseph Smith, Jr.

Correction. This was attributed to Joseph Smith, Jun., but there is no serious evidence that he actually said it.

Hence, my formal CFR.

Lehi

Edited July 4, 2011 by LeSellers

[LDSToronto]

Correction. This was attributed to Joseph Smith, Jun., but there is no serious evidence that he actually said it.

Lehi

David Whitmer claims Joseph said it in relation to the Toronto copyright incident. While that may not be evidence enough, Emma Smith later refers to the spirit of the message when criticizing polygamy (I'd have to dig out my copy of Mormon Enigma to find the exact quote). So Joseph may not have said it exactly as it's stated, but I believe he may have said something to that effect.

H.

[LeSellers]

David Whitmer claims Joseph said it in relation to the Toronto copyright incident. While that may not be evidence enough, Emma Smith later refers to the spirit of the message when criticizing polygamy (I'd have to dig out my copy of Mormon Enigma to find the exact quote). So Joseph may not have said it exactly as it's stated, but I believe he may have said something to that effect.

I've read them both, and they are not what you make them out to be. In all the hundreds of books I have at my finger tips, not a one cites a reliable source for either "instance", and none gives the context.

Only BH Roberts uses it (the alleged quote) even secondarily.

Lehi

[LDSToronto]

I've read them both, and they are not what you make them out to be. In all the hundreds of books I have at my finger tips, not a one cites a reliable source for either "instance", and none gives the context.

Only BH Roberts uses it (the alleged quote) even secondarily.

Lehi

I don't see how I've been anything but honest here - I've cited David Whitmer as the source who attributed the quote to Joseph:

From David Whitmer, An Address to All Believers in Christ, p.30 - p.31

We were waiting on Martin Harris who was doing his best to sell a part of his farm, in order to raise the necessary funds. After a time Hyrum Smith and others began to get impatient, thinking that Martin Harris was too slow and under transgression for not selling his land at once, even if at a great sacrifice. Brother Hyrum thought they should not wait any longer on Martin Harris, and that the money should be raised in some other way. Brother Hyrum was vexed with Brother Martin, and thought they should get the money by some means outside of him, and not let him have anything to do with the publication of the Book, or receiving any of the profits thereof if any profits should accrue. He was wrong in thus judging Bro. Martin, because he was doing all he could toward selling his land. Brother Hyrum said it had been suggested to him that some of the brethren might go to Toronto, Canada, and sell the copy-right of the Book of Mormon for considerable money: and he persuaded Joseph to inquire of the Lord about it. Joseph concluded to do so. He had not yet given up the stone. Joseph looked into the hat in which he placed the stone, and received a revelation that some of the brethren should go to Toronto, Canada, and that they would sell the copy-right of the Book of Mormon. Hiram Page and Oliver Cowdery went to Toronto on this mission, but they failed entirely to sell the copy-right, returning without any money. Joseph was at my father's house when they returned. I was there also, and am an eye witness to these facts. Jacob Whitmer and John Whitmer were also present when Hiram Page and Oliver Cowdery returned from Canada. Well, we were all in great trouble; and we asked Joseph how it was that he had received a revelation from the Lord for some brethren to go to Toronto and sell the copy-right, and the brethren had utterly failed in their undertaking. Joseph did not know how it was, so he enquired of the Lord about it, and behold the following revelation came through the stone: "Some revelations are of God: some revelations are of man: and some revelations are of the devil." So we see that the revelation to go to Toronto and sell the copy-right was not of God, but was of the devil or of the heart of man. When a man enquires of the Lord concerning a matter, if he is deceived by his own carnal desires, and is in error, he will receive an answer according to his erring heart, but it will not be a revelation from the Lord.

I will have to back up my claim from Emma - but Emma did not quote Joseph directly. Rather, she alluded to the same principle that David Whitmer claims Joseph received by revelation.

H.