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Glamour article on Mormon Virgin


Lamanite

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That was a survey done of BYU students. Surely you realize that BYU students make up a very small majority of LDS women overall, right?

Does it seem valid, or reasonable, to use a survey of a relatively few members of a group to claim that it proves that over half the entire female population of the group has done something?

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Condoms can prevent that.

Obviously.

Yet, a surprising number of responsible adults, with access to condoms, are dealing with those consquences. That suggests that the emotions invovled in the act of having sex are such that it's difficult for mature, responsible consenting adults to make mature responsible decisions at the time of intercourse.

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That was a survey done of BYU students. Surely you realize that BYU students make up a very small majority of LDS women overall, right?

Does it seem valid, or reasonable, to use a survey of a relatively few members of a group to claim that it proves that over half the entire female population of the group has done something?

The study says 58% of mormon women admit to having had pre-marital sex, not 58% of BYU students. Thanks for playing.

58% seems astoundingly low.

Evidently mormon women have a statistically immense gulf between them and their non-mormon peers.

Anyone know the % of American women in general who have had premarital sex? 90%?

So?

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Virtually nonexistent consequences for responsible adult sexual partners with access to birth control.

If that were true, then mature responsible adults with access to birth control who have children out of wedlock or STDs would be virtualy nonexistent.

I think you'll find though that such situations are fairly prevelant, which would seem to imply that such consquences for that group of people are more 'existent' then some want to admit.

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Obviously.

Yet, a surprising number of responsible adults, with access to condoms, are dealing with those consquences. That suggests that the emotions invovled in the act of having sex are such that it's difficult for mature, responsible consenting adults to make mature responsible decisions at the time of intercourse.

So? The option is there for people to exercise agency? You do believe people have agency right? I have yet to acquire a sexually transmitted disease and I have yet to have had any children despite multiple partners. So... your argument... children and venereal disease? It isn't so valid.

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mature responsible adults with access to birth control who have children out of wedlock or STDs would be virtualy nonexistent

Mature, responsible adults with access to birth control who unintentionally have children out of wedlock or STDs would be virtually nonexistent amongst mature, responsible adults.

Fixed.

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The study says 58% of mormon women admit to having had pre-marital sex, not 58% of BYU students. Thanks for playing.

I'm not playing, i'm trying to have a mature discussion with you. If you're not capable of that then just tell me now so we can both stop wasting our time.

The study (done 20 years ago by two byu sociology students it seems) does not seem to say where their findings come from. I'd be more willing to accept that the study says what you have interpreted it to say if you could show me that information. If you can't, there's no way to know that your statement is actual factual and the % represents the whole of the female LDS population rather than LDS girls in a certain area.

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So? The option is there for people to exercise agency? You do believe people have agency right? I have yet to acquire a sexually transmitted disease and I have yet to have had any children despite multiple partners. So... your argument... children and venereal disease? It isn't so valid.

My argument was that there are physical consquences to having sex outside of marriage. My statement had nothing to do with agency. Some people smoke for their whole lives and never get cancer and some people drive drunk and never kill anyone, but that doesn't make the reality of those consequences invalid.

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So, LDS women are far less (statistically, astoundingly less) likely to engage in premarital sex than their non-LDS peers.

I think most LDS members would count that as a very positive thing.

Who cares? Outside of a Mormon population, that number is irrelevant. The reality is that the more negative consequences of sex are the result of poor sex education. This occurs when a culture is very closed minded about sex. If you look at the statistics for the most open-minded country... the Netherlands (where prostitution is legal and there is sexual activity on TV), you can see that they have sex, on average, at a later age than Americans, get pregnant less, get less STD's, and have less abortions per pregnancy. The Christian approach has been terribly unsuccessful.

Even if you just tally in Utah stats, you can see that something is very wrong in the typical US approach when compared to more enlightened countries.

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My argument was that there are physical consquences to having sex outside of marriage. My statement had nothing to do with agency. Some people smoke for their whole lives and never get cancer and some people drive drunk and never kill anyone, but that doesn't make the reality of those consequences invalid.

See my previous post plus...

By your logic, considering that driving is the most dangerous thing we can do in our daily lives, we should all stop driving.

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I'm not playing, i'm trying to have a mature discussion with you. If you're not capable of that then just tell me now so we can both stop wasting our time.

The study (done 20 years ago by two byu sociology students it seems) does not seem to say where their findings come from. I'd be more willing to accept that the study says what you have interpreted it to say if you could show me that information. If you can't, there's no way to know that your statement is actual factual and the % represents the whole of the female LDS population rather than LDS girls in a certain area.

You claim that you want to have a mature discussion, yet the first thing about this study you posted was based off of a quick read of the first sentence of the first link, despite the fact that there are pages and pages of links. Only when I called you on it, did you bother to take a closer look, and, even still, you aren't able to accept it. The study is derived from questions from three other studies that were examining a larger group of women across America.

Also, the studies had been conducted over a 20 year period.

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Virtually nonexistent consequences for responsible adult sexual partners with access to birth control.

"No doubt, love, but as long as people are still having promiscuous sex with many anonymous partners without protection while at the same time experimenting with mind-expanding drugs in a consequence-free environment, I'll be sound as a pound!" Austin Powers.

If this Austin Powers quote reflects your belief system (not you specifically SilverKnight), then any emotional or physical consequences produced by fornication can be mitigated to a great degree using certain methods; so I mostly agree with you. The problem is that when anyone's actions is at odds with their behaviors it creates a negative emotional state. This girl is in the midst of a massive paradigm shift that is a result of that type of emotional state. She is simply shifting and adjusting her belief system to accommodate her actions rather than the reverse.

Big UP!

Lamanite

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