Women Performing Healings

[Brian 2.0]

Interesting read. Probably interesting to discuss. For those than don't want to read, it's in regards to the early church practice of women being able to anoint with oil and perform healing blessings. This practice continued for approx first 100 years of church history.

Haven't checked the facts on this yet so some things may be inaccurate.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogsfaithblog/51785971-180/healing-mormon-women-church.html.csp#disqus_thread

I for one would be all for it happening now. But then I actually don't see an issue with women having the Priesthood in full now either.

[Brian 2.0]

I guess the question I keep thinking about is how the healing became a Priesthood function? Today we perform them by saying "by the power of the Melchizedek Priesthood" but has that not always been the case when the healings were performed by women.

At some point it transferred from something akin to dedicating a home (which can be done by a women and isn't a "priesthood" thing) to a full priesthood ordinance akin to blessing the sacrament. Was this transfer official or evolutionary?

[David T]

I guess the question I keep thinking about is how the healing became a Priesthood function? Today we perform them by saying "by the power of the Melchizedek Priesthood" but has that not always been the case when the healings were performed by women.

At some point it transferred from something akin to dedicating a home (which can be done by a women and isn't a "priesthood" thing) to a full priesthood ordinance akin to blessing the sacrament. Was this transfer official or evolutionary?

The article linked by the Trib goes into the details. It's long, but essential reading. One of the authors of the paper did a podcast with BCC answering your exact questions. It's highly educational, and a great listen: http://bycommonconsent.com/2010/11/17/bcc-zeitcast-4-1-female-ritual-healing-in-mormonism/

[Brian 2.0]

The article linked by the Trib goes into the details. It's long, but essential reading. One of the authors of the paper did a podcast with BCC answering your exact questions. It's highly educational, and a great listen: http://bycommonconse...g-in-mormonism/

Thanks for the link! I'll check it out.

[cinepro]

At some point it transferred from something akin to dedicating a home (which can be done by a women and isn't a "priesthood" thing) to a full priesthood ordinance akin to blessing the sacrament. Was this transfer official or evolutionary?

Are you sure about that? While the Church gives the option of offering a "prayer" of dedication, the act of dedicating a home by the Priesthood isn't something that a woman can do.

20.11 Dedicating Homes

Church members may dedicate their homes as sacred edifices where the Holy Spirit can reside and where family members can worship, find safety from the world, grow spiritually, and prepare for eternal family relationships. Homes need not be free of debt to be dedicated. Unlike Church buildings, homes are not consecrated to the Lord.

A Melchizedek Priesthood holder may dedicate a home by the power of the priesthood. If there is not a Melchizedek Priesthood holder in the home, a family might invite a close relative, a home teacher, or another Melchizedek Priesthood holder to dedicate the home. Or a family might gather and offer a prayer that includes the elements mentioned in the preceding paragraph and other words as the Spirit directs.

Church Handbook of Instructions

In the same way, a woman can pray for someone to get better, but that isn't the same as offering an actual Priesthood blessing.

Well, theologically it's different. As for the practical outcomes...?

[Brian 2.0]

I guess I was mistaken, I think the last sentence is where the thought came from (or at least was conveyed to me at some point)

"Or a family might gather and offer a prayer that includes the elements mentioned in the preceding paragraph and other words as the Spirit directs."

that seems an odd line to include at the end. Is that basically saying, or, you can not dedicated the home by the preisthood and just say a prayer?

[David T]

Are you sure about that? While the Church gives the option of offering a "prayer" of dedication, the act of dedicating a home by the Priesthood isn't something that a woman can do.

That's actually a brand new development - and exactly illustrated the kind of development under discussion.

The former edition of the Handbook (as well as the current Missionary Handbook) said (and says),

"Church members may dedicate their homes as sacred edifices where the Holy Spirit can reside and where family members can worship, find safety from the world, grow spiritually, and prepare for eternal family relationships. Homes need not be free of debt to be dedicated. Unlike Church buildings, homes are not consecrated to the Lord.

To Dedicate a home, a family might gather together and offer a prayer that includes the elements mentioned above, and other words as the Sprit directs"

No mention of Priesthood. Single Sisters were included in this, and could quite properly dedicate their own homes. There was no difference between dedication prayers, and Priesthood Dedications. The new edition illustrates the move from this being a traditional prayer able to be done by all members, to the creation of a separate-but-not-really-equal Priesthood Ordinance.

[cinepro]

That's actually a brand new development - and exactly illustrated the kind of development under discussion.

The former edition of the Handbook (as well as the current Missionary Handbook) said (and says),

"Church members may dedicate their homes as sacred edifices where the Holy Spirit can reside and where family members can worship, find safety from the world, grow spiritually, and prepare for eternal family relationships. Homes need not be free of debt to be dedicated. Unlike Church buildings, homes are not consecrated to the Lord.

To Dedicate a home, a family might gather together and offer a prayer that includes the elements mentioned above, and other words as the Sprit directs"

No mention of Priesthood. Single Sisters were included in this, and could quite properly dedicate their own homes. There was no difference between dedication prayers, and Priesthood Dedications. The new edition illustrates the move from this being a traditional prayer able to be done by all members, to the creation of a separate-but-not-really-equal Priesthood Ordinance.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Interesting read. Probably interesting to discuss. For those than don't want to read, it's in regards to the early church practice of women being able to anoint with oil and perform healing blessings. This practice continued for approx first 100 years of church history.

Haven't checked the facts on this yet so some things may be inaccurate.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogsfaithblog/51785971-180/healing-mormon-women-church.html.csp#disqus_thread

I for one would be all for it happening now. But then I actually don't see an issue with women having the Priesthood in full now either.

Quick story…

I was hospitalized once; I was given something that caused me to thrash around and increased my heart rate to dangerous levels. My Mother was in the room (I was in my late 30’s); while the Doctors were trying to figure out what to do, my mother came over and put her hand on my forehead…even though I was unconscious I claimed down immediately and my heart rate return to normal. Such is the power of Mother’s.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Indeed.

[Brian 2.0]

That's actually a brand new development - and exactly illustrated the kind of development under discussion.

The former edition of the Handbook (as well as the current Missionary Handbook) said (and says),

"Church members may dedicate their homes as sacred edifices where the Holy Spirit can reside and where family members can worship, find safety from the world, grow spiritually, and prepare for eternal family relationships. Homes need not be free of debt to be dedicated. Unlike Church buildings, homes are not consecrated to the Lord.

To Dedicate a home, a family might gather together and offer a prayer that includes the elements mentioned above, and other words as the Sprit directs"

No mention of Priesthood. Single Sisters were included in this, and could quite properly dedicate their own homes. There was no difference between dedication prayers, and Priesthood Dedications. The new edition illustrates the move from this being a traditional prayer able to be done by all members, to the creation of a separate-but-not-really-equal Priesthood Ordinance.

Thank you for this! I knew I wasn't crazy. I used to teach investigators and new members on my mission that they could dedicate their homes.

So yes, this change is exactly what the main topic is about.

[SeattleGrunge]

Women definitely used to be able to do this. I see it as one of two things:

1-the church took the privilege away from women in its movement to making it a priesthood only procedure

2-as the church grew line upon line, they better understood how this was to best happen and made the change accordingly. Kind of like how we used to seal to anyone we wanted and that was ok until it was revealed that sealings really should be just familial.

I don't know which it was, but those are my main two thoughts on the history of this subject.

[splendidsun]

SeattleGrunge, I recommend reading the article Kris and I wrote in the JMH regarding the long and slow evolution away from female healing. It is available here. Regarding your #2, it just so happens that I have an article in the forthcoming Summer of JMH on adoptive temple sealings. The difficulty with your statement is, as I read it, adoption practice doesn't appear to have had much of a revelatory beginning, but instead appears to be a pragmatic attempt to realize Mormon cosmology on earth. Moreover, adoption ended with an actual revelation to Wilford Woodruff. In comparison, female healing got an early kick-start with a revelatory pronouncement by Joseph Smith (though it was documented earlier and supported by Church leaders), and ended with a slow pragmatic evolution of Church practice. I'm not saying one is right and the other is wrong, but if you are going to make parallels, it is important to understand the situation a little bit better.

On the creation of a priesthood home dedication ritual, I wrote this up a while back.

[SeattleGrunge]

SeattleGrunge, I recommend reading the article Kris and I wrote in the JMH regarding the long and slow evolution away from female healing. It is available here. Regarding your #2, it just so happens that I have an article in the forthcoming Summer of JMH on adoptive temple sealings. The difficulty with your statement is, as I read it, adoption practice doesn't appear to have had much of a revelatory beginning, but instead appears to be a pragmatic attempt to realize Mormon cosmology on earth. Moreover, adoption ended with an actual revelation to Wilford Woodruff. In comparison, female healing got an early kick-start with a revelatory pronouncement by Joseph Smith (though it was documented earlier and supported by Church leaders), and ended with a slow pragmatic evolution of Church practice. I'm not saying one is right and the other is wrong, but if you are going to make parallels, it is important to understand the situation a little bit better.

On the creation of a priesthood home dedication ritual, I wrote this up a while back.

Thanks, I'll check those out.

[jo1952]

Does anyone know how I can gain access to what was written in the 1940 pamphlet?

What is a woman supposed to do if there is no Priesthood available in an emergency?

Are we mixing a healing "ordinance" with general gifts of the Spirit? Women receive the same "gifts" of the Spirit which men receive. The Priesthood is the Power and Authority of God to do His work. However, the Holy Ghost, is the very gift given to ALL mankind to witness that Jesus is the Christ. When we receive the Gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying on hands by those who hold the proper Priesthood authority, we receive the power purposed by Father to lead us to ALL Truth. Both men and women, through the Holy Ghost, have access to the very kingdom of God. And who can stay the hand of that Power???

Indeed, we know that faith can move mountains - you don't have to be a specific gender to have that kind of faith. I know people who do not hold the Priesthood, both men and women, who have the spiritual gift of healing. They are not members of the Church; however, they are still members of the body of Christ. Father is not a respector of persons. Truth is not the private property of the Church. In fact, Joseph Smith often taught that Truth is everywhere. It was an important enough belief, that he included this in our Articles of Faith.

Both men and women have access to the power of the Holy Ghost through the name of Jesus Christ to repel the very powers of the adversary and his followers who now have dominion and hold principalities of darkness over the earth. Do not underestimate the power of the faith of a faithful woman, regardless of whether she is a member of the Church or not.

Just some thoughts.

Love,

jo

[Kingsson]

Interesting read. Probably interesting to discuss. For those than don't want to read, it's in regards to the early church practice of women being able to anoint with oil and perform healing blessings. This practice continued for approx first 100 years of church history.

Haven't checked the facts on this yet so some things may be inaccurate.

http://www.sltrib.co...p#disqus_thread

I for one would be all for it happening now. But then I actually don't see an issue with women having the Priesthood in full now either.

[1]Jesus said the "Believer shall lay hands on the sick, And, The believer shall do the same works that Jesus did".

That means women as well as men.

[2]There is no record in the Bible that says the power, Authority or gifts will cease in the Christian Church age....Just the oposite. The Bible says the power will be in the TRUE CHURCH throughout all ages, World without end.

We are still in the, "ALL AGES" and the world hasn't "ENDED" YET.

[3]Every Christian is a priest from the moment they get born again. THAT INCLUEDES WOMEN.

[WalkerW]

Interesting read. Probably interesting to discuss. For those than don't want to read, it's in regards to the early church practice of women being able to anoint with oil and perform healing blessings. This practice continued for approx first 100 years of church history.

Haven't checked the facts on this yet so some things may be inaccurate.

http://www.sltrib.co...p#disqus_thread

I for one would be all for it happening now. But then I actually don't see an issue with women having the Priesthood in full now either.

Thank you for the link! I've been dying to read it and wasn't aware it was online.

[Kingsson]

I guess the question I keep thinking about is how the healing became a Priesthood function? Today we perform them by saying "by the power of the Melchizedek Priesthood" but has that not always been the case when the healings were performed by women.

At some point it transferred from something akin to dedicating a home (which can be done by a women and isn't a "priesthood" thing) to a full priesthood ordinance akin to blessing the sacrament. Was this transfer official or evolutionary?

It is unscriptural to do a healing "By the power of the Melchizedek priesthood", Where in the world did you get that idear from??

The New Testament way is, "In the name of Jesus". AND THAT IS THE ONLY WAY.

A woman is a "priesthood thing", Every Christian is a priest the moment they get born again.

[David T]

It is unscriptural to do a healing "By the power of the Melchizedek priesthood", Where in the world did you get that idear from??

The New Testament way is, "In the name of Jesus". AND THAT IS THE ONLY WAY.

A woman is a "priesthood thing", Every Christian is a priest the moment they get born again.

Kingsson, by unscriptural, you mean, "Not in the Bible." Mormons would agree with that. We're not a Bible Based Church. We're a modern revelation based Church that also believes the Bible is inspired - but only one - albiet very important - piece of the puzzle.

[Doctor Steuss]

Today we perform them by saying "by the power of the Melchizedek Priesthood"

Out of inconsequential curiosity...

Is it by the "power," or is it supposed to be by the "authority"? It's been many moons since I've given (or been there for) a Priesthood blessing, but for some odd reason I remember that it was supposed to be the latter.

???

[David T]

I guess the question I keep thinking about is how the healing became a Priesthood function? Today we perform them by saying "by the power of the Melchizedek Priesthood" but has that not always been the case when the healings were performed by women.

Additional nitpicking note:

It has become standardized to say with ordinances, "by the authority of the Melchizedek Priesthood", and "in the Name of Jesus Christ".

It is not the power that we are personally invoking, we are declaring that what is being pronounced is legitimized and trustworthy by the representative authority, and the Name of Christ. (which are two ways of actually saying the same thing), which is where/who the power actually comes from.

EDIT: I just saw that Dr. Steuss was posting the same thing at the same time

[Kingsson]

Does anyone know how I can gain access to what was written in the 1940 pamphlet?

What is a woman supposed to do if there is no Priesthood available in an emergency?

Are we mixing a healing "ordinance" with general gifts of the Spirit? Women receive the same "gifts" of the Spirit which men receive. The Priesthood is the Power and Authority of God to do His work. However, the Holy Ghost, is the very gift given to ALL mankind to witness that Jesus is the Christ. When we receive the Gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying on hands by those who hold the proper Priesthood authority, we receive the power purposed by Father to lead us to ALL Truth. Both men and women, through the Holy Ghost, have access to the very kingdom of God. And who can stay the hand of that Power???

Indeed, we know that faith can move mountains - you don't have to be a specific gender to have that kind of faith. I know people who do not hold the Priesthood, both men and women, who have the spiritual gift of healing. They are not members of the Church; however, they are still members of the body of Christ. Father is not a respector of persons. Truth is not the private property of the Church. In fact, Joseph Smith often taught that Truth is everywhere. It was an important enough belief, that he included this in our Articles of Faith.

Both men and women have access to the power of the Holy Ghost through the name of Jesus Christ to repel the very powers of the adversary and his followers who now have dominion and hold principalities of darkness over the earth. Do not underestimate the power of the faith of a faithful woman, regardless of whether she is a member of the Church or not.

Just some thoughts.

Love,

jo

The priesthood and the believer are the same thing, There is no such ministry as, "Priesthood" apart from the fact that every Christian, Male and Female are priests from the moment they get born again.

All believers, Male and female have the power and authority to do the same works that Jesus did, And Jesus said every believer will lay hands on the sick, & cast out devils.

I mean every, "BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN". Not false religous people.

We don't allow proselyting or preaching here. Either add something of substance or find another topic where you can.

[Doctor Steuss]

The priesthood and the believer are the same thing, There is no such ministry as, "Priesthood" apart from the fact that every Christian, Male and Female are priests from the moment they get born again.

All believers, Male and female have the power and authority to do the same works that Jesus did, And Jesus said every believer will lay hands on the sick, & cast out devils.

I mean every, "BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN". Not false religous people.

I’m going to go out on a limb, and guess that everyone got your perspective the first two times you gave it.

[thesometimesaint]

Kingsson:

In LDS theology there is no such thing as the Priesthood of all believers. That is strictly a modern Protestant thing.

[David T]

Kingsson:

In LDS theology there is no such thing as the Priesthood of all believers. That is strictly a modern Protestant thing.

Actually, this may be in the process of changing in our rhetoric somewhat.

Julie Beck, Relief Society President, currently featured on LDS.org:

“I’ve learned through studying the history of Relief Society that we have and live with inseparable connection to the priesthood,” ...

“Don’t confuse the power of the priesthood with the keys and offices of the priesthood,” Sister Beck said. “The power is limitless and is shared with those who make and keep covenants. Too much is said and misunderstood about what brothers have and sister’s don’t. This is Satan’s way of confusing men and women so that neither understands what they really have.”

“The priesthood is God’s power,” she said. “It is His power to create, to bless, to lead, to serve as He does.” .

She seems to be expressing the concept of Priesthood Power (IE, the Lord's Power) available to be exercised by virtue of entering into Covenant with the Lord - (such as through Baptism) which was how the earliest Joseph Smith and Brigham Young era Restoration Saints expressed it .