Whence the name, Nephi

[USU78]

2 Maccabbees 1:24 And the prayer was after this manner; O Lord, Lord God, Creator of all things, who art fearful and strong, and righteous, and merciful, and the only and gracious King,

1:25 The only giver of all things, the only just, almighty, and everlasting, thou that deliverest Israel from all trouble, and didst choose the fathers, and sanctify them:

1:26 Receive the sacrifice for thy whole people Israel, and preserve thine own portion, and sanctify it.

1:27 Gather those together that are scattered from us, deliver them that serve among the heathen, look upon them that are despised and abhorred, and let the heathen know that thou art our God.

1:28 Punish them that oppress us, and with pride do us wrong.

1:29 Plant thy people again in thy holy place, as Moses hath spoken.

1:30 And the priests sung psalms of thanksgiving.

1:31 Now when the sacrifice was consumed, Neemias commanded the water that was left to be poured on the great stones.

1:32 When this was done, there was kindled a flame: but it was consumed by the light that shined from the altar.

1:33 So when this matter was known, it was told the king of Persia, that in the place, where the priests that were led away had hid the fire, there appeared water, and that Neemias had purified the sacrifices therewith.

1:34 Then the king, inclosing the place, made it holy, after he had tried the matter.

1:35 And the king took many gifts, and bestowed thereof on those whom he would gratify.

1:36 And Neemias called this thing Naphthar, which is as much as to say, a cleansing: but many men call it Nephi.

So, all you Hebreao-hellenic scholars. "Men call it Nephi," is here coupled rhetorically with the word, placed in Nehemiah's mouth at the time of the dedication of the 2nd Temple, "Naphthar . . . a cleansing." Are we to take from this rhetorical coupling of the two words that "Nephi" has something in it of the concept of "cleansing," as in the cleansing of the Temple upon dedication/rededication?

Or is it simply a place name?

[mnn727]

nevermind

[maklelan]

So, all you Hebreao-hellenic scholars. "Men call it Nephi," is here coupled rhetorically with the word, placed in Nehemiah's mouth at the time of the dedication of the 2nd Temple, "Naphthar . . . a cleansing." Are we to take from this rhetorical coupling of the two words that "Nephi" has something in it of the concept of "cleansing," as in the cleansing of the Temple upon dedication/rededication?

Or is it simply a place name?

The Greek says Nephthai, and it seems to come from the word nephos, which refers to a pile of clouds. Nehemiah calls it a katharismos, which can be translated "cleansing," but more accurately, "purification," or "ablution." I personally think it's just another bizarre word the Septuagint translators made up.

[LeSellers]

As I have written elsewhere in this forum, I believe that "Nephi" derives from the same root as "Nephilim" ("Giants" in Genesis).

Nephi described himself as "large in stature" â?? and Hebrew names were more than mere sounds, they carried meanings as the parents felt impressed to remind their children of moral virtues, historical events (e.g., "Ichabod" â?? "there is no glory", grandson of Eli born when his mother heard her husband, brother-in-law, and father-in-law had died and lost the Ark of the Covenant) and so on.

If we see Sariah giving birth to a ten-pound, six-ounce boy, I have no trouble seeing her naming him "Little Giant", i.e., "Nephi". Something like Jack's mother reminding her ball-headed son, "Do you know how much trouble I had when you were born?"

Lehi, aka, "Jawbone"

[maklelan]

As I have written elsewhere in this forum, I believe that "Nephi" derives from the same root as "Nephilim" ("Giants" in Genesis).

Nephi described himself as "large in stature" â?? and Hebrew names were more than mere sounds, they carried meanings as the parents felt impressed to remind their children of moral virtues, historical events (e.g., "Ichabod" â?? "there is no glory", grandson of Eli born when his mother heard her husband, brother-in-law, and father-in-law had died and lost the Ark of the Covenant) and so on.

If we see Sariah giving birth to a ten-pound, six-ounce boy, I have no trouble seeing her naming him "Little Giant", i.e., "Nephi". Something like Jack's mother reminding her ball-headed son, "Do you know how much trouble I had when you were born?"

Lehi, aka, "Jawbone"

But nephilim doesn't mean "giants" in Hebrew, it means "the fallen," and it refers to the warriors of Israelite legendary antiquity. The "giants" interpretation derives from the Septuagint translation, which is exegesis based on the idea that these fallen heroes of old were larger than normal humans. Numbers 13:33 incorporates those legendary ideas into the Moses narrative.

[LeSellers]

But nephilim doesn't mean "giants" in Hebrew, it means "the fallen," and it refers to the warriors of Israelite legendary antiquity. The "giants" interpretation derives from the Septuagint translation, which is exegesis based on the idea that these fallen heroes of old were larger than normal humans. Numbers 13:33 incorporates those legendary ideas into the Moses narrative.

Hmmm.

another great theory shot to pieces by facts.

I still wonder if "Nephi" could be related. Not for the same reason as before, but solely due to the Hebrew letters required to make the words.

Lehi

[Sevenbak]

Interesting thread. I think this name discussion also needs the mention of Tephi, daughter of King Zedekiah, who reportedly escaped with Jeremiah to the british isles at the time Jerusalem was destroyed and Mulek fled to the Americas.

http://www.asis.com/users/stag/jerrytea.html

[maklelan]

Hmmm.

another great theory shot to pieces by facts.

I still wonder if "Nephi" could be related. Not for the same reason as before, but solely due to the Hebrew letters required to make the words.

Lehi

It would need the third letter of the root to maintain the semantic value. I think an Egyptian origin is most likely for Nephi, but I haven't seen any theories that account for the all the problems.

[Mighty Curelom]

It would need the third letter of the root to maintain the semantic value. I think an Egyptian origin is most likely for Nephi, but I haven't seen any theories that account for the all the problems.

It is only partly of Egyptian origin.

The name "Nephi" is actually a combination of the English word "Knee" and the Egyptian word "fi," meaning "downward" or "to fall." "Nephi" then, can be understood to mean, literally, to fall down on one's knees. It is a description of worship or piety, and therefore a fitting appellation for the Book of Mormon Nephi.

[maklelan]

It is only partly of Egyptian origin.

The name "Nephi" is actually a combination of the English word "Knee" and the Egyptian word "fi," meaning "downward" or "to fall." "Nephi" then, can be understood to mean, literally, to fall down on one's knees. It is a description of worship or piety, and therefore a fitting appellation for the Book of Mormon Nephi.

There are three Egyptian words that mean "to fall" (hr, h3, w3), and none of them have the letter /f/ in them. The word "downward" is h3l.

[Connolly]

It is only partly of Egyptian origin.

The name "Nephi" is actually a combination of the English word "Knee" and the Egyptian word "fi," meaning "downward" or "to fall." "Nephi" then, can be understood to mean, literally, to fall down on one's knees. It is a description of worship or piety, and therefore a fitting appellation for the Book of Mormon Nephi.

There are three Egyptian words that mean "to fall" (hr, h3, w3), and none of them have the letter /f/ in them. The word "downward" is h3l.

Well, that settles it then...

unless MC was making a lame joke. I'll give him credit for the effort though.

[Olavarria]

Check out me blog. http://mormoncodex.blogspot.com/2009/07/nfr-and-nephites.html

John Gee has shown that the Egyptian adjective/personal name Nfr(male form) is attested in Aramaic inscrpitions as "Nefee". It means "good, beautiful,perfect".

[USU78]

It is only partly of Egyptian origin.

The name "Nephi" is actually a combination of the English word "Knee" and the Egyptian word "fi," meaning "downward" or "to fall." "Nephi" then, can be understood to mean, literally, to fall down on one's knees. It is a description of worship or piety, and therefore a fitting appellation for the Book of Mormon Nephi.

This is all quite true, but you fail to recognize the broader implications, MC, as per usual. The British chronicalers got it wrong, misquoting Jack's Nephil (Giant), who really said, "Ne-phi-pho-phum."

[katherine the great]

The British chronicalers got it wrong, misquoting Jack's Nephil (Giant), who really said, "Ne-phi-pho-phum."

Good one!