GoCeltics

Female elders who die in this dispensation?

Because God always was God.

I don’t know what these theories say, but I believe creation is larger than what scientists can see with the telescope. We may be able to go there and live some day. Grammar error. I meant I don’t believe in uncreated, eternal intelligences, save God himself.

According to verse 51 all those in paradise were resurrected, entered their Father’s kingdom, and became exalted. They did not return back to the spirit world. Verse 57 following 51 does not mean those male elders in the latter were resurrected too.

Where does verse 57 indicate the elders are resurrected?

A. The universe observed from Earth is not as extensive as science can observe. It is not a light show. Maybe some day they will be inhabited by us. B. You are correct. I do not believe humans created as eternal uncreated intelligences (spirits). For souls, I would point you to a passage in Genesis. “And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul”. Somehow God enables a living soul at conception. C. I think all people have some knowledge of God through creation and conscience, which holds them accountable, even if they haven’t heard the gospel (Romans 1:19-20; 2:14–16).

Verse 39 is the ages up to the coming of Christ. The “and so on” is “and gave them power to come forth, after his resurrection from the dead, to enter into his Father’s kingdom, there to be crowned with immortality and eternal life”. The “when” coincides with his resurrection, shown in verse 15-17. “I beheld that they were filled with joy and gladness, and were rejoicing together because the day of their deliverance was at hand. They were assembled awaiting the advent of the Son of God into the spirit world, to declare their redemption from the bands of death. Their sleeping dust was to be restored unto its perfect frame, bone to his bone, and the sinews and the flesh upon them, the spirit and the body to be united never again to be divided, that they might receive a fulness of joy”. Receiving a fulness of joy is eternal life (exaltation). Nothing in verse 57 indicates male elders are resurrected and exit the spirit world of the dead.

Verse 39 is speaking of the past tense, “who had lived through the ages”. According to verse 51, they were resurrected to immortality and eternal life after Christ’s resurrection and had already entered the Father’s kingdom.

@ZealouslyStriving It would have been clearer if it said saints instead of elders.

Doctrine and Covenants 138:57 states “I beheld that the faithful elders of this dispensation, when they depart from mortal life, continue their labors in the preaching of the gospel of repentance and redemption, through the sacrifice of the Only Begotten Son of God, among those who are in darkness and under the bondage of sin in the great world of the spirits of the dead.” Is there a reason why faithful LDS women who have died don’t participate in this work? I noticed earlier that Eve and all her faithful daughters who had passed on were commissioned to participate in that work for a brief time before being raised to Heavenly Father’s kingdom to receive immortality and eternal life.

I saw this YT video by Nemo the Mormon. It’s more “I know” than “I believe”.

Why do you exclude the two lower kingdoms of the celestial glory?

Which kingdom do the presence of the Father and Jesus reside?

“In the beginning was the gospel preached through the Son. And the gospel was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God” (JST) Comparing this with the KJV: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God”. Is the phrase “the Son was of God” intended to mean something different than Jesus is God? Was Joseph Smith trying to clarify what he thought was a mistranslation or a translation that was lacking?

When I think of relativity in a family sense, you could say your brothers and sisters on other inhabited worlds are your relatives (Doctrine and Covenants 76:24). It must of been of some need of God to show a limited vision of them to Moses (1:33-35).

By same kind of being, do you mean Paul was telling the Athenians they were both Gods and humans?

So he and Heavenly Mother, while living as mortals on another world, needed atonement for their sins so they could be brought to that point too? I found this teaching from a former church president (John Taylor): https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/teachings-john-taylor/chapter-1?lang=eng "In another point of view, we look at him as emanating from the Gods—as a God in embryo—as an eternal being who had an existence before he came here, and who will exist after his mortal remains are mingled and associated with dust, from whence he came, and from whence he will be resurrected and partake of that happiness for which he is destined, or receive the reward of his evil deeds, according to circumstances. What is [man]? He had his being in the eternal worlds; he existed before he came here. He is not only the son of man, but he is the son of God also. He is a God in embryo, and possesses within him a spark of that eternal flame which was struck from the blaze of God’s eternal fire in the eternal world, and is placed here upon the earth that he may possess true intelligence, true light, true knowledge,—that he may know himself—that he may know God—that he may know something about what he was before he came here—that he may know something about what he is destined to enjoy in the eternal worlds. If we take man, he is said to have been made in the image of God, for the simple reason that he is a son of God, and being his son, he is, of course, his offspring, an emanation from God, in whose likeness, we are told, he is made. He did not originate from a chaotic mass of matter, moving or inert, but came forth possessing, in an embryonic state, all the faculties and powers of a God. And when he shall be perfected, and have progressed to maturity, he will be like his Father—a God, being indeed His offspring. As the horse, the ox, the sheep, and every living creature, including man, propagates its own species and perpetuates its own kind, so does God perpetuate his". Some view the three heavens as the sky, outer space, and then a spiritual heaven. Will do. The scriptures reveal that we shall judge the world and angels (1 Corinthians 6:2-3). I don’t find the concept of the faithful having roles in judgment in the Book of Mormon or Doctrine and Covenants. You mean Jesus getting married and having children in mortality like you believe the Father did?

How is it that he progressed into becoming a God? If all children were gods when they were born to a heavenly father long ago, then what does Doctrine and Covenants 132:20-22 mean when it says only some will become gods? “Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them. Verily, verily, I say unto you, except ye abide my law ye cannot attain to this glory. For strait is the gate, and narrow the way that leadeth unto the exaltation and continuation of the lives, and few there be that find it, because ye receive me not in the world neither do ye know me”. Some other questions about verse 20. If gods have no end, what does it say of the non-gods? Do they have an end? Can non-gods also be from everlasting to everlasting? Do non-gods also continue? Adam and Eve, in the Garden of Eden, were made in God’s image but they were not gods. They became as God when they ate from the forbidden tree. Glorification is God's ultimate act of removing sin from the lives of the saints, making them blameless as they stand before Him in eternal glory. I find that LDS theology equates “we shall be like him (like God)” with “we shall be him (a God)”. He created us for his glory, not ours. Apart from that, I don’t know as he has not revealed a lot of his purposes. “Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him”. God doesn’t need us. Who brought about Heavenly Father’s immortality and eternal life and how? Who formed your heavenly father? Snow’s couplet means God was not a God when he was once a man and that man can be made into a God sometime in the future. Following your thought leads to spirit children of these future Gods worshipping their own Father God (as you mentioned, “the only God they have to do with”).

What do you mean he progressed to Godhood?

Maybe the simplest is "Before Abraham was, I am".

You're right, but God is not a being who progressed from a less-developed state.

God.

By "yet future", are you saying they have not yet started developing in their pre-mortal life? Will they be involved in a future war in heaven with another Lucifer-to-be?

Which text explains the first part or slavery for a second part?

Would each world get a different ratio from our earth (different from one-third) of those who became angels to the devil?