Expiration date on the Atonement?

[CV75]

Elder Hafen has a very balanced approach to the Gospel.

I rarely concern myself with those who will abuse the system. They will do what they will do despite our best intentions. And if and when they return let us rejoice and kill the fatted calf. I find that I am in complete agreement with President Faust when he said, " I am frank to admit that when I say my prayers, I do not ask for justice; I ask for mercy." (Faust 1997 italics added) And I extend that policy towards others.

The atonement satisfied justice-- justice is not my concern. It is His grace and mercy- combined with my own ever increasing discipleship/conversion that makes a difference in my life. Once I've charted a course for the Celestial Kingdom and am generally moving forward, I am good.

"As members of the Church, if we chart a course leading to eternal life; if we begin the processes of spiritual rebirth, and are going in the right direction; if we chart a course of sanctifying our souls, and degree by degree are going in that direction; and if we chart a course of becoming perfect, and, step by step and phase by phase, are perfecting our souls by overcoming the world, then it is absolutely guaranteed--there is no question whatever about it--we shall gain eternal life. Even though we have spiritual rebirth ahead of us, perfection ahead of us, the full degree of sanctification ahead of us, if we chart a course and follow it to the best of our ability in this life, then when we go out of this life we'll continue in exactly that same course. We'll no longer be subject to the passions and the appetites of the flesh. We will have passed successfully the tests of this mortal probation and in due course we'll get the fulness of our Father's kingdom--and that means eternal life in his everlasting presence. " (McConkie 1976)

Big UP!

Lamanite

(Precisely! And before the resurrection and judgment!) -- couldn't help myself.

[Calm]

You bet I believe they could repent if they wanted to.

When speaking of a similar topic, Brother Millet wrote, "Isn't such an approach risky? Aren't there those in the Church who will take advantage of this line of reasoning and then seek to rationalize their indifference, negligence, and eve disobedience? Yes, I suppose there will always be those who want to take license in gospel liberty. But I feel keenly that there is a greater risk: That those who are really trying to do their best but falling short will yield to discouragement and conclude that they are simply not cut out for eternal glory. " (Within Reach p 5)

Big UP!

Lamanite

My opinion is that the Atonement was set up for this estate, including mortality and the spirit life afterwards. Once resurrections and the judgment where people chose which kingdom they belong to in the next stage of life occurs, the Atonement has been fulfilled for them. I think the scriptures point to the 'tying up loose ends' at that time so to speak.

That does not limit though, imo, that there may be another process by which they could turn their lives around, both for those from the pre-existence and those from post-existence. If God is infinitely patient and merciful, it is logical to me there are mechanisms available to all at any time; I just see the Atonement as being attached in a specific way to Mortality due to how it works and interacts with humanity. For me it is not just a symbolic act, but something real and concrete that works a certain specific way on certain specfic attributes of our current human state. Being in a different state in pre and post-mortality, a different process seems logical to me to be needed.

[Lightbearer]

So in your mind, there is no possibility that 1.2 trillion years from now, someone in the Telestial kingdom would be incapable of wanting to become something more? That person could not humbly and sincerely pray that the atoning blood of the Son of God be applied to his sins and begin to chart a course of repentance and discipleship? Or rather, he could do such a thing, the Savior would just have to shrug his shoulders and say, "sorry... my hands are tied. My atonement had a shelf life."

Big UP!

Lamanite

Not if you believe the D&C:

(D&C 76:109-112)"But behold, and lo, we saw the glory and the inhabitants of the telestial world, that they were as innumerable as the stars in the firmament of heaven, or as the sand upon the seashore; And heard the voice of the Lord saying: These all shall bow the knee, and every tongue shall confess to him who sits upon the throne forever and ever; For they shall be judged according to their works, and every man shall receive according to his own works, his own dominion, in the mansions which are prepared; And they shall be servants of the Most High; but where God and Christ dwell they cannot come, worlds without end."

I think when the day of probation (meaning this mortal life and the world of spirits) is past then that is the expiration date of those promises. It is "everlastingly too late" as far as advancing in the kingdoms of glory, or so says the vision.

[DeepThinker]

Not if you believe the D&C:I think when the day of probation (meaning this mortal life and the world of spirits) is past then that is the expiration date of those promises. It is "everlastingly too late" as far as advancing in the kingdoms of glory, or so says the vision.

Perhaps the scripture means they cannot come to where God & Christ dwell, worlds without end, as long as they are only willing to abide a Telestial Law.