Thou Shalt Be Overweight: Religious Involvement Correlated to Obesity

[Deborah]

On the other hand, it's remarkable that Utah is so skinny given how many kids Mormons tend to have. I'd say Word of Wisdom observance has worked out pretty well for them.

My DIL has had 7 kids. She looks better now than 10 years ago. She faithfully does PX-90 everyday. A lot of the women in my neighborhood are very active in the gym and walking and running, and they all have multiple children, and all look great.

I really think it isn't a Mormon thing or a religious thing but a neighborhood thing where people are motivated and have access to a healthy environment. Our community center has a fantastic gym. We have a lake and many walking trails. That is conducive to getting out and being active. We also have a lot of farmers markets in the summer so fresh produce is easily available. It does help that when one is more educated he/she is usually also more health conscious.

[LDS Guy 1986]

My mentor and pioneer in environmental medicine just came out with a book on this subject if anyone is interested. Excellent read on a new perspective on health. My link

Yeah, I don't read the books of diet gurus and diet doctors, because the diet fads are not medicine or science, the key to health is to use what you consume. Genetics and environmental factors play key roles on your physical appearance that the vanity of society does not take into consideration. The problem with the "obesity epidermic" is the sedimentary lifestyle not diet.

Also there are people who are very healthy and active yet still are considered overweight, look at linemen in the NFL, look at professional body builders, ect.

The problem is that society has so perverted the concept of body image that no one can fit into the "norm" anymore. People are killing themselves by over exerting themselves and under nurishing there body to fit into the vanity of the newest generation of fashion idiots.

300 years ago the fatter the sexier you were, not it the opposite the slimmer the sexier, both are completely idiotic. Eat your fill, be active, and you body will stay healthy and beautiful, now each person's body composition is different so we have to learn to understand this and not expect women to have a waist that is the diameter of a pencil with a DDD bosom, and a man to have a Herculean physique.

Some are skinny by nature, some more heavy set, the big thing is how active are they. I know plenty heaver set guys (myself included) that can out run a lot of the "in shape" people out there.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

It's those potlucks! I guess we should be drinking 2% milk.

"Are you drinking 1% because you think you are fat? You could be drinking whole milk if you wanted to."

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

Well at least we Mississippians scored first in something for a change.

Things must be looking up.

edit add..

Got Cornbread?

Hahaha, great.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

A article describing the study can be found here.

Not another "Christine Johnson" thread.

Sorry, but when you look at the map and see that Utah (which is highly relgious) does not have quite the "fat" problem of other states, it makes me wonder if something else is a factor other than religion.

[3DOP]

LDS Guy 1986,

These are data from the CARDIA prospective epidmiologic study. Before you call it unscientific junk, you might want to first determine what a prospective epidmiologic study really is. If and when you do, you will realize that a study that follows more than > 2400 individuals over 25 years has tremendous statistical power. In fact, such as study design is about as far as one can get from "unscientific junk" when it comes to epidemiology.

The links should be intact in the quote box below. You can check out the CARDIA study for yourself. Once you read about the CARDIA stury, I would be interested in your views as to why you think this is "unscientific junk".

Smoking and drinking are obvious vices? Not where I go to church. It looks to me from the map like it might be that being a Republican tends to make you fat.

[LDS Guy 1986]

Smoking and drinking are obvious vices? Not where I go to church. It looks to me from the map like it might be that being a Republican tends to make you fat.

Wait now that sounds like you are using statistics to draw a causal relationship where these is no cause because you are leaving out potential factors that can reasonably explain both events and why there is a correlation (not a cause and effect) between them!

I would of swore that someone already brought this up?

[LDS Guy 1986]

LDS Guy 1986,

These are data from the CARDIA prospective epidmiologic study. Before you call it unscientific junk, you might want to first determine what a prospective epidmiologic study really is. If and when you do, you will realize that a study that follows more than > 2400 individuals over 25 years has tremendous statistical power. In fact, such as study design is about as far as one can get from "unscientific junk" when it comes to epidemiology.

The links should be intact in the quote box below. You can check out the CARDIA study for yourself. Once you read about the CARDIA stury, I would be interested in your views as to why you think this is "unscientific junk".

See if you read my post or ever listen in your college or high school statistics class at all, you would know that statistics show a correlation between two things, they not not show CAUSE of anything.

A correlation between attendance of religious services and obesity rates DOES NOT mean attending religious services CAUSES obesity or increases the likelihood of becoming obese.

A correlation is a pattern between two independent events, there can be a positive correlation (as one event increases the other does too) and negative correlation (as one event increases the other decreases) or no correlation (the numbers show no consistent pattern) .

Now it is important to know that a pattern between two things DOES NOT mean that A causes B or vice versa, there can always be some lifestyle or other event or item to consider that explains both things.

For example, I can tell you that people that make more money tend to be more literate, than those who make less money, this is a statistical fact.

Does that mean that money causes a person to become more literate?

NO, it means that there is a positive relationship between someone's income and there reading level, those who made more money were more literate. Now I am guessing that the cause of this correlation is that people who tend to make more money also tend to have advanced degrees from college, and when you attend college your reading skills are strengthened making you more literate than someone who didn't attend college (and makes less money for not having an advanced degree).

The same applies here, as previous posts have shown younger people are not attending religious services very regularly these days. So taking this into consideration that means that population of people who reguarly attend relgiious services is going up. That older people are the ones attending religious services more frequently than the youth, now can you think of another thing that increases as one get's older? BINGO, you got it older people tend to be more heavy set than the youth, there metabolism is lower than the youth so they tend to have a few extra pounds around the mid region!

This means that the loss of youth (especially young adults) from active religious services makes the pool has more older and my genetics prone to be overweight.

For this study to imply that religion makes someone fat, is a lie and it is to abuse the math to suit a political means.

[LDS Guy 1986]

Here's the map if people would prefer just skipping right to that:

See this is what always amazes me about this lie called the Obesity Epidemic, since when is 33.8% a majority?

When I think epidemic people I think at least 50.1%, yeah people are becoming more heavy set based on the BMI, but who cares the BMI was made by insurance brokers not Medical Doctors.

In the worst state in the nation for obesity Mississippi, the obese are still outnumbered 2 to 1 by non obese!

[BookofMormonLuvr]

It doesn't surprise me. Food can be a comfort drug.

Most of the world will go drown their sorrows and cope from stress with alcohol and drugs, but most religious folks refrain.

The LDS population also has an obesity problem just like the entire nation with the same problems and stressors. We like our food and most of it is unhealthy including "it does a body good".

If members of the Restoration would follow the health advice (ALL of it) given in the Word of Wisdom, there wouldn't be such a problem.

[44Foxtrot]

See this is what always amazes me about this lie called the Obesity Epidemic, since when is 33.8% a majority?

When I think epidemic people I think at least 50.1%, yeah people are becoming more heavy set based on the BMI, but who cares the BMI was made by insurance brokers not Medical Doctors.

In the worst state in the nation for obesity Mississippi, the obese are still outnumbered 2 to 1 by non obese!

LDS Guy 1986,

Anyone who thinks that a majority of the individuals in a population need be afflicted with a specific disorder for that disorder to be considered at epidemic levels has no business whatsoever commenting on epidemiology studies.

Again, please, please do some reading or at least look up a few key word definitions before commenting. For example, if you had read the following easily accessible definition from a Wiki, you have been all set.

In epidemiology, an epidemic (??? (epi)- meaning "upon or above" and ????? (demos)- meaning "people"), occurs when new cases of a certain disease, in a given human population, and during a given period, substantially exceed what is expected based on recent experience.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

A article describing the study can be found here.

And it is here on the Mormon Board because?

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Did they control for region? That map makes me think the problem may be Southern cooking.

Food of the gods!

[LDS Guy 1986]

In epidemiology, an epidemic (??? (epi)- meaning "upon or above" and ????? (demos)- meaning "people"), occurs when new cases of a certain disease, in a given human population, and during a given period, substantiallyexceed what is expected based on recent experience.

Yes, I agree with this, and given that our lifestyle as become more sedimentary how are we substantially exceeding what is expected based on recent experience?

It is reasonable to expect that people with a less active lifestyle would have would have more fat weight, so once again where is the epidemic? Our obesity rates are following the expected rates given the lifestyle of Americans if not under the rate expected given our lifestyle. With the way all these doctors act like the world is coming to an end one expects far higher rates than 33.8% in the fattest nation in the county.

Americans are not as obese as people try and say they are, there is roughly 2 non obese people for every obese person in the nation. How is that an substantially exceeding what is expected given we live in a nation that is less active physically today than it was in the past?

It isn't substantially exceeding what is expected, it isn't even exceeding what is expected, obesity is not an epidemic by your given definition, it is the result of lifestyle choice.

[44Foxtrot]

See if you read my post or ever listen in your college or high school statistics class at all, you would know that statistics show a correlation between two things, they not not show CAUSE of anything.

A correlation between attendance of religious services and obesity rates DOES NOT mean attending religious services CAUSES obesity or increases the likelihood of becoming obese.

A correlation is a pattern between two independent events, there can be a positive correlation (as one event increases the other does too) and negative correlation (as one event increases the other decreases) or no correlation (the numbers show no consistent pattern) .

Now it is important to know that a pattern between two things DOES NOT mean that A causes B or vice versa, there can always be some lifestyle or other event or item to consider that explains both things.

For example, I can tell you that people that make more money tend to be more literate, than those who make less money, this is a statistical fact.

Does that mean that money causes a person to become more literate?

NO, it means that there is a positive relationship between someone's income and there reading level, those who made more money were more literate. Now I am guessing that the cause of this correlation is that people who tend to make more money also tend to have advanced degrees from college, and when you attend college your reading skills are strengthened making you more literate than someone who didn't attend college (and makes less money for not having an advanced degree).

The same applies here, as previous posts have shown younger people are not attending religious services very regularly these days. So taking this into consideration that means that population of people who reguarly attend relgiious services is going up. That older people are the ones attending religious services more frequently than the youth, now can you think of another thing that increases as one get's older? BINGO, you got it older people tend to be more heavy set than the youth, there metabolism is lower than the youth so they tend to have a few extra pounds around the mid region!

This means that the loss of youth (especially young adults) from active religious services makes the pool has more older and my genetics prone to be overweight.

For this study to imply that religion makes someone fat, is a lie and it is to abuse the math to suit a political means.

LDS Guy 1986,

Perhaps you should show up at the NIH or a major medical school in your area and offer to provide the professionals there the benefit of your great wisdom when it comes to epidemiological studies, the application of statistics and the means of determining the probability of a causal association between treatment and an outcome.

In other words, you are wrong on so many counts in your above response that I fear it will take more time effort to get you sorted out than I have right now.

[LDS Guy 1986]

If members of the Restoration would follow the health advice (ALL of it) given in the Word of Wisdom, there wouldn't be such a problem.

I think there would be less overweight people but not as much as many expect, like I have said before weight gain and loss is not a constant, it is very dependent on genetics and some people got the crap genes that leaves them with poor metabolism.

I am much more concerned with people getting out and having regular physical activity for at least 30 mins a day than there weight or pants size.

Weight is impacted by a lot more than physical activity and diet, people are obsessive about weight because of vanity not because people who weight less are healthier. You can be skinny and still have high blood pressure, high cholesterol, and die of a heart attack before you are 55. Weight is not a good measure of overall health, it never has nor ever will be, one can be overweight and still be an active and healthy adult or child.

[44Foxtrot]

And it is here on the Mormon Board because?

Last time I checked, Mormonism was counted among the religions practiced in the US.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Last time I checked, Mormonism was counted among the religions practiced in the US.

An almost immeasurable amount

[Jeff K.]

Foxtrot hasn't really provided the analysis that establish paramaters. Now is he willing to concede an LDS anomaly. IT is mostly due to his personal prejudice and bigotry towards Mormons. The data can be staring right at his face, as it has several times and he will continue to cling to the dogma that the LDS data is or should be equal to the general religious data.

Does he have such a hard time distinguishing between data groups? It really isn't that difficult, though perhaps for poor foxtrot it is?

[44Foxtrot]

An almost immeasurable amount...

Don't let the folks in the PR Department hear you talk like that.

--------------

According to the "Obesity Map" above, Utah has lower rates of obesity than most States in the US, and especially those in the Deep South. The OP article mentioned the "lack of vices" in some religions communities as mitigating against obesity. This may well be the case the case in Utah.

The alternative hypothesis might be that Utah has extraordinarily thin liberals (on average).

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Foxtrot hasn't really provided the analysis that establish paramaters. Now is he willing to concede an LDS anomaly. IT is mostly due to his personal prejudice and bigotry towards Mormons. The data can be staring right at his face, as it has several times and he will continue to cling to the dogma that the LDS data is or should be equal to the general religious data.

Does he have such a hard time distinguishing between data groups? It really isn't that difficult, though perhaps for poor foxtrot it is?

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

Don't let the folks in the PR Department hear you talk like that.

So says the evangelical athiest.

[44Foxtrot]

Foxtrot hasn't really provided the analysis that establish paramaters. Now is he willing to concede an LDS anomaly. IT is mostly due to his personal prejudice and bigotry towards Mormons. The data can be staring right at his face, as it has several times and he will continue to cling to the dogma that the LDS data is or should be equal to the general religious data.

Does he have such a hard time distinguishing between data groups? It really isn't that difficult, though perhaps for poor foxtrot it is?

As you can see, I have commented at the above Obesity Map for the US. And while I would have not have guessed a priori that Utah would be among the States with the lowest obesity rates, that is apparently the case.

However, the fact that Utah has low obesity rates in no way invalidates or calls into question the findings on religious practice and obesity that have come out of the CARDIA study.

[Jeff K.]

defending the indefensible again?

[LDS Guy 1986]

As you can see, I have commented at the above Obesity Map for the US. And while I would have not have guessed a priori that Utah would be among the States with the lowest obesity rates, that is apparently the case.

However, the fact that Utah has low obesity rates in no way invalidates or calls into question the findings on religious practice and obesity that have come out of the CARDIA study.

A statistical study DOES NOT SHOW CAUSE only correlation