The Strait and Narrow Way

[T-Shirt]

There are three occasions in the Book of Mormon where the phrase, "strait and narrow" is found:

1 - 2 Ne. 31: 18-19

18 And then are ye in this strait and narrow path which leads to eternal life; yea, ye have entered in by the gate; ye have done according to the commandments of the Father and the Son; and ye have received the Holy Ghost, which witnesses of the Father and the Son, unto the fulfilling of the promise which he hath made, that if ye entered in by the way ye should receive.

19 And now, my beloved brethren, after ye have gotten into this strait and narrow path, I would ask if all is done? Behold, I say unto you, Nay; for ye have not come thus far save it were by the word of Christ with unshaken faith in him, relying wholly upon the merits of him who is mighty to save.

2 - 1 Ne. 8: 20

20 And I also beheld a strait and narrow path, which came along by the rod of iron, even to the tree by which I stood; and it also led by the head of the fountain, unto a large and spacious field, as if it had been a world.

3 - Hel. 3: 29

29 Yea, we see that whosoever will may lay hold upon the word of God, which is quick and powerful, which shall divide asunder all the cunning and the snares and the wiles of the devil, and lead the man of Christ in a strait and narrow course across that everlasting gulf of misery which is prepared to engulf the wickedâ??

I have often found this somewhat curious for a couple of reasons. First, the word, "strait" means, "narrow", and it would be, therefore, redundant to use "strait" and "narrow" together. Secondly, this is very similar to Matthew 7:13-14, which reads:

13

[Redeemed]

My conclusion............I Believe the bible.

Be Blessed,

redeemed

.

[T-Shirt]

My conclusion............I Believe the bible.

Be Blessed,

redeemed

.

Thanks, redeemed, so do I. Just curious though, why do you think these men of the early centuries quoted Matthew differently than what we have today?

Best,

T-Shirt

[Redeemed]

I really don't know?

Maybe they didn't have the King James Version

But i do think that God has preserved His Word for us.

Be Blessed,

redeemed

[T-Shirt]

I really don't know?

Maybe they didn't have the King James Version

But i do think that God has preserved His Word for us.

Be Blessed,

redeemed

Do you find it interesting that the Book of Mormon quotes the Bible, better than the Bible does?

T-Shirt

[urroner]

From the FARMS boys:

Was the Path Nephi Saw "Strait and Narrow" or "Straight and Narrow"

Straight (Not Strait) and Narrow

Straightening Things Out: The Use of Strait and Straight in the Book of Mormon

I really believe this is a non-issue.

BTW, I believe in the Bible too and Redeemed, I'm glad you believe in the Bible.

[oats]

Straight and narrow do not mean the same thing.

And as for the quotes from early church members and Matthew, what if they are translated differently? Neither is in its original language. Comparing the original manuscripts would be interesting in those cases.

Were the early church members quotes all translated by the same person?

[T-Shirt]

I think you are all missing the point. The spelling is a minor thing and not what I was focusing on. I find it interesting that the Bible we have today never uses the phrase, "strait/straight and narrow way", yet many early Church Fathers quoted it that way, which tells me that, at one time, it was in the Bible. The fact that the Book of Mormon uses the phrase just makes it that much more interesting. Maybe I am explaining it poorly.

Best,

T-Shirt

[T-Shirt]

Straight and narrow do not mean the same thing.

And as for the quotes from early church members and Matthew, what if they are translated differently? Neither is in its original language. Comparing the original manuscripts would be interesting in those cases.

Were the early church members quotes all translated by the same person?

You are correct, "straight" and "narrow" do not mean the same thing, but "strait" and "narrow" do. However, that is a side issue.

Best,

T-Shirt

[DispensatorMysteriorum]

There are three occasions in the Book of Mormon where the phrase, "strait and narrow" is found:

1 - 2 Ne. 31: 18-19

18 And then are ye in this strait and narrow path which leads to eternal life; yea, ye have entered in by the gate; ye have done according to the commandments of the Father and the Son; and ye have received the Holy Ghost, which witnesses of the Father and the Son, unto the fulfilling of the promise which he hath made, that if ye entered in by the way ye should receive.

19 And now, my beloved brethren, after ye have gotten into this strait and narrow path, I would ask if all is done? Behold, I say unto you, Nay; for ye have not come thus far save it were by the word of Christ with unshaken faith in him, relying wholly upon the merits of him who is mighty to save.

2 - 1 Ne. 8: 20

20 And I also beheld a strait and narrow path, which came along by the rod of iron, even to the tree by which I stood; and it also led by the head of the fountain, unto a large and spacious field, as if it had been a world.

3 - Hel. 3: 29

29 Yea, we see that whosoever will may lay hold upon the word of God, which is quick and powerful, which shall divide asunder all the cunning and the snares and the wiles of the devil, and lead the man of Christ in a strait and narrow course across that everlasting gulf of misery which is prepared to engulf the wickedâ??

I have often found this somewhat curious for a couple of reasons. First, the word, "strait" means, "narrow", and it would be, therefore, redundant to use "strait" and "narrow" together. Secondly, this is very similar to Matthew 7:13-14, which reads:

13

[bluebell]

I find it interesting that the Bible we have today never uses the phrase, "strait/straight and narrow way", yet many early Church Fathers quoted it that way, which tells me that, at one time, it was in the Bible. The fact that the Book of Mormon uses the phrase just makes it that much more interesting. Maybe I am explaining it poorly.

Best,

T-Shirt

Ah, yes, that does make more sense when you say it that way.

[shalamabobbi]

Don't forget 3 Ne 14:14

strait means (websters)

strict

rigorous

as well as narrow

all three uses are archaic

[Joseph Antley]

I think you've made an excellent and interesting observation, and I'm inclined to agree that this is evidence of the Book of Mormon's doctrinal authenticity.

[T-Shirt]

Don't forget 3 Ne 14:14

strait means (websters)

strict

rigorous

as well as narrow

all three uses are archaic

For the English word, this is true, however, the Greek word, "stenos", from which, "strait" is translated, means, narrow. I could be wrong, but I don't think there is another definition.

Best,

T-Shirt

[shalamabobbi]

For the English word, this is true, however, the Greek word, "stenos", from which, "strait" is translated, means, narrow. I could be wrong, but I don't think there is another definition.

Best,

T-Shirt

Yes, but you are discussing the BOM, not just the NT..

and if the lost phrase were to be found we don't know what other word might be used for strait (or straight)..

3Ne 14:14 eliminates the theory that JS misquoted the corresponding verse from the bible.

I agree with the likelihood of such a scripture having existed that is now lost. But I am inclined to disbelieve that when/if an ancient manuscript is found that contains it, it will do anything to convince an BOM critic that it is true.

[LeSellers]

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

ὅτι στενὴ ἡ πύλη καὶ τεθλιμμένη ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἀπάγουσα εἰς τὴν ζωήν, καὶ ὀλίγοι εἰσὶν οἱ εὑρίσκοντες αὐτήν.

Strait was the feminine singular adjective "στενὴ" in Greek:

στενός

stenos

1) narrow, strait

To agree grammatically with ἡ ὁδὸς, "the way", narrow was the feminine, singular, past participle "τεθλιμμένη":

θλίβω

thlibō

1) to press (as grapes), press hard upon

2) a compressed way

2a) narrow straitened, contracted

3) metaphorically to trouble, afflict, distress

Because it's in the nominative case, it's either a subject or a predicate nominative. It's used here in the passive voice as a participle in the perfect (past) tense to fill the function of an adjective.

The passage reads something like "How narrow is the gate and constricted is the way leading toward life and few are the finders of it." (Greek, like Hebrew, often only implies the verb "to be", unlike our English that uses it far more frequently.) The Emphatic Diaglott gives "difficult" for "τεθλιμμένη", and while it is not literal, it does convey the meaning nicely.

Lehi

[T-Shirt]

Yes, but you are discussing the BOM, not just the NT..

and if the lost phrase were to be found we don't know what other word might be used for strait (or straight)..

3Ne 14:14 eliminates the theory that JS misquoted the corresponding verse from the bible.

Just to make it clear, i don't think Joseph Smith made a mistake. I was simply pointing out that a critic could easily draw that conclusion.

Incidentally, the 1838 Webster's dictionary includes, "straight" as one of the definitions of, "strait". So, it seems that in the nineteenth century, the two words could be used interchangeably.

I agree with the likelihood of such a scripture having existed that is now lost. But I am inclined to disbelieve that when/if an ancient manuscript is found that contains it, it will do anything to convince an BOM critic that it is true.

Nor do I, but I still find it very interesting.

Strait was the feminine singular adjective "στενὴ" in Greek:

To agree grammatically with ἡ ὁδὸς, "the way", narrow was the feminine, singular, past participle "τεθλιμμένη": Because it's in the nominative case, it's either a subject or a predicate nominative. It's used here in the passive voice as a participle in the perfect (past) tense to fill the function of an adjective.

The passage reads something like "How narrow is the gate and constricted is the way leading toward life and few are the finders of it." (Greek, like Hebrew, often only implies the verb "to be", unlike our English that uses it far more frequently.) The Emphatic Diaglott gives "difficult" for "τεθλιμμένη", and while it is not literal, it does convey the meaning nicely.

Lehi

I have often felt that a possible translation would be "the gate is narrow and the way is difficult"

At any rate, my main purpose of this thread was to show that, anciently, the New Testament, in this case, seems to have read differently than it does today, and, that this more ancient reading agrees with the Book of Mormon.

Best,

T-Shirt

[T-Shirt]

I wonder if I claim this matter to be a Book of Mormon, "bullseye!", I might get more interest?

Best,

T-Shirt

[oats]

Thanks for pointing out the strait/straight oversight on my part. My blatant ignorance is the best way to make me remember something.

Were the books from the early church members translated by the same individual?

[rameumptom]

Good eye, Kerry.

Often I find it problematic when members of the Church over-emphasize Nephi's statement of "likening the scriptures" unto ourselves. This only accomplishes part of our spiritual schooling. The other part is we must seek to understand things as they were originally given, so we can understand how God touched the mind of the original author.

I've known that in Joseph's time, strait and straight were used interchangeably, as standard spelling still was not set throughout America. Mark Twain was yet to note that a person who only spelled one way had no imagination.

But your digging to find how others may have used this same phrase can only prove one thing:

Joseph Smith must have memorized the writings of all the Early Christian Fathers.