Song of Solomon = "Biblical Trash"?

[kamenraider]

Bruce R. McConkie said in a 1984 talk at BYU called "The Bible: A Sealed Book" that "the Song of Solomon is biblical trash â?? it is not inspired writing." The JST manuscript (OT MS 2, pg. 97, CofC Archives), shown also in a footnote in the LDS scriptures, says "The Songs of Solomon are not Inspired writings."

In contrast though, in the Jewish tradition, Rabbi Akiva Ben Joseph (c. 45-135 AD) declared, "Heaven forbid that any man in Israel ever disputed that the Song of Songs is holy. For the whole world is not worth the day on which the Song of Songs was given to Israel, for all the Writings are holy and the Song of Songs is holy of holies." (Mishnah Yadayim 3:5).

I know that EV's sometimes criticize LDS over the Song of Solomon issue as well.

What do you think? Is Song of Solomon uninspired and pornographic, or is it an inspired allegory which contains deep spiritual insights?

[Frijaneen]

McConkie was wrong. The JST is wrong. Song of Songs is the MOST inspired book in the Bible!

1.2 Let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth--for your love is more delightful than wine.

1.13 My lover is to me a sachet of myrrh resting between my breasts.

1.14 My lover is to me a cluster of henna blossoms from the vineyards of En Gedi.

1.15 How beautiful you are, my darling! Oh, how beautiful! Your eyes are doves.

1.16 How handsome you are, my lover! Oh, how charming! And our bed is verdant.

2.10 My lover spoke and said to me, "Arise, my darling, my beautiful one, and come with me.

2.11 See! The winter is past; the rains are over and gone.

2.12 Flowers appear on the earth; the season of singing has come, the cooing of doves is heard in our land.

2.13 The fig tree forms its early fruit; the blossoming vines spread their fragrance. Arise, come, my darling; my beautiful one, come with me."

2.14 My dove in the clefts of the rock, in the hiding places on the mountainside, show me your face, let me hear your voice; for your voice is sweet, and your face is lovely.

2.15 Catch for us the foxes, the little foxes that ruin the vineyards, our vineyards that are in bloom.

2.16 My lover is mine and I am his; he browses among the lilies.

4.7 All beautiful you are, my darling; there is no flaw in you.

Song of Songs may just be the most romantic love poem ever written. I feel inspired having read it!

Swooning,

Frijaneen

[CMZ]

Keep in mind that it was quoted in the D&C. At least briefly...

[Sevenbak]

The JST manuscript contains the note that â??the Song of Solomon is not inspired scripture.â?

The Church's website "Guide to the Scriptures" has only this to say:

GUIDE TO THE SCRIPTURES

SONG OF SOLOMON

A book in the Old Testament. The Prophet Joseph Smith taught that the Song of Solomon is not an inspired writing.

http://scriptures.lds.org/gs/s/76

McConkie was wrong. The JST is wrong. Song of Songs is the MOST inspired book in the Bible

!1.2 Let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth--for your love is more delightful than wine.1.13 My lover is to me a sachet of myrrh resting between my breasts. 1.14 My lover is to me a cluster of henna blossoms from the vineyards of En Gedi. 1.15 How beautiful you are, my darling! Oh, how beautiful! Your eyes are doves. 1.16 How handsome you are, my lover! Oh, how charming! And our bed is verdant.2.10 My lover spoke and said to me, "Arise, my darling, my beautiful one, and come with me. 2.11 See! The winter is past; the rains are over and gone. 2.12 Flowers appear on the earth; the season of singing has come, the cooing of doves is heard in our land. 2.13 The fig tree forms its early fruit; the blossoming vines spread their fragrance. Arise, come, my darling; my beautiful one, come with me." 2.14 My dove in the clefts of the rock, in the hiding places on the mountainside, show me your face, let me hear your voice; for your voice is sweet, and your face is lovely. 2.15 Catch for us the foxes, the little foxes that ruin the vineyards, our vineyards that are in bloom. 2.16 My lover is mine and I am his; he browses among the lilies.4.7 All beautiful you are, my darling; there is no flaw in you.Song of Songs may just be the most romantic love poem ever written. I feel inspired having read it!Swooning,Frijaneen

You forgot "Your hair is like a flock of goats"Hmmm, I just love the smell of herding animals.

[Frijaneen]

You forgot "Your hair is like a flock of goats"Hmmm, I just love the smell of herding animals.

If I had a man who said things to me like, "All beautiful you are, my darling; there is no flaw in you." and he happened to find the odor of herding animals a turn-on, I'd be weaving myself some goat hair lingerie, stat!

Frij

[katherine the great]

What do you think? Is Song of Solomon uninspired and pornographic, or is it an inspired allegory which contains deep spiritual insights?

I don't see how anyone can consider it "uninspired." It is VERY inspiring--just maybe not in the way that Elder McConkie thought was proper.

[kamenraider]

I don't see how anyone can consider it "uninspired." It is VERY inspiring--just maybe not in the way that Elder McConkie thought was proper.

I can understand ladies being inspired by love poetry, but do you think it's inspired, as in "of the Holy Ghost" too?

[Sevenbak]

Jacob 2:24

Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord.

Writing about it was probably not looked on favorably by the Lord as well.

[Ron Beron]

Bruce R. McConkie said in a 1984 talk at BYU called "The Bible: A Sealed Book" that "the Song of Solomon is biblical trash â?? it is not inspired writing." The JST manuscript (OT MS 2, pg. 97, CofC Archives), shown also in a footnote in the LDS scriptures, says "The Songs of Solomon are not Inspired writings."

In contrast though, in the Jewish tradition, Rabbi Akiva Ben Joseph (c. 45-135 AD) declared, "Heaven forbid that any man in Israel ever disputed that the Song of Songs is holy. For the whole world is not worth the day on which the Song of Songs was given to Israel, for all the Writings are holy and the Song of Songs is holy of holies." (Mishnah Yadayim 3:5).

I know that EV's sometimes criticize LDS over the Song of Solomon issue as well.

What do you think? Is Song of Solomon uninspired and pornographic, or is it an inspired allegory which contains deep spiritual insights?

Inspired or not its inclusion in the OT is an important reminder of what the ancient Jews considered important. The writing closely parallels other "sacred marriage" enthronement rites often found in different cultures such as Mesopotamian and is specifically attuned to acquired divinity of the kings,

'The Kingship' -- i.e. the superhuman endowment and quality and majesty, the 'mana' of the king -- 'descends from heaven' and fills him from his mother's womb. Or it may be conferred on him, strengthened and preserved by the sacramental rites at his accession, and the annually repeated enthronement of him as king at the new year festival, and by the close union with the deity. This he especially experiences by joining with the mother goddness in the 'sacred (cultic) marriage', a fixed part of the fertility cult in the religions of the East. He is the 'son' of the god, adopted, nursed, reared and educated by the different gods and goddesses. Thus he is endowed with divine faculties and power, and is a 'superman' (Sumerian:

lugal,

'great man'). He is 'holy' and a partaker of divine qualities, e.g. 'life', 'eternity', 'splendour', 'glory', and so on. He is 'like a god', and using religious terms he can be compared with different gods, with the sun god, the national god and the resurrected fertility god.

The Psalms in Israel's Worship Vol. 1

,Sigmund Mowinckel, D. R. Ap-Thomas; Abingdon Press, 1962

In short, the king, in order to become divine would "marry" a divine being. In the case of other Ugaritic cultures and Mesopotamian this would have been Inanna et al. Since Israel ostensibly adopted whole-hog the concept of kingship from the Canaanites which included the divine enthronement and it accompanying sacred marriage rites it would come as no surprise an inclusion of the ritual within the OT.

I am uncertain, but certainly well worth looking into is that the Jewish festival of Sukkot is a shadow of this unique practice. Also, if any would like to know more please check out Myth, Ritual, and Kingship: Essays on the Theory and Practice of Kingship in the Ancient Near East and in Israel Book by S. H. Hooke; Clarendon Press, 1958.

[katherine the great]

I can understand ladies being inspired by love poetry, but do you think it's inspired, as in "of the Holy Ghost" too?

Does it really need to be inspired by the Holy Ghost to be included in scripture? A lot of biblical writings regarding the history were not inspirational. I think SOS has a ton of literary and cultural value and I would certainly not consider it pornographic.

[prisonchaplain]

For evangelicals, the Bible, by definition, is inspired. Circular reasoning? Perhaps. 1 Timothy says all Scripture is inspired, and we accept the 66 books of the Bible as Scripture, so the Song of Solomon is inspired. Since it is, what can we find in it? God's high esteem for romance? Perhaps. It's also common to read into it an allegory between Christ and his church. Lord help us if we become so religious we think we're too pure for Holy Writ!

BTW, if I was not clear--yes, absolutely inspired by the Holy Ghost--again, per the Apostle Paul, writing to Timothy.

[David Bokovoy]

The Song of Songs is the most poetic portion of the Hebrew Bible and essential study for those interested in understanding biblical poetry. However, the Song documents the sexual exploits of two non-married youth and contains a reference to a gang rape by the city guards.

[katherine the great]

The Song of Songs is the most poetic portion of the Hebrew Bible and essential study for those interested in understanding biblical poetry. However, the Song documents the sexual exploits of two non-married youth and contains a reference to a gang rape by the city guards.

Are they not married? I recollect the phrase: "My sister my wife" and have always assumed that they were married. As to gang rape--that is certainly nothing new to Old Testament storylines.

[e=mc2]

I can understand ladies being inspired by love poetry, but do you think it's inspired, as in "of the Holy Ghost" too?

Of course. The Holy Ghost is God, and God is love, is He not? If McConkie had thought it through himself instead of being more worried about being politically correct and just following Joseph's lead, he would have recognized the astonishing inspiration and incredible teachings in the Song of Songs. Being doctrinaire and doctrinal is not always the Celestial Path ya know.

For evangelicals, the Bible, by definition, is inspired. Circular reasoning? Perhaps. 1 Timothy says all Scripture is inspired, and we accept the 66 books of the Bible as Scripture, so the Song of Solomon is inspired. Since it is, what can we find in it? God's high esteem for romance? Perhaps. It's also common to read into it an allegory between Christ and his church. Lord help us if we become so religious we think we're too pure for Holy Writ! BTW, if I was not clear--yes, absolutely inspired by the Holy Ghost--again, per the Apostle Paul, writing to Timothy.

Heh....... I don't even need Paul's idea to realize it is inspired......... I get it in my heart, and in my gut. It's fabulous reading.

[kamenraider]

The Song of Songs is the most poetic portion of the Hebrew Bible and essential study for those interested in understanding biblical poetry. However, the Song documents the sexual exploits of two non-married youth and contains a reference to a gang rape by the city guards.

Do you regard it as being uninspired then?

[Bill Hamblin]

The Song of Songs has traditionally been seen as a supreme allegorical spiritual mystery. R. Aqiva said, "All the writings are holy, but the 'Song of Songs' is the Holy of Holies."

M. Pope, Song of Songs (1977)

Origen, Origen: The Song of Songs, Commentary and Homilies, tr. R. Lawson (1957)

Bernard of Clairvaux, Bernard of Clairvaux: Sermons on the Song of Songs, 4 vols.

[Ron Beron]

The Song of Songs is the most poetic portion of the Hebrew Bible and essential study for those interested in understanding biblical poetry. However, the Song documents the sexual exploits of two non-married youth and contains a reference to a gang rape by the city guards.

So, David, does this mean you recommend its teaching in Primary? I'm still in trouble for the last book you recommended.

[Ron Beron]

A look further...

The religious basis of the Sumerian institution of kingship was made explicit at the time of New Year Festival when the people celebrated a holy marriage between the king and the goddess of the city, represented by a priestess.

The hymns which accompanied this sacral coupling bear an amazing resemblance to the poetry of the biblical Song of Songs.

It appears that the king impersonated Dumuzi, the god of fertility, and the priestess became the goddess Inanna: for the city their union ensured prosperity, strength, and concord.

A Dictionary of World Mythology

by Arthur Flag Cotterell; Oxford University Press, 1986

[Zakuska]

Bruce R. McConkie said in a 1984 talk at BYU called "The Bible: A Sealed Book" that "the Song of Solomon is biblical trash â?? it is not inspired writing." The JST manuscript (OT MS 2, pg. 97, CofC Archives), shown also in a footnote in the LDS scriptures, says "The Songs of Solomon are not Inspired writings."

In contrast though, in the Jewish tradition, Rabbi Akiva Ben Joseph (c. 45-135 AD) declared, "Heaven forbid that any man in Israel ever disputed that the Song of Songs is holy. For the whole world is not worth the day on which the Song of Songs was given to Israel, for all the Writings are holy and the Song of Songs is holy of holies." (Mishnah Yadayim 3:5).

I know that EV's sometimes criticize LDS over the Song of Solomon issue as well.

What do you think? Is Song of Solomon uninspired and pornographic, or is it an inspired allegory which contains deep spiritual insights?

Since it prophecies of Joseph Smiths birth place. Id say its inspired.

[volgadon]

It is a very naughty poem when read in Hebrew. That said, it contains some of the most beautiful imagery in Hebrew. Many modern Israeli songs draw from it.

To understand why rabbi Akiva considered SoS inspired, one needs to understand how he viewed the scriptures. For Akiva every word in the Bible contained a deeper, hidden meaning. He developed rabbi Nahum gamzo's (this too, because of how Nahum would always say this too is for the better) philosophy that the scriptures were not written in a human tongue, so should be read mystically. Akiva was able to read whatever he wanted into ANYTHING, even conjuctions.

[The Nehor]

I can understand ladies being inspired by love poetry, but do you think it's inspired, as in "of the Holy Ghost" too?

Twilight should be up for canonization by next Conference.

[The Nehor]

Do you regard it as being uninspired then?

I regard it as inspired but probably not inspired in the same way as John or Isaiah. I think it is fitting that at least one book in the Bible should have extremely erotic imagery (I don't count Ruth) and see it as a good thing. I certainly never skip it while reading the Bible. Sorry BRM, not buying it.

[David Bokovoy]

Are they not married? I recollect the phrase: "My sister my wife" and have always assumed that they were married. As to gang rape--that is certainly nothing new to Old Testament storylines.

Scholarly consensus holds that the lovers in the Song are non-married fornicators. The following quote is representative:

"The woman appears to be very young, probably just past puberty. Her brothers call her their 'little sister' and think of her as a child. We have a 'little sister and she has no breasts,' they say, although she is more grown up then they admit: since by her own account her breasts are developed, she has reached sexual maturity (8:8-10). The Shulmanite, as she is called, is presented in relation to her close family, her mother and her brothers, as well as a group of young women, the daughters of Jerusalem. She and her lover meet secretly in the country side at night and part at daybreak, so it is clear that they are not married" Ariel Bloch and Chana Bloch, The Song of Songs: A New Translation with an Introduction and Commentary (New York: Randam House, 1995): 3

Here is the gang rape on the young woman which was intended to provide erotic imagery for male readers:

"I opened the door for my lover but my lover had turned and gone. I was faint because of what he said. I sought him, but found him not; I called, but he did not answer. I met the watchmen who patrol the town; they struck we repeatedly, they ravished me; the guards of the walls stripped me of my clothing. I adjure you, O maidens of Jerusalem! I you meet my beloved, tell him this: that I am faint with love"

[David Bokovoy]

Do you regard it as being uninspired then?

Well, it is Near Eastern pornography.

In view of the Song's original intent, as well as the fact that the lovers are not married, later efforts by Jews and Christians to allegorize the sexual exploits of the fornicators is in my view a bit odd, but to each his own.

As a Master's student, I took an entire semester's course on the text in Hebrew and learned a lot about biblical poetry and Near Eastern views concerning pornography, which have been tremendously helpful in my studies, but like the Prophet Joseph, I've never viewed the Song as inspired scripture.

[David Bokovoy]

So, David, does this mean you recommend its teaching in Primary? I'm still in trouble for the last book you recommended.

LOL! Yes, indeed. I hope you didn't make the same mistake I did and bring it to sacrament meeting. I don't agree with all of it, but still, fantastic book with some great ideas!

Currently out of town, BTW.