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Adam Is Michael?


LDSsister2007

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Hello;

I am new & was wondering about this;.. I was reading in the Gospel Principal book for yesterdays class( which I missed because the bishop was speaknig with me) but it says in ch.6 about the Fall of Adam& Eve that quote from the GPbook:

"Adam &Eve were among our Father's noblest children. In the spirit world Adam was caclled Michael the archangel(see D&C 27:11 Jude 1:9) he was chosen by our heavenly father to lead the rightious in the battle against Satan(see revelation 12:7-9)........."

D&C 107:54-56 Was also used as a disscusion. Who was Adam?What was he chosen to do?

let me quote the D&C 27:11 & maybe you can help answer the question because the mainstream chrisitanity churches do not reconize Adam asMichael, onyl as the first man made by God in the garden of Eden. I do not deny what the book says,however i just want a better understanding of it...

D&C27:11".And also with Michael,or Adam, the father of all, the prince of all, the ancxient of days;"

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Hello;

I am new & was wondering about this;.. I was reading in the Gospel Principal book for yesterdays class( which I missed because the bishop was speaknig with me) but it says in ch.6 about the Fall of Adam& Eve that quote from the GPbook:

"Adam &Eve were among our Father's noblest children. In the spirit world Adam was caclled Michael the archangel(see D&C 27:11 Jude 1:9) he was chosen by our heavenly father to lead the rightious in the battle against Satan(see revelation 12:7-9)........."

D&C 107:54-56 Was also used as a disscusion. Who was Adam?What was he chosen to do?

let me quote the D&C 27:11 & maybe you can help answer the question because the mainstream chrisitanity churches do not reconize Adam asMichael, onyl as the first man made by God in the garden of Eden. I do not deny what the book says,however i just want a better understanding of it...

D&C27:11".And also with Michael,or Adam, the father of all, the prince of all, the ancxient of days;"

I cannott answer yer question point blank at this time, {because of very poor memory}

But at one time i was pondering the same question as you, And after quite a bit of personal

revelation {both scripturel and spirituall} i found my answer. And am adiquitely satisfied.

{ My memory does serve me that well} i, m going to look this up again Thank you.

:P

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Hi LDSsister2007,

You wonâ??t find this teaching (or even a willingness to entertain the possibility) in any denomination of Christianity that does not believe in the pre-existence of the soul (prior to mortality).

For most within Christianity, it is believed that angels are a different species than man, and that we do not exist -- even in â??spirit formâ? -- prior to birth (or perhaps conception). So, the concept that a man (albeit the first man) could have been an angel before creation is pretty much moot in regards to most of Christianity.

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It's one of the more fascinating aspects of Mormonism and is one that was revealed in our day.

Michael led the armies of God prior to the creation of Earth. Later, as Adam, he became the first man and the father of all men who followed him. Later, as the Ancient of Days, Adam will preside over a latter-day council. Daniel wrote:

I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of Days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. (Daniel 7:13-14)

Many mainstream Christian religions believe the Ancient of Days will actually be Christ, but a careful reading indicates that it is the one brought before the Ancient of Days which will be given "dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him."

President Joseph Fielding Smith addressed this:

The Lord has revealed that in the present dispensation-the Dispensation of the Fulness of Times-all things from the beginning are to be revealed and the keys of each dispensation restored. This has been "spoken of by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began." (Acts 3:21; Ephesians 1:10.) In fulfilment of this prediction, the prophets holding keys, from Adam to Peter, James, and John, each came to the Prophet Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery and restored their keys. We do not have the detailed report of each of these restorations, but we do have the general statement that such was done. (D. & C. 128:19-21.)

First came Moroni, then John the Baptist, and Peter, James, and John, restoring their priesthoods so that the Church could be organized. Then followed the glorious visions in the Kirtland Temple and other restorations from Adam down. At the October conference in 1840, the Prophet Joseph Smith prepared and had a document read in which we find the following:

Commencing with Adam, who was the first man, who is spoken of in Daniel as being the "Ancient of Days," or in other words, the first and oldest of all, the great, grand progenitor of whom it is said in another place he is Michael, because he was the first and father of all, not only by progeny, but the first to hold the spiritual blessings, to whom was made known the plan of ordinances for the salvation of his posterity unto the end, and to whom Christ was first revealed, and through whom Christ has been revealed from heaven, and will continue to be revealed from henceforth. Adam holds the keys of the Dispensation of the Fulness of Tmes; i.e., the dispensation of all the times have been and will be revealed through him from the beginning to Christ, and from Christ to the end of the dispensations that are to be revealed. "Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he has purposed in himself; that in the Dispensation of the Fulness of Times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are in earth; even in him." ( D.H.C., Vol. 4, pp. 207-208; also Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 167-168.)

Not only is Michael and Adam the same; the angel Gabriel was known on Earth as Noah. President Smith goes on to explain:

Daniel in his seventh chapter speaks of the Ancient of Days; he means the oldest man, our Father Adam, Michael, he will call his children together and hold a council with them to prepare them for the coming of the Son of Man. He (Adam) is the father of the human family, and presides over the spirits of all men, and all that have had the keys must stand before him in the grand council. This may take place before some of us leave this stage of action. The Son of Man stands before him, and there is given him glory and dominion. Adam delivers up his stewardship to Christ, that which was delivered to him as holding the keys of the universe, but retains his standing as head of the human family.... (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 157.)

All angels, in reality, are men who have either not been born or who already have been born and who are known by different names. This was the case with all the great prophets and perhaps even you. We all had different names before we came to this Earth, even Moroni. So why didn't Moroni introduce himself by his true name? Because the Lord had a purpose in Moroni keeping his earthly identity. Moroni and others who lived in the new world instructed Joseph Smith as angels, and it was important that Joseph know their relation to those in the books of Mormon.

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This is one of the many points at which Mormonism breaks with traditional (read "apostate") Christianity.

Pretty much all Christian denominations view Adam as a "bad guy." (And Eve is his gun moll!) From their point of view, God had this wonderful plan all set up where all his children would live in a "paradise earth" and Adam and Eve came along (with the help of the serpent) and frustrated his plan.

Now we are engaged in a big detour, involving Jesus and the atonement, etc., in order to get us back to where we were supposed to be originally.

This, as I say, is the traditional and prevalent Christian view of things. It has the associated problem of God's creations being able to thwart God's divine will. It also has the problem of raising the question: If God really wanted things to work out differently, and if God has perfect foreknowledge, why didn't he do things differently in order to accomplish His will? At bottom is the problem that, if this view is correct, God is not all powerful.

The Book of Mormon broke with this tradition, claiming that Adam fell that men might be, and men are that they might have joy. In other words, the fall of man did not interfere with God's plan; rather it was God's plan for man.

Part and parcel of this is the idea in Mormonism that Adam was not a bad guy; but was actually one of the good guys. Not only was he one of the good guys; he was in fact a very good guy (read archangel) in the premortal existence. All who come to this earth existed prior to mortality, and Adam was no different; but due to modern day revelation, we are given a glimpse into just how great a being he was in premortality.

He came to earth not to frustrate God's will, but to further it; and to begin the process by which all of God's spirit children would be able to take upon themselves bodies of flesh and blood; itself a further important step in God's plan of happiness for his children.

This is one of the things that is so appealing to me about Mormonism: Not only does it hang together quite well in philosophical sense; but it also manages to avoid the numerous pitfalls of traditional Christian theology.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

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[...]

If God really wanted things to work out differently, and if God has perfect foreknowledge, why didn't he do things differently in order to accomplish His will?

[...]

It was not that Adam ate the apple for the apple's sake, but because it was forbidden. It would have been better for us--oh infinitely better for us--if the serpent had been forbidden. -That river fellow that went Twain

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Wherever Eve is, there is Eden.

Ever since the world began

Woman has tried to rule the man

She committed the first offense

And sheâ??s been after him ever since.

God created the earth, and He rested then

God created man, and He rested again

Then God created woman for manâ??s defense

And neither God nor man have rested since

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Was that in the year 2525?

I'm not sure where it's from. My grandfather used to always say it whenever my grandma would get after him. I've tried to find the source a couple of times, but I'm never able to find one (I like to pretend that he was clever enough to come up with it on his own -- good genes and all that jazz).

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Hello;

I am new & was wondering about this;.. I was reading in the Gospel Principal book for yesterdays class( which I missed because the bishop was speaknig with me) but it says in ch.6 about the Fall of Adam& Eve that quote from the GPbook:

"Adam &Eve were among our Father's noblest children. In the spirit world Adam was caclled Michael the archangel(see D&C 27:11 Jude 1:9) he was chosen by our heavenly father to lead the rightious in the battle against Satan(see revelation 12:7-9)........."

D&C 107:54-56 Was also used as a disscusion. Who was Adam?What was he chosen to do?

let me quote the D&C 27:11 & maybe you can help answer the question because the mainstream chrisitanity churches do not reconize Adam asMichael, onyl as the first man made by God in the garden of Eden. I do not deny what the book says,however i just want a better understanding of it...

D&C27:11".And also with Michael,or Adam, the father of all, the prince of all, the ancxient of days;"

Hi, I'm new here so I haven't got used to everything yet. But I wanted to reply to this poster's question about Adam. According to the LDS Standard Works (SW) Adam is the only God the LDS have. While I understand both the church and its members no longer teach that 'doctrine', its still LDS doctrine if God never changes.

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Hi, I'm new here so I haven't got used to everything yet. But I wanted to reply to this poster's question about Adam. According to the LDS Standard Works (SW) Adam is the only God the LDS have. While I understand both the church and its members no longer teach that 'doctrine', its still LDS doctrine if God never changes.

Um....NO

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thanks for the replies, i have read them & more of the G&P book, D&C,Bible etc, googled, lol & I do not doubt Michael was Adam, I live on faith , & besides it's better then the witnesses beliveing our brother Jessu was michael, lol. I had a dream one time that Michael was standing on a hill top & he looked like Matthew mchauhey(sp?) movie actor, but anyhow my brakes were gonig out in my car & he stopped it before hitting a buildnig then left. (hmmm I think I needed more sleep or less t.v. :P ) but seriously thank you for the help.

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Hi LDSsister2007,

You wonâ??t find this teaching (or even a willingness to entertain the possibility) in any denomination of Christianity that does not believe in the pre-existence of the soul (prior to mortality).

For most within Christianity, it is believed that angels are a different species than man, and that we do not exist -- even in â??spirit formâ? -- prior to birth (or perhaps conception). So, the concept that a man (albeit the first man) could have been an angel before creation is pretty much moot in regards to most of Christianity.

The reason Christianity doesn't believe in the so-called pre-existence is because the Bible emphatically states that we are flesh first and after death we become spirit [see 1 Cor.15:46 (44-49)]. Interestingly enough this same chapter contradicts a number of LDS major doctrines. God is a man, with flesh and Baptism for the dead (B4D). Since the Bible is the only source of moral behavior the world has ever had. And, since it has never changed any of its doctrines or been found to have any important changes made to it, I believe it over all other sources. So should you all.

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Um....NO

Well, let's see. The Journal of Discourse (Jod) says on the title page of Volume 8 that they are part of the SW. Volume 1, page 50 (or, Jod 1:50) says, "Adam is our Father and our God and the only God with whom we have to do." (verbatim quote). How can you possibly deny what at least 3 of the LDS prophets have said? They are, Young, Woodruff and Kimball- I can show this plus it was in the Deseret News paper of June 18, 1873- I have a copy of it. BY taught (in the SL Tabernacle) that God told him to tell this 'doctrine' to the people. If the LDS god said it is doctrine isn't it LDS doctrine? Or, does he (LDS god) give false doctrines?

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This post began with the question of Adam and Michael being the same. Is it too much to ask that it remain on that topic. Adam's role in the premortal existance illustrated his exalted position. It's only right that Michael, as Adam, would be chosen just as the other prophets. As stated, we also learned that Gabriel is Noah; and Joseph Smith, shortly before his death, told his close friends that he had just learned who he was; however, he did not divulge that information.

If anyone wants to discuss the divine council, what constitutes a "god," and what Adam's role in that council was, that's another topic entirely.

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Well, let's see. The Journal of Discourse (Jod) says on the title page of Volume 8 that they are part of the SW. Volume 1, page 50 (or, Jod 1:50) says, "Adam is our Father and our God and the only God with whom we have to do." (verbatim quote). How can you possibly deny what at least 3 of the LDS prophets have said? They are, Young, Woodruff and Kimball- I can show this plus it was in the Deseret News paper of June 18, 1873- I have a copy of it. BY taught (in the SL Tabernacle) that God told him to tell this 'doctrine' to the people. If the LDS god said it is doctrine isn't it LDS doctrine? Or, does he (LDS god) give false doctrines?

rocmonkey, if you want to discuss Adam-God, start your own thread. Emeliza's response was correct.

-SlackTime

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rocmonkey:

1 Cor.15:46 (44-49)

44it is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 45So also it is written, The first man Adam became a living soul. The last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46Howbeit that is not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; then that which is spiritual. 47The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is of heaven. 48As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly. 49And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

If you read the preceeding verses it is talking about the Resurrection not our pre-mortal existence.

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Hi, I'm new here so I haven't got used to everything yet. But I wanted to reply to this poster's question about Adam. According to the LDS Standard Works (SW) Adam is the only God the LDS have. While I understand both the church and its members no longer teach that 'doctrine', its still LDS doctrine if God never changes.

Welcom to the deep end of the pool, rocmonkey!

I'm going to respond as gently and kindly as possible because you are new here and haven't gotten used to everything yet.

First and formost - get out your thickest skin. :P You're gonna need it. Especially if you presume to tell LDS members what they believe. Go ahead and tell us we're wrong in your opinion - as long as you're respectful, that's not a problem. After all, we believe there are things wrong with the way you believe too.

Second: We "LDS" refer to the scriptures as our standard works. I'm not sure what you are referring to as our 'SW". If you could tell us it would help us know where you are coming from.

In the scriptures (Bible, Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants, Pearl of Great Price), we read that Heavenly Father is the only God we have, with Jesus Christ His Son, our Savior and Redeemer, and the Holy Ghost as the 2 other members of the Godhead.

If you are referring to the "Adam-God" theory that, though I've not studied it, does get discussed here every so often - well, here's one such thread that you can start with. There are plenty more where that came from.

Third: Yes, we believe that God doesn't change, but our understanding of Him does, as well as how He deals with His Church and what procedures He wants us to follow. That's why we have continuing revelation - same as in the Bible, Book of Mormon, etc.

Now, back to the Adam=Michael thread! <_<

Enjoy!

Jane

P.S. Editted to add - Sorry to post this late - I paused while composing it to do some other thing and didn't realize everyone had made my points already before I hit 'send'.

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According to the LDS Standard Works (SW) Adam is the only God the LDS have. While I understand both the church and its members no longer teach that 'doctrine', its still LDS doctrine if God never changes.

Rocmonkey, you won't find this in the "Standard Works", which comprise the Old and New Testament, Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, and Doctrine and Covenants. The Adam-God doctrine was taught by Brigham Young (second president of the church) throughout the course of his presidency, and documented in the Journal of Discourses, not the Standard Works. Adam-God was a controversial proposition which garnered considerable opposition -- even among the Twelve -- during Young's presidency, and has been disavowed for various reasons by main-line LDS leaders ever since.

It makes for an interesting discussion regarding changes in LDS orthodoxy, particularly in light of ongoing negotiations and hostilities with the United States in the late 19th century. It is also worthwhile speculation material for hypotheses about salvation as a multi-level marketing endeavor with Adam/Michael in the human upline. But it's a wrong answer in this context.

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rocmonkey,

If you really want to discuss the pre-mortality of the soul, Iâ??d love to do so with you in another thread. I have been guilty of derailing this thread too far with my antics with consiglieri. I for one would love to discuss pre-mortality of the soul, itâ??s place within ancient (and some modern sects of) Judaism, and when it became a â??doctrineâ? within Christianity.

LDSsister2007,

You might find this interesting. It is a table of the 7 angels (unfortunately, the formating doesn't carry over well onto the message board):

1,000 yrs ...Name ... Meaning...Mortal...Trump... Reward

First ... Uriel... Light of God... Peter... Celestial... Tree of life

Second... Raguel... Friend of God... Moses... Terrestial ...Clothed in White

Third ...Sariel... Prince of God... Abel... Telestial... Conquer Second Death

Fourth... Raphael ...Healer of God... Enoch... Perdition ...New Jerusalem

Fifth ...Phanuel ...Face of God... Joseph Smith... Gospel... White Stone

Sixth... Gabriel... Man of God... Noah... Restoration ...Sit on Throne

Seventh... Michael... Like Unto God... Adam... Triumph... Rule Nations

Table 1. The Seven Angels and Their Trumps

It is from a Meridian article that can be read here: http://www.meridianmagazine.com/sci_rel/020827seven.html

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Hi, I'm new here so I haven't got used to everything yet. But I wanted to reply to this poster's question about Adam. According to the LDS Standard Works (SW) Adam is the only God the LDS have. While I understand both the church and its members no longer teach that 'doctrine', its still LDS doctrine if God never changes.

Yikes. Have you been badly misinformed. That piece of misinformation is based not on any kind of accepted doctrine, but on a sentence uttered during a funeral address which has been mis reported and mis read ever since. Since the original speaker never, nor another prophet ever added this into the recognized and approved cannon (what practicing LDS really consider Standard Works) one would have to be ill advised to trumpet it as LDS doctrine.

However, I like to be fair, so I will be glad to study any reference in the four standards works that you would like to offer as substantiation for your statement that Adam is the ONLY God the Saints have. Thank You.

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