Pyreaux

I don’t believe every reported UFO is an alien spacecraft either, but neither do I think all of them are weather balloons and hoaxes. I'd take it a little more seriously. Dismissing everything unusual just because it's not wrapped in a press release isn't critical thinking, it’s just convenient skepticism. The Three Nephites, like many spiritual phenomena, not every story is authentic, but that doesn’t mean none are. The fact that they don’t identify themselves isn’t ‘convenient’, but it’s consistent with the broader theme of divine interventions being subtle, and often only recognized in hindsight. Mocking people who’ve had experiences you haven’t had is hardly intellectual rigor. Your comparisons to elves and hobbits just echos of Dawkins New Atheism to dismiss people who report their experiences and historical documents as fairy tales just because they’re hard to verify, regardless of context, evidence, or tradition. That’s not skepticism, that’s laziness. It saves you from having to actually engage with what people are claiming, the context of those claims, or why they persist across generations. Flattening everything into mockery so you don’t have to think too hard, and a shortcut to feeling superior to others by pretending all mystery is stupidity.

Serenity (2005) Well, at the time, those characters had to die: They hoped that the show would continue, so the actors that could not promise they'd be back to the show got killed off. Now, with no show, its for no reason... Though they were perfectly arranged just before other characters started to fall, giving you the impression they might all die. In Western literature, Mal is basically a typical jaded ex-Confederate soldier. But without the slavery element, the theme is more anti- big government, individual freedom and sovereignty of planets. In the Train Job had Mal say, "maybe we'll rise again" is like the saying "the South will rise again".... Well, the reasons for independence are certainly more akin to the Revolutionary War, Libertarianism - Constitutional Federalism (Localized Government, Limited Government). But for a show based on Westerns, the Civil War era is clearly where you found many jaded outlaw ex-solders around having fought for their independence and utterly lost, forced to surrender but always begrudging their government until the day they die. That is Mal. Inara is the 'whore with the heart of gold' archetype, or rather a Chinese Courtesan. She loves Serenity and what they do. She does not want to be a Companion, she wants to join the crew but Mal won't have her. She chose to live on Serenity on purpose, and she already knew Mal's reputation as a war-hero-turned-outlaw, an honorable-thief, living free and she likes that, she's always trying to steer Mal's morals, inserting herself in things, because she wants to join the crew and have a voice. Unfortunately, Mal may hate her job, but he also hates the idea of Inara in danger. So, he pushes her away. The crew are all misfits. Zoey obeys Mal do to rank and military history and they are very alike, in mind and personality, grim, jaded, serious, but after living amongst macho army men, Zoey loves Wash because he's the exact opposite of Mal. Wash is a "civilian", unjaded by loss, non-serious. Weaker and even more emotional than her, some say he's the "female" of the relationship. The war wife. River just hates the Blue Sun Corporation. In the film, River flips out over a Blue Sun Fruity Oaty Bar ad, then inexplicably kicks a Blue Sun bottle off a table. If you remember River inexplicably pulls the Blue Sun labels off their food cans in Shindig, and inexplicably slashed Jayne who was wearing a Blue Sun t-shirt in Ariel. My favorite character is 'the man they call Jayne" (a lyric I always thought was another jab that "Jane is a girl's name"). Jayne is to me a paradox. He is selflessly selfish and loyally disloyal. It seems Jayne is not 'greedy'. True, money is the most important thing to Jayne, more than his crew or friends, because he's been sending it all to his mom and sick brother. We know he sent some money in The Message. Joss doesn't make simply bad characters, even the worst believes they are in the right in their point of view. So, why was money important? Because what does he even do with money he has? What is he buying? For all I know, all of it is going to his family. There is no point where we see him spending his money on a lavish lifestyle, he is always saying he "needs coin". Why? I think if the show had continued, we would have seen Jayne's family, and Simon Tam, a gifted doctor, would have cured his brother. It'd be poetic. The vary person he tried to turn in for money would be the one. I also think Jayne kind of liked Kaylee and was jealous of 'fancy' Simon. I thought Book's secret is he was just like The Operative, and that scene in Objects in Space where River has a psychic glimpse into Book in the kitchen is thought to be Book remembering interrogating or torturing an innocent person. He was also "familiar with the works of Shan Yu", had a high-profile Ident-card, and claims to know how The Operative thinks. I've not read the Book of Book, so I don't know what it says.

So, in Christianity, is it better to be 'born' poor, or is it equal or balanced, because privilege has its own challenges. Privilege can distort proportion, when someone’s whole identity is built around status, success, or lifestyle, even small losses can feel devastating; losing your job, losing your girlfriend. They say self-deletion seems mostly found among the privileged. It seems in Christianity, the greatest threat to people is despair without hope. And wealth can mask that despair longer, making its crash harder when it comes.

Galaxy Quest (1999) Beyond a comedy, it even hits me in the feels. For a majority of the movie, character Alexander Dane has nothing but contempt for the show he was on, feeling it destroyed his career and that he isn't taken seriously anymore. On top of that the line his character says seems to sum up everything he didn't like about his part. However, when one of these aliens gets shot, dying in front of Alexander and tells him "I have always considered you as a father to me" hits Dane between the eyes and gets him to realize he was not simply a fan: All these aliens took every lesson that was taught on the show, and applied It to their lives, and it is what "saved" them. The actor realizes that while he felt the show and his character was silly, and it held him back from roles that he thought truly mattered, his character truly mattered to Quellek. A cynical actor comes to terms with and finally understands the impact he's had on his fans. And it's not a joke anymore. And perhaps for the first time he says the line and means it, as his biggest fan laid dying, who was literally raised by his TV character. Galaxy Quest ranks higher than even Star Trek Into Darkness among Star Trek films at conventions. Galaxy Quest, while not directly from the Star Trek series, is considered a satirical tribute to Star Trek and is appreciated for its merits and skewering of the fandom and original actors. I like Star Trek also, I think my top favorite character is Garak from DS9.

In the other Topic on the War in Heaven I had thought up a reply that likely needed its own topic. When some members interpret the "third part" of heaven (Revelation 12:4) not as a precise ratio, but a symbolic division of unequal thirds: Those who followed Lucifer. Those who chose Christ. It triggered the thought of three portions and the potential of a third group who also chose Christ by default or minimal loyalty. That sounds a lot like the fence-sitter theory. The old Fence-Sitter Theory and its problems The so-called "fence-sitter" theory claimed at the heart that some premortal spirits were less valiant and therefore born into disadvantaged or marginalized groups (often applied to race) where it is then used to explain and justify why they are born under those conditions, as they have no control over their birth. So, this idea was widely circulated unofficially in the 20th century, because it had a logic to it. “We know that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam’s transgression.” - Article of Faith 2. As Latter-day Saints believed in a just and loving God who respects all people. Latter-days Saints knew the priesthood ban didn't seem right and seems unfair, at least without this theory to ease their conscience. Officially disavowed by the Church: “There were no fence-sitters in the War in Heaven.” (Elder M. Russell Ballard, The Blessings of the Gospel Are for All (2005)). It was an important stance to take, as the theory was historically used to justify racial policies in the church, particularly with Black Africans, claiming they were “less valiant” as the only way to understand why anyone might deserve differential treatment from birth. It fed spiritual elitism, the idea that people born into privilege (race, nation, Church) were inherently “better” or more righteous in the premortal life. It's obviously true many righteous souls are born into poverty, oppression, or non-LDS households, such circumstances are not indicators of a premortal failure. It's not right to hold speculative theories about people's pre-mortality. The worth of all souls is great in the sight of God (D&C 18:10). Jesus Himself was born poor and marginalized (Isaiah 53:2–3). If station reflected premortal valor, He would’ve been born the emperor. We cannot see the heart from the outside. Only God knows each soul’s path and divine potential (1 Samuel 16:7). But Generational Curses are Real Yet scriptural history shows examples of generational exclusion or curses: Moabites were excluded for ten generations (Deuteronomy 23:3). Israelites, except Levites, were banned from the priesthood they were intended to have due to the sins of their forefathers. This raises sincere unanswered theological questions: If there are no less valiant spirits, are “generational curses” ever just? If the fence-sitter theory is completely false; Does it conflict with the principle that we are punished only for our own sins? But Foreordination is Real Abraham 3:22–23 teaches that some spirits were “noble and great” and were foreordained to lead. D&C 138:55–56 speaks of righteous spirits being reserved to be “rulers in the Church of God.” That implies variation in premortal spiritual roles and preparation, not necessarily worth. It's not a ladder of value. Being foreordained to be a prophet or parent are all equally sacred roles in the Plan of Salvation. The Degrees of Valiance seems Possible Just like people in mortality vary in courage, intelligence, or worthiness, it’s conceivable that premortal spirits did too. Some may have been more valiant, others more hesitant - all given the opportunity to be tested in mortality. Modern LDS interpret the war as a simplified binary choice: One-third followed Lucifer. Two-thirds followed Christ. Did all of the two-thirds actively support Christ? Perhaps there was ultimately no fence, but surely some could have chosen Christ passively by not supporting Lucifer, not out of valiant conviction. The phrase “the noble and great ones” in Abraham 3:22–23 implies some spirits were particularly valiant and foreordained for high callings in life. This seems should create categories within the righteous two-thirds: “Now the Lord had shown unto me, Abraham, the intelligences that were organized before the world was... and among all these there were many of the noble and great ones.” (Abraham 3:22) This implies not all who chose Christ were “noble and great.” Even if all were not rebellious. Is Neutrality Impossible? Do differences in premortal character not affect mortal opportunity? Do the inequalities in life reflect our Pre-Earth choices? Are we elected to inequality or did we earn inequality? Abraham 3:22–23 does state some spirits were “chosen before they were born.” If “noble and great” spirits were foreordained for leadership, does that imply some were less noble? Or is being born into poverty, illness, or wealth not a curse or a blessing, but a test or a stewardship. Is there danger of entertaining premortal merit theories, as they'll only result in justifying earthly inequality, and that drives its rejection? Does nothing happen if spirits chose Christ for different reasons - loyalty, love, fear, passivity? Does God allow diversity of roles in mortality for instances other than righteousness? My thoughts I think The War in Heaven may have involved a spectrum of loyalty. While the Church rightly disavows using spiritual theories to justify racism. I think it's fair to explore how agency, valiance, foreordination, and God's justice work together in the Plan of Salvation. The merits of the theory today should not be spoiled by what It was used for in the past. I can't say there were no fence sitters, because there is no way to determine that. Only there is no way to tell why we are born how, where and when we are born. A blind man is chosen to be born blind for the glory of God. A man was born a pharaoh and set up to oppose to Moses, for the glory of God. Maybe it can hurt us to know if we were “more valiant” than others. How exactly would Christ want us to treat someone if we knew them to be born “less valiant”? I think, the theory of the fence-sitters failed not because it was a pure doctrinal error but because of the spiritual danger it posed to the proud. The possibility of knowing too much about our premortal lives could defeat the purpose of the Veil of Forgetfulness.

The passage concerning the idea that Satan took one third of the angels with him in rebellion is Revelation 12:3–4. John sees a sign in heaven: “An enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on its heads. Its tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth.” John then relates that the dragon was hurled down to the earth and positively identifies it as “that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray” (Revelation 12:9). A main takeaway is the dragon is not thrown to earth alone: “His angels were cast out with him” (verse 9). A portion of the angels (the heavenly hosts) who followed Satan in his rebellion. Two thirds of the angels remained loyal to God; one third of the original angels joined Satan and are the origin of the many beings called “unclean spirits” (e.g., Mark 9:25). Though I don't presume to know if new spirits are born after the war, there were Jews that thought the 'Gup, the Storehouse of Souls' (Jewish premortal existence) could be exhausted. However, the scriptures seem to say they weren't the last angels to fall because of rebellion. There were the rebellions led by Belial, Rahab, Azazel, Dumah, Helel, the Prince of Tyre, and those angels with them. If spirits were born after the war seemed to have plenty of opportunity to join Satan, though whether they get locked inside of nature like Satan's angels do or if they get locked away in the prisons of Tartarus. Either way, it seems like a mature consequence. Culpability of Spirits When intelligences were crafted into spirit bodies, we have full awareness, personality, consciousness and agency. As the literal offspring of Heavenly Parents, they taught us as much as we were able to comprehend as spirits. “Spirits are capable of intellectual advancement, love, hate, happiness, sorrow, obedience, disobedience, memory, and other personal characteristics.” (“Spirit Body,” Wilson K. Andersen, Encyclopedia of Mormonism, New York: Macmillan Publishing Company, 1992). However, in our premortal state we were limited in our ability to achieve a fulness of happiness, such as enjoyed by our Heavenly Parents. Furthermore, due to the limitations inherent in existence as spirit beings, we were “subject to oppression” from the powers of darkness (Ehat & Cook, Words, McIntire Minute Book: 19 January 1841 (Tuesday), p. 62.) so even in the premortal world, opposition and temptation existed. However, the power to resist and choose remained. In order for us to overcome evil and enjoy eternal felicity, it was necessary for us to acquire a physical body which could later be resurrected into an immortal one. Spirits were not helpless beguiled victims of Lucifer’s deception. God taught the plan clearly to the premortal spirits. Jesus was presented as the chosen Savior. Satan offered an alternative (Moses 4:1–4). The spirits were not in ignorance. They were not naïve or underinformed - they received instruction according to their level of spiritual development. They knew what the costs were if they had it their way, “Satan... sought to destroy the agency of man, which I, the Lord God, had given him.” (Moses 4:3) In fact, it is often thought the “War in Heaven” was not a war of violence, but of ideas, allegiance, and choice. One-third of the hosts of heaven chose rebellion was seen as willful and informed, not accidental. “A third part of the hosts of heaven turned he away from me because of their agency.” (D&C 29:36) Thus, their punishment - being denied physical bodies and eternal progression - was a direct result of their own mature choices. Thus doctrine affirms culpability. True, premortal spirits were not omniscient and were still developing, they were sufficiently advanced to comprehend right from wrong, truth, and to make informed, moral choices. This is what justifies the consequence of eternal separation from God, as it is for everyone else. The spirits who followed Lucifer in the War in Heaven did so with agency, knowledge, and accountability. Although spirits lacked a physical body and were not yet perfect, they were morally responsible for their allegiance. This undergirds the justice of their banishment.

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2025/06/26/gordon-monson-some-latter-day/ Gordon Monson, a longtime columnist, known for takes often critical of the LDS Church, is attempting a nuanced position here. As he actually acknowledges and praises the incredible acts of service and unity among Latter-day Saints. And there is a valid point: Some members do feel overwhelmed, undervalued, or spiritually burned out trying to "earn heaven" through sheer busyness. He seems to suggest that is what the church "sermons" teach. President Nelson himself has warned against this in Come Unto Me, and Elder Holland has said, "You can’t run faster than you have strength." The Church does not officially teach that heaven is earned by checklist. Grace and the Atonement of Jesus Christ are central. If people feel like they're not doing enough. It’s appropriate to ask in prayer: “Lord, what would Thou have me do today?” Sometimes the answer might be “help your neighbor,” and sometimes it’s “rest, heal, and let Me take care of you.” This part of the article shifts from gentle critique to a deeply emotional warning, using a personal story to make a point: self-neglect in the name of service can be fatal. President Russell M. Nelson has urged us repeatedly to receive personal revelation, to care for our bodies, and to protect our spiritual and physical well-being. These are not side notes. They are core doctrines of discipleship. Yes, we’re taught to give. But not without wisdom. The scriptures themselves say: “See that all these things are done in wisdom and order; for it is not requisite that a man should run faster than he has strength.” (Mosiah 4:27) Indeed, her death shouldn't have been the price of discipleship. In this Church, we believe in covenants. We believe in consecration. But those sacred principles were never meant to be twisted into chronic exhaustion, guilt, or martyrdom. The scriptures don’t say, “Give until you die of stress.” They say, “Let virtue garnish thy thoughts,” and, “Be temperate in all things.” What eternal reward is there for ignoring the Spirit when it prompts, “Go to the doctor.” We cannot pour living water into others if our own well runs dry.

I was allowing for 80% the most claims of seemingly miraculous interventions are certainly just 'unidentified human' interventions. Reserving 20% to allow any type of non-human, angelic interventions, even if suspiciously ordinary. We are told angels walk among us, ministering to us, of which we are mostly unaware. "Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares." (Hebrews 13:2)

Well, I'm certain 80% of the time its indeed just members or even total strangers listening to the spirit and timely helping out. Like if it happened on Christmas, I don't think Santa Claus literally exists, but I'm not sure there wasn't ever a Santa, or there are no Christmas miracles that happen, even material blessings, by some sort of actual divine being that may as well be Santa, even though 80% of the time is just kind people willing to take no credit and it gets attributed to Santa. I do like to think the world may have more in it we don't see.

Three Nephites To begin, The Three Nephites come from 3 Nephi 28 in the Book of Mormon. Jesus Christ arrived in the Western hemisphere and chose Twelve Nephite disciples, grants nine of His disciples the desire to come quickly to Him after death, but three request to remain on Earth until His Second Coming (similar to the apostle John 21:20–23). Christ blesses them to tarry in the flesh until his second coming (3 Nephi 28:4-9), they can show themselves unto whatsoever man seems to them as good. There is an ever-increasing body of stories circulating among the people of three or two strangers, sometimes in white, who suddenly appear (not miraculously but no one sees to know where the come from) to individuals in physical distress, helps them solve their problems, and then suddenly disappear the way they came, not to be seen again. Like three big guys protect a woman, healing illnesses, leading a person to a difficult to find library book or family history resource. "Translated" State: Temporary Immortality, they aren't quite Resurrected Beings. When they do resurrect, they won’t suffer pain or death as mortals do. Immune to prison, fire, wild beasts, and other harm. Freedom to travel and preach to all people. LDS Folklore and Legends: Over time, many unofficial stories arose in the early LDS and testimonies emerged of mysterious strangers doing good deeds that are ultimately attributed to the Three Nephites. These stories usually feature: 1-3 strangers, helping someone in need; often stranded travelers, struggling farmers, missionaries, etc. The strangers disappear mysteriously after the good deed. The upon retrospection the helped person realizes the man was “not ordinary”—perhaps even divine. The tale often become secondhand or thirdhand folktales. You know someone who knows someone. Common settings include: Frontier Utah life, early LDS missionary efforts elsewhere, natural disasters or life-threatening situations. Remote places with no plausible help nearby. Usually in disguise, they are only identified by their unidentifiability and their elusiveness. Three Nephites never identify themselves and disappear, no records. Usually they'll present as missionaries. Yet they don’t eat, rest, or stay, unlike normal missionaries. There are thousands of Three Nephites stories collected by folklorists like William A. Wilson. BYU and other LDS institutions have recorded many of these, showing how faith and folklore blend. Eastwood Hatton and the Three Nephites My family has a Three Nephite account. Somewhere in bath county Kentucky. I don't remember the year, before the World Wars, but the family remembers it clearly. Young Eastwood Hatton is gravely ill. Then, without warning, two LDS missionaries appear at the door on foot. Only say they were there to bless Eastwood. They enter the home, lay hands upon Eastwood’s head, and give him a blessing in the name of Jesus Christ. When the blessing is over, they leave quietly, walking away the same direction they came. Eastwood recovers completely. No one knows where they came from, nor where they went, and are never seen again. Attempts to track down the missionaries evidently fails. The family believes these men were not ordinary missionaries, but possibly even two of the Three Nephites. Their sudden arrival, the healing, and the vanishing without a trace all point to something divine. The story has passed down through the family. So, How 'boutit? Have any of you have an encounter with the Three Nephites or heard of a story in your family about the Three Nephites or mysterious visitors who helped someone and disappeared without a trace? I’d love to hear if your family has similar stories. If you aren't LDS, perhaps you've met an angel, or The Wandering Jew, or St. John. Please share if you’re comfortable.

Or that four of the first eleven Prophets of the Church bore the name Smith adds symbolic weight. The word Smith, in the Bible, is always used in mundane ways – in the context of metalwork, woodwork, etc. Except for one time. One use of the word stands out as unusual. Joseph the Smith of the Lord in the Latter-days Isaiah 54 describes the gathering of Israel in the latter days. It comes straight after the famous chapter about the suffering and atonement of the Messiah (chapter 53) but before the great "invitation" chapters (Isaiah 55+) a series of chapters about what Israel needs to do to be worthy of these things. Bolsters the idea that 54 describes what would follow in the aftermath of Christ’s redemptive work: the gathering of Israel and the re-establishment of His covenant people through modern prophets. Chapter 54 in particular seems to describe the modern day church. Verses 1–3: Match the early Church’s rise from obscurity in a "desert place" (Utah being literally in the desert). 1: The strength of the (mainly) Gentile believers (i.e., the church). 2: The terms "stake" (tent pole) and "ward" (tent peg) are routinely used for LDS congregations. 3: The church made its headquarters in a "desert" in the Gentile world, then grew. Verses 4-10: The church is compared to a woman. The healing of her spiritual widowhood - the end of the apostasy. 4: The church began in 1830 as a persecuted minority. For over a thousand years before that, it had no prophetic head (it was like a widow). 5: But now it is God's true church once more 6-8: It was called again from a period of apostasy, but now the apostasy is over. 9-10: The church will never again fall into apostasy. Verses 11-12: The future will be glorious. Verse 13: "And all thy children shall be taught of the LORD" Verse 14: The church is far from its oppressors (spiritually they cannot damage it; physically it was safe in the deserts of 'the tops of the mountains') Verse 15: The church's enemies shall fail to stop it. Verse 16 "Behold, I have created The Smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work" Verse 17: "No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper." Many of these words have special contexts. This is the only time in the Bible that "smith" is used out context of other craftsmen, and in the context of a last days' figure of a prophecy. It seems specific and singular. This is not the general term for a group of workers but "the smith." The word "bloweth" can be seen in the sense of "breathes life into" or "puts the spirit into." Also, the word translated as "coals" is not the usual word for coals. It refers to the black, charred remains. It is only used three times in the Bible: Proverbs 26:21 where glowing coals are compared with the black remains, and in Isaiah 44 where those who make idols, are disparagingly referred to as working in just the black remains (e.g. they are not able to make anything worthwhile). All this is quite consistent with the idea the church had been apostate (a widow, having lost its husband, the Lord), and so the fire had gone out. But the Lord will send a Smith to turn the dead remains into a living fire again, forging the church an instrument in the hands of God. Like "A stone cut out without hands" "And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people...Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands... and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure." (Daniel 2:44–45) “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized by revelation, and is that stone which is rolling forth to fill the whole earth.” - Joseph Smith, History of the Church, vol. 5, p. 531 “This gospel of the kingdom shall never be taken from the earth again, but shall remain to usher in the millennial reign of the Savior.” - D&C 138:44 Additional circumstantial name is Hyrum, Joseph Smith's brother, who was assistant president of the church, and was martyred alongside Joseph. Hyrum (or Hyram) means "my brother is exalted."

I googled key words (as google will search the forum better than the forum search) and found this. Was this deleted thread?

I know little of Dan, I've seen him speak when LDS podcasters want a clip of someone authoritative to give short and well-explained answers. I heard he went on (ex-)Mormon Stories, but didn't watch it, but heard he didn't explain his beliefs. So, I just assume he does a lot of unbiased textual criticism of the Bible and Early Christianity and in that way his unbiased materials inadvertently favors the church. I always assumed Dan may or may not have great faith but enjoys the academic freedom the church generally affords him to pursue truth, and also may never publicly proclaim his faith, to never show his bias in his work or to the public. Reminds me of how Jordan Peterson isn't considered a Christian by the way he views Biblical stories as "true-myths", so he's in a position where he doesn't need to defend any inerrant truth claim.

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I wanted to post more topics since the cyber-attack, but this one took me hours. I wanted something fun and interesting, and trying to write it more introductory for the newbies, write disclaimers for the devote, trying to get sources for Calm. Preface: There are sources and interpretations - especially among Latter-day Saint scholars and LDS thinkers that connect Joseph Smith with the role of mythical Messiah ben Joseph in Jewish eschatology. While this was never formal doctrine of the LDS Church, the parallels between have been drawn based on: Thee Messiah and a messiah There have always been messiahs - anointed individuals raised up for divine purpose. What made Jesus “the Messiah” to the Christians wasn’t merely that He was anointed, but that He fulfilled the Jewish prophesy of an anointed prophet, priest and/or king after there was no other legitimate anointed kings or high priests left in Israel for 490-years of a Jewish apostasy. The Davidic line had been interrupted. Daniel 9's prophesied time had passed. The temple priesthood had been corrupted (cf. Matthew 23). No reigning Jewish king. Joseph Smith, similarly, in the aftermath of centuries of Christian fragmentation, apostasy, and political corruption: There was no anointed apostle alive - the line had broken at some point by 1830 (the Nephites weren't in Apostasy until 500 AD, so who knows where else they might have still existed after that). There was no temple, no high priest, no legitimate priesthood. Sure, authority was claimed by succession and institution but no one claimed to be divinely anointed by heavenly messengers with power from on high. With the same inscripturating authority of past Apostles to stand out. Then came Joseph Smith, Anointed by angelic hands of Peter, James, and John and John the Baptist. Not just a reformer, but a restorer of keys, covenants, temples, and the priesthood line that had been lost. Midrash and the Messiah ben Joseph Midrash are Jewish commentaries. Midrash Tanhuma, Bereshit 1 – Introduces the idea of two messiahs to come, "There shall be two deliverers, one from Joseph and one from Judah." Two anointed dignitaries, who attend the Lord of all the earth (Zech. 4:14). One messiah is a descendant of Joseph, and the second a descendant of David. This son of Joseph, whom all will recognize as the Tzaddik (righteous one) of his generation (of the preexistent figures of the Council of the Tzaddikim, like Adam, Enoch, Noah, etc), will sacrifice his life so that the footsteps of the Messiah might be heard, and the land shall mourn. The second Messiah, the son of David, makes his home in a heavenly palace, where he waits for signs that the time for the coming of the Messiah be David has arrived. Each Messiah has a separate role. Messiah, the son of David, will redeem the Shekhinah, along with all the holy sparks that were scattered during the six days of Creation. Messiah, the son of Joseph, will redeem the souls of those who fell through sin and transgression, and will free the souls of the righteous that were transmigrated (Jewish reincarnation) into objects and animals, like fish, and the souls of the righteous will be raised up. There are many odd Rabbinical thoughts, but there are two primary conceptions of these Messiah in Judaism: one, the earthly Messiah, a descendant of Joseph, who is the righteous one of his generation; the other, a descendant of David, who serves as an instrument of salvation. Eventually the first, earthly Messiah, paves the way for the divine one. Joseph Smith ben Joseph In LDS theology, Joseph Smith acts as a forerunner to Jesus Christ’s Second Coming (cf. D&C 133; 135:3). Joseph Smith was of the tribe of Ephraim, and restored priesthood authority, temples, and scripture, laying the groundwork for the Second Coming of Christ, often associated with a “Davidic” Messiah figure. The LDS belief in a two-phase restoration and redemption era - Restoration followed by Second Coming - matches the two-messiah model in Midrash Tanhuma. Joseph Smith received a patriarchal blessing from his father, Joseph Smith Sr., on December 9, 1834, which contains one of the earliest clear statements about his tribal identity. It says: "Thou shalt be called a seer, a translator, a prophet... The Lord thy God hath called thee by name out of the heavens; thou art a descendant of Joseph, through the loins of Ephraim, his son..." (Patriarchal Blessing of Joseph Smith Jr., Dec. 9, 1834) However, Patriarchal blessings in the early Church often declared individuals as descendants of Ephraim - including Brigham Young, John Taylor, and others. There are two ways to take the claim, and both can be true: a. Adopted Much like Ephraim was adopted by Jacob-Israel, Gentile converts to Christianity are being adopted into Israel through baptism and covenant. This “adoption” is a spiritual grafting (Romans 11) and a priesthood-based inheritance. In the modern LDS church confirms that Gentiles are being adopted into the House of Israel when they accept the gospel. This becomes literalized in patriarchal blessings, where many converts - regardless of ethnic heritage - are declared descendants of Ephraim. LDS identity as a spiritual people of Ephraim, as the Gentiles adopted into Israel spiritually transmutes them into a tribe, or by the decree of the laws of heaven, getting either serendipitously placed into Ephriam (And why not? Ephriam himself was also adopted by Israel), alternatively there is the idea all Gentiles might actually be remnants of the Kingdom of Ephriam dispersed to other lands, especially the lands of the north. b. Literal Descent LDS scriptures (esp. 2 Nephi 29:12–14, D&C 110, 3 Nephi 21) teach that the ten tribes of Israel were scattered among the nations/Gentiles. Many Gentile converts may unknowingly descend from Ephraim, as his tribe was part of the Northern Kingdom that was scattered by Assyria (ca. 721 BC) and dispersed among the Gentiles. These "lost tribes" would be mixed into other nations, so their descendants (remnants) could include many of today's peoples. Thus, a Gentile convert may: Be spiritually adopted into Ephraim; Or may literally descend from Ephraim, unknown to them until revealed by the Spirit (patriarchal blessing). The Book of Zohar and Messiah ben Joseph Redeeming the Lost Dead Passages in the Book of Zohar (Zohar 2:120a and 3:153b) the foundational book of Jewish Kabbalah — describe: Mashiach ben Yosef as a redeemer of souls, especially those scattered or entrapped in material or sinful states. He is tasked with raising up the fallen sparks (souls) and preparing the world for full redemption. His mission is mystical, preparatory, and soul-oriented, not just political. Joseph Smith introduced the doctrine of spirit world work, baptism for the dead, and eternal sealing ordinances - all about redeeming souls who were otherwise lost. This “rescuing of souls” aligns a bit with the mystical vision of elevating fallen sparks (nitzotzot) and freeing transmigrated souls (gilgulim). Recovery and elevation of lost souls. Scroll of Secrets and Messiah ben Joseph's Hidden Works Megillat Setarim (Scroll of Secrets) is a mystical and somewhat apocryphal Jewish text, quoted and interpreted by medieval Kabbalists. Speaks of hidden roles of the messiahs, especially Mashiach ben Yosef working in secret, preparing the land and people without full recognition. Often viewed as a text revealing the esoteric operations of redemption behind the scenes. Joseph Smith’s life involved spiritual experiences (First Vision, Moroni visitations) that are not publicly believed and led to rejection. Much of his work Book of Mormon, priesthood restoration, temple endowments occurred in and nearly remains in relative obscurity, fitting the archetype of a hidden messiah. LDS temples contain knowledge that is: Restricted to initiates (worthy members), revealed progressively, associated with salvation and exaltation, matching the concealed spiritual themes in Megillat Setarim. The Talmud and Messiah ben Joseph's Martyrdom The Talmud interprets a verse of mourning to refer to the death of Messiah ben Joseph, which causes national mourning. “What is the cause of the mourning [in Zechariah 12:12]? It is the slaying of Messiah the son of Joseph.” (Talmud Bavli, Sukkah 52a) Joseph Smith was slain by a mob in 1844, despite being both a spiritual leader and national figure to his followers. Presidential candidate. His death was deeply mourned by early Latter-day Saints. D&C 135 speaks of the “mourning of Zion” and describes him as a martyr whose death sealed his testimony. He also died a martyr, seen by early Saints as a sacrificial figure whose death furthered God’s plan. D&C 135:3 calls him a man who “sealed his testimony with his blood.” He “prepared the way” for Christ’s second coming through the Restoration. Vilna Gaon & Kol HaTor and Messiah ben Joseph Building Zion Rabbi Elijah ben Solomon Zalman (1720–1797), known as the Vilna Gaon (the Genius of Vilna), a towering Lithuanian Jewish scholar, Talmudist, Kabbalist, and mystic. He had strong messianic beliefs rooted in the return to Zion and the active role of human beings in redemption Kol HaTor “The Voice of the Turtledove” is a work attributed to Rabbi Hillel Rivlin of Shklov, a leading disciple of the Vilna Gaon. Allegedly written in the late 18th century, the manuscript was hidden for generations and rediscovered and published in the 20th century. The book details the Messiah ben Joseph, echoing earlier Midrash and Zohar, Kol HaTor teaches that: a. Messiah ben Joseph begins the physical and political restoration of Israel (building cities, gathering exiles, preparing the land). While the Messiah ben David completes the spiritual redemption and final victory over evil. Joseph Smith initiates the Restoration, builds Zion, gathers Israel, and lays the groundwork (literally in the sense of LDS temples and cities) but the final return of Christ (a Davidic Messiah figure) will complete the redemption. b. Messiah ben Joseph as a Suffering, Sacrificial Redeemer Kol HaTor explicitly states that Messiah ben Joseph must suffer, and possibly die, in his efforts to redeem Israel. His work is not “miraculous” but earthly, gradual, and political - paving the way for divine intervention. Joseph Smith’s martyrdom is interpreted by many Saints as sacrificial, necessary to seal his testimony and advance the divine plan (see D&C 135:1–3). His life and death prepared the way for the millennial reign of Christ. c. Restoration Before Redemption Kol HaTor emphasizes that redemption begins through natural, political, and preparatory steps, not sudden miracles. It speaks of building up Jerusalem, gathering scattered tribes, and restoring priesthood functions before divine deliverance. In LDS thought, the Restoration of the priesthood, gathering of Israel, temple work, and missionary labor in LDS theology all precede the Second Coming. The Saints see their work as part of Zion’s physical and spiritual rebuilding. d. The Role of Ephraim and the North Kol HaTor ties Ephraim's descendants to the leadership of redemption, not just as symbols but as active builders of Zion. Messiah ben Joseph is associated with the tribe of Ephraim, from the Lost Ten Tribes, believed to dwell in the “lands of the north” (cf. Jeremiah 31:8; D&C 133:26). Most Saints are declared of the tribe of Ephraim, given a special role in gathering Israel. D&C 133:26–34 echoes the Kol HaTor vision of northern tribes returning with sacred treasures, led by Ephraim. The Gospel of John and the Messiah ben Joseph Jewish leaders ask John the Baptist if he is the Messiah prophesied to come, John says, “When the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, ‘Who art thou?’ And he confessed and denied not, but confessed, ‘I am not the Christ.’ And they asked him, ‘What then? Art thou Elias?'”. He was to come before the great and wrathful day of the Lord. “And he said, ‘I am not.’ ‘Art thou that prophet?'” He answered no. (John 1: 19 -21) "That Prophet" is thought to be the Messiah Ben Joseph tradition. ================================================================= Sources: B. Sukkah 52a; Midrash Tanhuma-Yelammedenu, Bereshit 1; Megillat Setarim. Studies: An Unknown Jewish Sect by Louis Ginzberg, pp. 209-256. ================================================================= Warning: The existence of the Messiah ben Joseph and its sources are not recognized by the LDS Church LDS doctrines are based on canonized revelation via living prophets. Kabbalah and Midrash texts are post-biblical, extra-scriptural, and not recognized by LDS leaders as inspired. LDS leadership and apologists often avoids terms like “secret” or “mystical” because they imply gnostic ideas, counter to our assurance of the universal accessibility of the gospel. The Zoharic idea of raising fallen sparks, gilgulim (reincarnation) are rejected. We reject reincarnation, soul transmigration, and mystical cosmology foreign to the restored gospel. Humans are born of spirits that were born of eternal intelligences and are linear in progression, not recycled fragments of divine essence like in mystical Judaism. However: I understand there is tension between LDS conservative views that tend to push out untraditional views, to either defend tradition and orthodoxy and make Mormonism ordinary and respectable to the world, which requires not indulging in such bizarre notions as anything but bizarre, no matter how interesting. And the LDS liberal views that tend to flirt with blasphemy and even devilry yet are at least open to even the most unexpected revelations. So, what do you think? Is there is any merit to the Jewish Messiah Ben Joseph tradition? Or a mistake, a blend of the First and the Second Coming of Christ, hoping for a more warrior-like messiah? I think if Mormonism is true, it overturns much of what the world thinks is true. Symbols and traditions often survive longer than the memory and sources.

Cool beans. No one joined since Sunday. Did you simply turn off all new joining or is it on?

The easy thing he could do is cap the number of Topics per day in Social Hall. That should slow and contain it somewhat until he finds a more permanent solution. Then roll the forum back to 3 days, if there are saved snapshots. Deleting 3 days of new posts and users, not banning all the new users, so not blocking innocent newbies from just rejoining. We might lose posts but it might save him the work of deleting them all. The other thing is use Captcha for new users. I don't know if that costs anything.

Down Periscope (1996) Starring: Kelsey Grammer, Lauren Holly, Rob Schneider, Down Periscope is a Military Comedy. I never heard it, in fact my brother and I only watched it because we mistook it for Sgt Bilko with Steve Martin, but by a happy accident we loved it but didn't like Sgt Bilko. Lieutenant Commander Tom Dodge (Kelsey Grammer), an unorthodox submarine officer is given one last chance to prove his worth to the U.S. Navy. He’s assigned a rusty, outdated diesel sub for a wargame exercise. He must "invade" the U.S. coastline while evading detection by the entire nuclear Navy, led by Admiral Graham (Bruce Dern), a hard-nosed superior who is using the event for his own career advancement, and so he handpicked a misfit crew to ensure his failure. Dodge must turn his ragtag crew of rejects and oddballs into a naval force. An underdog story, filled with heart, clever outside-the-box tactics, and a little bit of dry bathroom and sophomoric humor. There’s no political satire, just a refreshing anti-authority spirit that pokes fun at military bureaucracy, rigid hierarchies, and traditional notions of discipline. Down Periscope is a cult classic that never got the credit it deserved. Kelsey Grammer delivers a calm yet irreverent balance, wielding authority to redirect the crew's wanton mischief productively. Lauren Holly plays Lt. Lake, a sonar expert whose presence on a traditionally all-male crew causes commotion. Rob Schneider chews scenery with comedic gusto as the uptight XO. Harland Williams steals every scene he’s in as the spacey sonar man, E.T. Full Content Warning (PG-13) Mild to moderate profanity (e.g., h*ll, d*mn, *ss. One or two uses of “b*tch” and “b*st*rd”. No f-words). Some innuendo and suggestive dialogue for laughs. A running joke about the placement of a tattoo. A few crude remarks about the female officer aboard. No real violence. Just naval war games.

So far, new users can post new topics only in the Social Hall until they reach a certain number of posts (25). The spam bot posts multiple new topics in the Social Hall, suggesting everything is working within the limits set but it's still spamming. Mormon Dialogue uses Invision Community, which has standard anti-spam tools, here are things likely not tried: Update anti-bot tools: Some bots bypass older protections. Anti-spam Plug-ins: Auto-flagging for first posts with links or repeated phrases. Enable auto-moderation for topics with suspicious keywords or URLs. New Topic Creation Limit: Probably 1 topic per day in the Social Hall to reduce spam volume. This is a typical throttle setting. _________________________________________________ Spam: 1. a meat-like product, rumored to contain a mixture of ham and pork (it stands for "SPiced hAM"), made popular when it was distributed to soldiers on the fronts during World War II. 2. the focus of a sketch on Monty Python's Flying Circus involving a diner which featured meals such as "spam, egg, spam, spam, bacon and spam" and "spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, baked beans, spam, spam, spam, and spam". Trying to find anything in that diner which did not have Spam quickly became quite difficult. This idea was been carried over onto the internet for when someone posts the same thing in thousands of newsgroups, or when one person (or a group of people) fill up a newsgroup with off-topic posts, or many copies of the same off-topic post, was called "spamming the net"; the individual posts are called "spam" in reference to this skit.

Letting others know will help you be accountable. Self-medicating stress with substances can become a spiral, and that can be with any substance, even sugar. So, it's not just about cutting off one substance, but proactively choosing how else you will deal with stress. Now that your brain knows alcohol works, you can say "no" today, but who knows what you'll say if it gets bad. You ideally want to find a more natural slow hitting dopamine replacement to manage stress. Reading a good book or gardening is a primary example of delayed satisfaction. A pet or house plant to care for could give you small hits of joy. Listen to music and cook. There is also sometimes a pendulum effect if you have too much joy, it can be hard to stay high, so one thing you can do is choose to have a good cry. Watch sad movies or pray to God and let the tears come, use a scream pillow, or a punching pillow. Release as much as you can, you'll feel better, as the pendulum swings back to equilibrium.

Sidekicks (1992) "Sidekicks" is a 1992 martial arts / adventure film. In my opinion, a better version of Karate Kid in the 90s, that was mostly forgotten and was never available on DVD, currently available for free on Fawesome, Hoopla, Pluto TV, The Roku Channel, and Tubi TV. The story is of Barry, a highschooler with asthma which limits him physically is bullied by a bigger boy jealous how he steals all the attention from a girl who pitties him, as everyone is painfully aware he is constantly daydreaming and is talking in his dreams out loud in class and regularly embarrasses himself. He's dreaming of being in random adventures as the side kick of his hero Chuck Norris. The film is a conduit for all the films of Chuck Norris, yet you can't compare this to any other Chuck Norris film, it stands apart as thee best of his films. The over-the-top dream sequences with Chuck Norris is a delight. If any movie would inspire a kid to have an interest in martial arts, I can't think of any movie better. On par with Cobra Kai. Barry (Jonathan Brandis) is taught martial arts by his teacher's uncle Mr Lee (Mako) and culminates with an exciting martial arts exhibition where he gets everything he ever wanted and so ends his need to daydream. A wish-fulfillment movie for kids. Occasional intentional silliness of Richard Moll as the ridiculous gym teacher, and Piscopo as the always over-the-top assorted bad guys in all dream sequences and the karate sensei of the bully in the opposing dojo, and the quirky sensei Mr. Lee, owner of the Frying Dragon restaurant, who gives amusing life lessons while tossing dumplings at his head when his mind drifts. Family friendly : Some violence, and a villain says an A-word.

Well, the photo is not much like it, its probably a 'slow cooker meal', a chuck roast that fells to pieces with the yellow or red potatoes cooked with skins still on to keep it together, slow cooked all together. It's the easy version. This is a more feed-a-whole-family version a whole vat of peeled Russet Potatoes. I find it hard to find a photo of actual 'Brown Potatoes', searches get it confused with “oven browned potatoes” brown from the oven – There’s not an official or widely known culinary name for this exact item. I prefer a leaner cut of beef, so it does not break apart, neither do I slice it, I tare strips off with a fork as needed and keep the shape, and it tares away into sandwich long strips. Another thing to do with the remaining broth is to throw some bits of the meat and broken veg back in the pot with a spoon or 2 (half of the tiny cans) of tomato paste and a three or four spoons of flour, stir and boil it until it doesn't taste like neither tomato paste nor floor, it will look like a mistake, a little soupy or clumpy but just cool, it will thicken and smooth out, it's now a half gallon of left-over beef stew. Otherwise, the broth used to get dumped out. Chuck Roast Rump Roast Stew Beef in Beef Stew

Sunday Pot Roast & Brown Potatoes Ingredients: For the Roast: 1 rump roast, about 2.5 to 3 lbs 1 large yellow onion, chopped 2 dashes of salt (And more to taste) 1–2 tsp black pepper 1/2 cup dried minced onion 1 tbsp oil or use any beef fat with the roast for searing 6–8 cups water (enough to nearly cover the roast, not overflow pot) For the Vegetables (added later): 1 lb large Russet potatoes, peeled and halved lengthwise 3–4 carrots, peeled and halved Extra salt, pepper, and dried onion for re-seasoning Optional: splash of beef broth concentrate or a beef bouillon cube Cooking Schedule: Before Church (Start 7:00 AM) Step 1: Sear the Roast Preheat a large gallon stock pot (or heavy Dutch oven) over medium-high heat. Add oil and chopped onion. Stir and cook until onions soften and brown (5 min). Add roast, season with salt all over and sear roast on all sides (5–8 minutes), until dark brown crust forms. Sprinkle in dried onion and pepper. Step 2: Add Water & Simmer Add 6–8 cups of water — just enough to almost cover the meat (about ¾ full). Bring to a strong boil then down to a low boil. Cover tightly with aluminum foil or the pot lid to seal in moisture. Lower heat to just maintain a low simmer, and leave it while you attend church (8 AM–12 PM). Midday Check (Optional — 12:30 PM) When home, carefully check water level. If it’s below half, top off with hot water. Check the roast — it should be tender but still holding shape. Let it continue simmering if needed. Afternoon Final Prep (Start around 3 PM) Step 3: Remove Roast Take roast out and set aside (cover to keep warm). Taste the broth — it should be deep brown and salty-savory. Add a bit of salt, pepper, dried onion, or beef bouillon to enhance if needed. Step 4: Cook Potatoes & Carrots Add a bit of water if needed to bring liquid to half the pot. Bring broth to a boil, then lower to medium simmer. Gently add peeled potato halves and carrots while hot. They should fill the top layer. Boil for 5–8 minutes, uncovered. This helps “seal” the potatoes and prevents them from being mushy. Lower to gentle simmer, and cook uncovered another 45–60 minutes to let the broth soak in, or until: Potatoes are fork-tender but not falling apart. Carrots are fully soft. Broth has reduced to coat the potatoes lightly in a brown color. Final Step: Serve Keep in pot to keep warm or to keep soaked in broth, or put half in a serving bowl. Tips: Don’t stir the pot too much once veggies go in. Let them sit to soak flavor and form a soft “skin.” Lid off during final simmer = better flavor and slightly thicker broth. Leftovers keep beautifully to go with Monday's roast beef sandwich with miracle whip.

I'm making my second trek to see my mom for the last time before she dies. Cathy Sue Craycraft's lungs are filling up with liquid, she's oxygen hungry, she can't sit up and sit still to extract it, they have to sedate her to keep her face mask on, her heart failure is getting worse. This might be it. She's a candidate for hospice care, if she goes, she'll be dead in a week. I need the prayers of everyone I know. I would love for her to get better, but Iguess what I really want is to talk to her one last time to ask her 30 questions before I never can ask her again. If she can't talk, what other things I can do? Spiritually, she hasn't been to church for decades, she been very ill and dependent. What should I do?