The New Day The Earth Stood Still

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Cold Steel:

Yes Global Warming is real. It is man made. While the US represents just 6% of the worlds population we contribute of 25% of the emissions that create Global Warming.

While I agree with you, it's still a lame plot change.

[Notquitewetyet]

They changed The Day the Earth Stood Still to an environmental parable?

In the original story Klaatu came to tell Earth that Galactic society wasn't going to let us remain warlike when we expand to the stars, and that the robot enforcers of his society would destroy our whole planet if we tried it. The basic motive was to prevent us from infringing on our more civilized neighbors or damaging their property - to prevent us from exporting war.

Why would galactic society care if we destroy just our own planet? It's no skin off their noses. In fact in the original, galactic society seems perfectly willing to destroy individual planets to keep the peace.

Hmm, a group changing a classic of science fiction to forward their own agenda. Why does that sound so familiar?

The original was just as agenda-driven: Cold War, nuclear arms, space race, etc. Science fiction has always been a genre which lends itself to activism.

[semlogo]

Global warming may very well be a real threat--but it is clear that some grasping, greedy people are pushing it to make money and their efforts IMO, are an affront to God. Knowing how he loves his children and made this world for us and we are to be grateful to him for the very air we breathe, does anyone think he would be happy with efforts by some to TAX the carbon emissions that come from us when we exhale? They want to take God out of everything. Rather than recognizing God and thanking him for the air we breathe, we are to pay the Govt. and acknowledge the Govt. for allowing us breath. Satan's dirty little fingers are unmistakable in the whole Stop Global warming "pie".

WAT.

Taxing greenhouse gas emissions makes sense from an economist's standpoint. It's all about creating incentives and addressing unintended consequences. But it has nothing to do with the air you exhale.

The science is real. To my knowledge no one is saying that worshiping God makes the world climate hotter. I'm not sure where you're getting that Satan is behind all the talk about global warming. Are Satan and science the same thing to you?

[semlogo]

I'm seeing a lot of antagonism towards real science from a lot of people on this board. Why is that? It can't be our religion. Mormonism isn't antagonistic toward science.

[Jason]

The original was just as agenda-driven: Cold War, nuclear arms, space race, etc. Science fiction has always been a genre which lends itself to activism.

Yes it was, and quite preachy about it (and unsubtle in its allusions as well - Klaatu was an obvious Christ figure even without adopting the alias of "John Carpenter").

I still find the environmental message more lame than the anti-nuclear war message of the original. Preventing a warlike species from spreading their adolescence throughout the galaxy is reasonable.

A species that wipes itself out because of how it mistreated the environment is self-correcting.

[thesometimesaint]

semlogo:

I don't know as it's so much as disputing the science. But probably as an unwillingness to accept it.

[Jigglysaint]

Can Man survive? Possibly.

Can Man survive this awful remake? Possibly not.

[Cold Steel]

They changed The Day the Earth Stood Still to an environmental parable? ... Hmm, a group changing a classic of science fiction to forward their own agenda. Why does that sound so familiar?

Shocking, isn't it?

Last night I was watching TV and noticed that The Ten Commandments was on. Goody, I thought, but alas, it was a made-for-TV version. Moses, in this version, would be walking along with people when suddenly he would pitch forward, grab his head and scream like it was being twisted off of him. Then we, the audience, could hear God talking to him and lo, God had Moses' voice! I suppose the point was that either God's voice inside one's head is a lot like one's own voice, or that Moses was putting peanut butter on the wrong side of his cracker, if you know what I mean....

It's often fascinating to see how other people interpret such things. This Moses seems to have had a lot of self doubts and wanted to be everyone's best bud. But anyway, that's what happens in movies. Despite the fact that we're still killing each other, Klattu comes all the way from Kolob to tell us that, first of all, this isn't "your" planet, meaning ours, and that we can be wiped out easily enough for the common good of the cosmos. In the 1951 movie he was a humanoid, but in this version he has to assume human form because, after all, superior beings can't be like...well, us.

In the early 1800s, things were still a bit nippy. Things had been very cold in the 1300s the planet was beginning to warm up. Of course, the Earth has undergone tremendous fluctuations in the past and had adjusted. Some animals had become extinct while others became dominant. But today's environmental movement doesn't seem to want anything to go extinct, even if it means walking 15 miles to work and back for the entire country.

My own opinion is that yes, man might be contributing to global warming, but only in an insignificant way. One good asteroid or one good volcanic detonation would, I think, have much more of an effect. The most effective ways of saving the planet, though, is through repentance, not by adding ethanol to your gasoline.

[ttribe]

In the interest of providing some support for the opposing viewpoint on humanity's alleged role in "global warming" - Link

[semlogo]

semlogo:

I don't know as it's so much as disputing the science. But probably as an unwillingness to accept it.

Right. I don't get it. The glory of God is intelligence, not willful ignorance based on some bizarre mistrust of science. Skepticism is healthy to a certain extent, but it seems that the fringe opinions receive no skepticism whatsoever by many of my fellow saints, while the most likely and best supported positions are treated as if we were talking about chemtrails or alien abduction.

I assume we all trust it enough to use computers, fly in airplanes and trust our health to licensed physicians.

[urroner]

Apparently, the a UN group of 50 or so meeting in Poland has issued a statement that man-made global warming is a fact beyond dispute, but wait, here are 650 other scientists not meeting in Poland saying these people of full of hot air: UN Blowback: More Than 650 International Scientists Dissent Over Man-Made Global Warming Claims

POZNAN, Poland - The UN global warming conference currently underway in Poland is about to face a serious challenge from over 650 dissenting scientists from around the globe who are criticizing the climate claims made by the UN IPCC and former Vice President Al Gore. Set for release this week, a newly updated U.S. Senate Minority Report features the dissenting voices of over 650 international scientists, many current and former UN IPCC scientists, who have now turned against the UN. The report has added about 250 scientists (and growing) in 2008 to the over 400 scientists who spoke out in 2007. The over 650 dissenting scientists are more than 12 times the number of UN scientists (52) who authored the media hyped IPCC 2007 Summary for Policymakers.

Some quotes from those 650 scientists:

â??I am a skepticâ?¦Global warming has become a new religion.â? - Nobel Prize Winner for Physics, Ivar Giaever.

â??Since I am no longer affiliated with any organization nor receiving any funding, I can speak quite franklyâ?¦.As a scientist I remain skeptical.â? - Atmospheric Scientist Dr. Joanne Simpson, the first woman in the world to receive a PhD in meteorology and formerly of NASA who has authored more than 190 studies and has been called â??among the most preeminent scientists of the last 100 years.â?

Warming fears are the â??worst scientific scandal in the historyâ?¦When people come to know what the truth is, they will feel deceived by science and scientists.â? - UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist.

â??The IPCC has actually become a closed circuit; it doesnâ??t listen to others. It doesnâ??t have open mindsâ?¦ I am really amazed that the Nobel Peace Prize has been given on scientifically incorrect conclusions by people who are not geologists,â? - Indian geologist Dr. Arun D. Ahluwalia at Punjab University and a board member of the UN-supported International Year of the Planet.

â??The models and forecasts of the UN IPCC "are incorrect because they only are based on mathematical models and presented results at scenarios that do not include, for example, solar activity.â? - Victor Manuel Velasco Herrera, a researcher at the Institute of Geophysics of the National Autonomous University of Mexico

â??It is a blatant lie put forth in the media that makes it seem there is only a fringe of scientists who donâ??t buy into anthropogenic global warming.â? - U.S Government Atmospheric Scientist Stanley B. Goldenberg of the Hurricane Research Division of NOAA.

â??Even doubling or tripling the amount of carbon dioxide will virtually have little impact, as water vapour and water condensed on particles as clouds dominate the worldwide scene and always will.â? â?? . Geoffrey G. Duffy, a professor in the Department of Chemical and Materials Engineering of the University of Auckland, NZ.

â??After reading [uN IPCC chairman] Pachauri's asinine comment [comparing skeptics to] Flat Earthers, it's hard to remain quiet.â? - Climate statistician Dr. William M. Briggs, who specializes in the statistics of forecast evaluation, serves on the American Meteorological Society's Probability and Statistics Committee and is an Associate Editor of Monthly Weather Review.

â??For how many years must the planet cool before we begin to understand that the planet is not warming? For how many years must cooling go on?" - Geologist Dr. David Gee the chairman of the science committee of the 2008 International Geological Congress who has authored 130 plus peer reviewed papers, and is currently at Uppsala University in Sweden.

â??Gore prompted me to start delving into the science again and I quickly found myself solidly in the skeptic campâ?¦Climate models can at best be useful for explaining climate changes after the fact.â? - Meteorologist Hajo Smit of Holland, who reversed his belief in man-made warming to become a skeptic, is a former member of the Dutch UN IPCC committee.

â??Many [scientists] are now searching for a way to back out quietly (from promoting warming fears), without having their professional careers ruined.â? - Atmospheric physicist James A. Peden, formerly of the Space Research and Coordination Center in Pittsburgh.

â??Creating an ideology pegged to carbon dioxide is a dangerous nonsenseâ?¦The present alarm on climate change is an instrument of social control, a pretext for major businesses and political battle. It became an ideology, which is concerning.â? - Environmental Scientist Professor Delgado Domingos of Portugal, the founder of the Numerical Weather Forecast group, has more than 150 published articles.

â??CO2 emissions make absolutely no difference one way or anotherâ?¦.Every scientist knows this, but it doesnâ??t pay to say soâ?¦Global warming, as a political vehicle, keeps Europeans in the driverâ??s seat and developing nations walking barefoot.â? - Dr. Takeda Kunihiko, vice-chancellor of the Institute of Science and Technology Research at Chubu University in Japan.

â??The [global warming] scaremongering has its justification in the fact that it is something that generates funds.â? - Award-winning Paleontologist Dr. Eduardo Tonni, of the Committee for Scientific Research in Buenos Aires and head of the Paleontology Department at the University of La Plata. # #

In addition, the report will feature new peer-reviewed scientific studies and analyses refuting man-made warming fears and a heavy dose of inconvenient climate developments. (See Below: Study: Half of warming due to Sun! â??Sea Levels Fail to Rise? - Warming Fears in 'Dustbin of History')

There is more to come real soon. I absolutely agree with person from the first quote, man-made global warming hype has become a religion and it's all about power. Priestcraft at its finest.

[semlogo]

The last list of dissenting "scientist" opinions I saw was full of non-scientists and scientists in completely different fields. I'll remain skeptical about this list for now.

[urroner]

The last list of dissenting "scientist" opinions I saw was full of non-scientists and scientists in completely different fields. I'll remain skeptical about this list for now.

Can you say the same about this list? Are there any valid scientists in this list? All the lists I've seen of "believers" are full of non-scientists and scientists in completely different fields. Are you skeptical of those lists?

[semlogo]

Can you say the same about this list? Are there any valid scientists in this list? All the lists I've seen of "believers" are full of non-scientists and scientists in completely different fields. Are you skeptical of those lists?

Not sure - it's a new list. I'll withhold comment until more is known.

Regarding "believers" list - I haven't seen that.

[thesometimesaint]

semlogo:

I remember when the argument was that passive tobacco smoking was not harmful either.

http://www.ourstolenfuture.org/Industry/19...rnesandbero.htm

Jerry McGuire: Show me the money.

[Vex]

I will for the moment throw my feces into this swimming pool (yes, you may go vomit now) or at the very least get my trained monkeys to do it(you may vomit then too):

http://newworldliberty.wordpress.com/2008/...g-proven-false/

http://wwwwakeupamericans-spree.blogspot.c...g-mistakes.html

http://10ksnookers.blogspot.com/2008/02/pr...ade-global.html

http://www.globalwarminghype.com/upld-book403pdf_.pdf

http://anhonestclimatedebate.wordpress.com...ing-false-data/

http://www.surfacestations.org/

http://religionnewsblog.blogspot.com/2008/...warming-is.html

http://www.weather.com/encyclopedia/global/index.html

http://www.businessandmedia.org/articles/2...0303175301.aspx

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews...history%27.html

So... Do we still accept the science? There's other sources to affect global temperature besides man made emissions. Let's check some stuff right quick:

http://www.aip.org/history/climate/solar.htm

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/...40803093903.htm

What this all means at least to me: is that the temperature of the earth is rising. Is it the carbon emissions from man that cause the temperature increase? I find that extremely hard to swallow. Why? Because the average increase in the temperature of the earth is 1-1.5 degrees F. A majority of which are skewed because of improper measurement apparatus'. So for sake of argument that the temperature of the earth has effectually only increased .5 (max) degrees F then is the possibility that the earth is actually increasing in temperature because of the high intensity of the sun for the past century?

[semlogo]

semlogo:

I remember when the argument was that passive tobacco smoking was not harmful either.

http://www.ourstolenfuture.org/Industry/19...rnesandbero.htm

Jerry McGuire: Show me the money.

Yes, but that argument was largely perpetrated by those being paid by the tobacco industry. Just as you'll see many scientists under the employ of the oil industry disputing global warming.

[thesometimesaint]

semlogo:

In many cases they are one and the same.

[urroner]

Yes, but that argument was largely perpetrated by those being paid by the tobacco industry. Just as you'll see many scientists under the employ of the oil industry disputing global warming.

How about those employed by the "man-made global warming religion" industry?

On the list I posted are the following scientists. I wonder if they know anything. According to most global warming mongers, they're naives and are under the evil influence of the oil/gas/coal companies.

UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist

• U.S Government Atmospheric Scientist Stanley B. Goldenberg of the Hurricane Research Division of NOAA
  
  
• Climate statistician Dr. William M. Briggs, who specializes in the statistics of forecast evaluation, serves on the American Meteorological Society's Probability and Statistics Committee and is an Associate Editor of Monthly Weather Review
  
  
• Meteorologist Hajo Smit of Holland, who reversed his belief in man-made warming to become a skeptic, is a former member of the Dutch UN IPCC committee
  
  
• Atmospheric physicist James A. Peden, formerly of the Space Research and Coordination Center in Pittsburgh
  
  
• Environmental Scientist Professor Delgado Domingos of Portugal, the founder of the Numerical Weather Forecast group, has more than 150 published articles
  
  

[semlogo]

How about those employed by the "man-made global warming religion" industry?

On the list I posted are the following scientists. I wonder if they know anything. According to most global warming mongers, they're naives and are under the evil influence of the oil/gas/coal companies.

UN IPCC Japanese Scientist Dr. Kiminori Itoh, an award-winning PhD environmental physical chemist

• U.S Government Atmospheric Scientist Stanley B. Goldenberg of the Hurricane Research Division of NOAA
  
  
• Climate statistician Dr. William M. Briggs, who specializes in the statistics of forecast evaluation, serves on the American Meteorological Society's Probability and Statistics Committee and is an Associate Editor of Monthly Weather Review
  
  
• Meteorologist Hajo Smit of Holland, who reversed his belief in man-made warming to become a skeptic, is a former member of the Dutch UN IPCC committee
  
  
• Atmospheric physicist James A. Peden, formerly of the Space Research and Coordination Center in Pittsburgh
  
  
• Environmental Scientist Professor Delgado Domingos of Portugal, the founder of the Numerical Weather Forecast group, has more than 150 published articles
  
  

I'm not saying there aren't some credible dissenters, but the majority of credible scientists still believe GW has been exacerbated by human activity, and the credibility of dissenters HAS been weakened by the arguments of shill "scientists."

[USU78]

Cold Steel:

Yes Global Warming is real. It is man made. While the US represents just 6% of the worlds population we contribute of 25% of the emissions that create Global Warming.

No, anthropogenic global warming is not real. It is not man made.

Now we've got that out of the way, what are your thoughts on the main point of the OP? That a neat religious allegory is turned on its head in the name of "we can't do religion, especially Christian religion" and folks-pseudoscientific-philosophy-slumming-as-political-correctness?

Or is it your view that the allegory has the same intent, with Klaatu still a stand-in for the Master, Gort the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse, the ship the Holy Spirit, and global warming man's arrogance and the self-destructiveness of sin?

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

An integral part of repentance is recognition of the evil that we have done, then ceasing to do that evil.

Oh so now it is evil to drive an SUV?

Pull your head out of the clouds. I respect you, but man only 20% of people even think that man caused the so called "man made global warming". It is all a ploy to redistribute the wealth through taxes. No one denies that the earth has warmed. Now that it has been cooling since 1998, what do you propose? The idea that man has caused to any warming trends is a hoax. Plain and simple. Let look at the sun, there was great solar activity when the warming trend occoured, now that it is colling there are no sun spots and the activity is running down.

[semlogo]

Oh so now it is evil to drive an SUV?

Pull your head out of the clouds. I respect you, but man only 20% of people even think that man caused the so called "man made global warming". It is all a ploy to redistribute the wealth through taxes. No one denies that the earth has warmed. Now that it has been cooling since 1998, what do you propose? The idea that man has caused to any warming trends is a hoax. Plain and simple. Let look at the sun, there was great solar activity when the warming trend occoured, now that it is colling there are no sun spots and the activity is running down.

[thesometimesaint]

Mola Ram Suda Ram:

Heck Mola Ram Suda Ram 18% of Americans think the sun revolves around the earth.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/3742/new-poll-g...dge-levels.aspx

Ps. Here is another no scientist that knows about Global Warming

President-elect Barack Obama intends to appoint Nobel Prize-winning physicist, Steven Chu, as his Energy Secretary. Once again, America's new President appoints the cream of the crop:

Chu was one of three scientists who shared the Nobel Prize for physics in 1997 for work in cooling and trapping atoms with laser light. He's a professor of physics and molecular and cell biology at the University of California, Berkeley, and has been the director of the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory since 2004, where he has pushed for research into alternative energy as a way to combat global warming. It is the oldest of the Energy Department's national laboratories, doing only unclassified work, and in recent years under Chu has been at the center of research into biofuels and solar technologies.

[Jason]

Now we've got that out of the way, what are your thoughts on the main point of the OP? That a neat religious allegory is turned on its head in the name of "we can't do religion, especially Christian religion" and folks-pseudoscientific-philosophy-slumming-as-political-correctness?

Or is it your view that the allegory has the same intent, with Klaatu still a stand-in for the Master, Gort the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse, the ship the Holy Spirit, and global warming man's arrogance and the self-destructiveness of sin?

I think it's an excellent illustration of how environmentalism is a new religion. They're now appropriating religious themes and parables for their own purposes.

EDIT: I wonder if Klaatu's new alias will be "Al Gore" - the savior of the new religion?