The original reply from @InCognitus is found here. I branched into a new thread in
hopes of making it easier to follow.
There are two gatherings spoken of in the scriptures. One is of a spiritual
nature – where Israelites were joined to the church of Christ in the ministry of
Christ and subsequent evangelism to them and the Gentiles who would join the body
of Christ.
The other is a physical gathering of the Israelites to their land of inheritance
in Israel, not America.
I don’t believe all the members of the early church were only from the tribe of
Judah and Benjamin. The idea that there were no Israelites from the other ten
tribes who had not migrated from the north to the south prior to the Assyrian
captivity is an urban legend. It is also an urban legend that there were no
people of the ten tribes who went into Babylonian captivity who never returned
to Israel after 70 years.
I found this web site that has some ideas of the tribes that the 12 apostles came
from.
https://www.abrahamsdescendants.com/uploads/8/1/0/5/8105580/1270.910.pdf
I saw some commentary by John Darby. I’ll quote some of what he said.
Consequently we have, in chapters 11, 12, the Messiah and His reign, the source
of the millennial blessing of the people of God. The first verses of chapter 11 (1-5)
give his character; afterwards it is the effect of His reign.
The heading in the ESV of the Bible has for Isaiah 11 “The Righteous Reign of the
Branch”.
From my reading of Doctrine and Covenants 113, it tries to identify the rod and
the root but is not quite clear who these people are.
Who do you believe they represent?
Verses 3-4 – “What is the rod spoken of in the first verse of the 11th chapter
of Isaiah, that should come of the Stem of Jesse? Behold, thus saith the Lord:
It is a servant in the hands of Christ, who is partly a descendant of Jesse as
well as of Ephraim, or of the house of Joseph, on whom there is laid much power.
Verses 5-6 – “What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th
chapter? Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of
Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood, and the keys of the kingdom,
for an ensign, and for the gathering of my people in the last days”.
I don’t know the way that Christ will continue to bring the Israelites back to
their own land of Israel in the future in the way Isaiah 11 describes, but we
saw a glimpse of this in the events that led to the founding of the nation of
Israel in 1948.
I don’t believe in the theory of British-Israelism or that one or more tribes
will inherit the land of America (or specifically the United States) in the
future.
By spiritual Israel, I mean those who become members of the church of Christ
(whether they are literal Israelites or Gentiles).
When I read page 57 of the Religion 430-431 - Doctrines of the Gospel Student
Manual, it appears the literal blood of a Gentile changes into the literal blood
that coursed in Abraham's veins.
“... while the effect of the Holy Ghost upon a Gentile, is to purge out the old
blood, and make him actually of the seed of Abraham. That man that has none of
the blood of Abraham (naturally) must have a new creation by the Holy Ghost".
The New Era article in 2005 (“Your Patriarchal Blessing”) speaks more of this
literal blood issue.
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/new-era/2005/11/your-patriarchal-blessing?lang=eng
Thank you for that lineage chart of Abraham where you highlight the sceptre
promises of Judah and the birthright promises of Ephraim plus Manasseh (or maybe
you just meant Ephraim).
The firstborn in Israel’s family was transferred from Reuben to Joseph. I would
say the birthright (the right of the first born) passed to Manasseh since he was
born first but Jacob gave precedent on Ephraim over him. But each family of all
the subsequent sons of Jacob had their own first born in their respective families
that had the birthright.
But let’s focus on Ephraim for a moment. Numbers 26 lists three sons of his sons.
1 Chronicles lists eight sons (if I count right).
Which of Ephraim’s eight sons had the birthright blessing (the blessing given to
the first born)?
I would say Jacob’s immediate family, not the families that would come from all
the other 11 tribes. See my comment above.
Going back to the diagram you provided about the lineage of Abraham. You
highlighted the sceptre promises of Judah and the birthright promises of Ephraim.
The sceptre promises of Judah as King of Israel did not apply to all individuals
in Judah’s lineage. It was only to one reigning king, in whom Christ is the
ultimate fulfillment as the King of Israel.
Seeing that Ephraim did not hold the priesthood in the Old Testament and in the
New Testament church, on what basis do you assume that Jacob passed onto him any
priesthood role in the birthright blessing?
This is an approximate map of the land inheritance allotted to the twelve tribes.
Ephraim is not given a greater land inheritance. Even Manasseh exceeds that tribe.
What exactly do you believe is the land inheritance of Ephraim and Manasseh and
what in scripture indicates this greater land inheritance blessing that you mention?
I am aware of several teachings in the church’s seminary manual about the unique
role of Ephraim and the blessings.
Religion 430-431 - Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual
I’ll quote a few of them for reference. I don’t think I have a question about it
but I just observe that it does not mention a gathering of Gentiles. It focuses
primarily on the gathering of Israel.
On page 58:
“The great majority of those who become members of the Church are literal
descendants of Abraham through Ephraim, son of Joseph. Those who are not literal
descendants of Abraham and Israel must become such, and when they are baptized and
confirmed they are grafted into the tree and are entitled to all the rights and
privileges as heirs” (Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:245–46)”.
On page 64:
B1. The gathering of scattered Israel is a result both of God’s mercy and also of
Israel’s repentance (see Isaiah 54:7; Ezekiel 11:17; Jeremiah 50:4–5; 2 Nephi 10:7;
30:7).
B3. The raising of an ensign to the nations is the signal for Israel to be gathered
home in the latter days (see Isaiah 5:26; 11:12).
B6. Of the twelve tribes, the tribes of Joseph’s sons, Ephraim and Manasseh, will
be gathered first and then direct the other tribes in their gathering (see JST,
Genesis 48:5–11; Deuteronomy 33:16–17; D&C 133:30–39).
On page 65:
As complete as was the scattering, so shall be the gathering of Israel” (Talmage,
Articles of Faith, 328–29).
On page 66:
‘We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten
Tribes;
“Now, the gathering of Israel consists of joining the true church and their coming
to a knowledge of the true God.
“By and by the Jews will be gathered to the land of their fathers, and the ten
tribes, who wandered into the north, will be gathered home.
“It is essential in this dispensation that Ephraim stand in his place at the head,
exercising the birthright in Israel which was given to him by direct revelation.
Therefore, Ephraim must be gathered first to prepare the way, through the gospel
and the priesthood, for the rest of the tribes of Israel when the time comes for
them to be gathered to Zion. The great majority of those who have come into the
Church are Ephraimites. It is the exception to find one of any other tribe, unless
it is of Manasseh.
“It is Ephraim, today, who holds the priesthood. It is with Ephraim that the Lord
has made covenant and has revealed the fulness of the everlasting gospel. It is
Ephraim who is building temples and performing the ordinances in them for both the
living and for the dead. When the ‘lost tribes’ come—and it will be a most wonderful
sight and a marvelous thing when they do come to Zion—in fulfilment of the promises
made through Isaiah and Jeremiah, they will have to receive the crowning blessings
from their brother Ephraim, the ‘firstborn’ in Israel” (Smith, Doctrines of
Salvation, 3:252–53).
Page 94:
A3. Scattered Israel would be gathered home (see Articles of Faith 1:10; Jeremiah
16:14–16; Amos 9:8–15; 2 Nephi 25:15–17; Jeremiah 31:6–14; 1 Nephi 22:11–12).
Page 95:
Israel has been and is being gathered to the land of Zion. The Jews are returning
to Jerusalem.
What gathering and to where do you believe Jeremiah 31:1-17 refers to?
I included that reference to the seminary manual because it doesn’t teach Joseph
Smith is in Isaiah 40-48, but rather it is Christ.
It says “Isaiah 40–48 - Isaiah writes about Jesus Christ, who will act as a shepherd
to Israel and a light to the Gentiles”.
The seminary’s manual mention of Isaiah 49 also doesn’t refer to Joseph Smith.
Isaiah 49:5-6 – “And now the LORD says, he who formed me from the womb to be his
servant, to bring Jacob back to him; and that Israel might be gathered to him— for
I am honored in the eyes of the LORD, and my God has become my strength—It is too
light a thing that you should be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob and to
bring back the preserved of Israel; I will make you as a light for the nations,
that my salvation may reach to the end of the earth.”
Act 13:46 - Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the
word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you,
and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.
Act 13:47 - For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light
of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.
In these verses, I believe Paul and Barnabas are representing the light but they
themselves are not the light.
Yes. Christ’s earthly mission was initially to the “circumcision” (Romans 15:8).
Paul says a similar thing of himself in Galatians 2:7-8 (“But contrariwise, when
they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel
of the circumcision was unto Peter; For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the
apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles”).
Jesus gave us a foreshadow of his calling to the Gentiles in John 10:16 (“And other
sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall
hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd").
I think there is plenty in Romans 15 where Paul identifies Christ and ties this
with his quote of Isaiah 11:10. The heading in the ESV Bible is “Christ the Hope
of Jews and Gentiles”.
I will highlight all the places Christ is referenced:
Romans 15:8 - For I tell you that Christ became a servant to the circumcised to show
God's truthfulness, in order to confirm the promises given to the patriarchs,
Romans 15:9 - and in order that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy. As it
is written, “Therefore I will praise you among the Gentiles, and sing to your name.”
Romans 15:10 - And again it is said, “Rejoice, O Gentiles, with his people.”
Romans 15:11 - And again, “Praise the Lord, all you Gentiles, and let all the peoples
extol him.”
Romans 15:12 - And again Isaiah says, “The root of Jesse will come, even he who arises
to rule the Gentiles; in him will the Gentiles hope.”
I believe the jealousy came about because God only recognized the temple in
Jerusalem.
With all that was going on in the original thread, I may have missed directly
answering some of your questions. Please feel free to restate them if my answers
in this thread did not.
Thank you.
