Hitler Baptized

[grego]

well, if you want to take a very simplistic view, you may.

which parts? oh, like this:

"The public finances, bad enough anyway, were worsened by the Allies

[dimbulb]

Uh, just because people had the perception that the Jews wronged them does not make it so. None of the quotes from my post implicate anyone Jewish in some uber-conspiracy to ruin Germany.

Are you suggesting that the Jews brought all this on themselves and then have made things look worse than they really were?

[USU78]

People generally act in their own self interest (as perceived by them).

Weimar had no "Fed" to control interest rates and keep inflation under control (of course, neither did the "Fed" have a "Fed" during the Carter administration). To impute a state-killing motive to banks in which Jews had a significant interest is to wallow in the absurd. Banks that have their cash flow and the collateral for the majority of their loans destroyed by events outside their control (see, e.g. post 1986 Tax Law Changes failures of the S&L system in the US) act in certain ways.

Cui bono, lads and lassies, will answer every question you need answered when it comes to imputing motives to businesses. Jewish owned or otherwise. There was no advantage to said banks to destroy what was left of the German Oeconomie in the '20s. Moreover, see Utah's 1920s depression, which predated the world-wide one by a fair bit, for similar reactions by local financial institutions to the loss of both cash flow and collateral.

[dimbulb]

The problem is that it's much more comforting to believe that powerful forces are at work that cause problems such as these. It's much scarier to understand that a confluence of myriads of factors can cause disaster. Conspiracy theories help people feel in control. And the Jews made for a very comforting and simplistic conspiracy theory.

[USU78]

With grateful thanks to Spike Jones and the Cityslickers (as well as Der Original Donald):

Der Fuehrer's Face

Spike Jones and the City Slickers

When Der Fuehrer says, "We ist der master race"

We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der Fuehrer's face

Not to love Der Fuehrer is a great disgrace

So we HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der Fuehrer's face

When Herr Goebbels says, "We own der world und space"

We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Herr Goerring's face

When Herr Goring says they'll never bomb this place

We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Herr Goerring's face

Are we not the supermen

Aryan pure supermen

Ja we ist der supermen

Super-duper supermen

Ist this Nutzi land not good?

Would you leave it if you could?

Ja this Nutzi land is good!

Vee would leave it if we could

We bring the world to order

Heil Hitler's world New Order

Everyone of foreign race will love Der Fuehrer's face

When we bring to der world disorder

When Der Fuehrer says, "We ist der master race"

We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der Fuehrer's face

When Der Fuehrer says, "We ist der master race"

We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der Fuehrer's face!

[grego]

usu78 wrote:

"There was no advantage to said banks to destroy what was left of the German Oeconomie in the '20s."

if you're a little german bank, that's true.

"Weimar had no "Fed" to control interest rates and keep inflation under control"

woah! i think you missed a few big points here. please go back and read the other posts.

dimbulb wrote:

"Uh, just because people had the perception that the Jews wronged them does not make it so."

i agree.

yes, who benefitted from forcing germany to ruin? um...england? france? russia? the usa? zionists and jews? no!...

the master race? according to the talmud and some jews, there is only one master race: the jew.

[USU78]

'78 had said:  Weimar had no "Fed" to control interest rates and keep inflation under control.

to which Grego responded: woah! i think you missed a few big points here. please go back and read the other posts.

And I think I should whomp you one upside the head for being a nervy begger who would dare to assume I had not read the dreck you posted with considerable care prior to posting.

dimbulb and I are giving you gems here. Relish them.

[dimbulb]

the master race? according to the talmud and some jews, there is only one master race: the jew.

If you had gone to my high school, you would have gotten the crap beaten out of you. it seems to me that the only people who make these kinds of ignorant and pathetic statements are those who don't know any Jews and have never talked with a person of Jewish descent.

[grego]

ah, good old might and public opinion makes right. you've been indoctrinated well. oh boy, then i must be wrong...

read the talmud. obviously you didn't read the posts.

"it seems to me that the only people who make these kinds of ignorant and pathetic statements are those who don't know any Jews and have never talked with a person of Jewish descent. "

didn't someone already whip you for this previous comment?

i'm not commenting on whether you read the posts or not, but your ability to grasp from them.

when all else fails, let's fight!! (hey, wasn't that the battle cry against germany??) unless you accept these gems...

[dimbulb]

Nope, might and public opinion don't make right. Neither do ignorance and bigotry.

[USU78]

ah, good old might and public opinion makes right. you've been indoctrinated well. oh boy, then i must be wrong...

read the talmud. obviously you didn't read the posts.

"it seems to me that the only people who make these kinds of ignorant and pathetic statements are those who don't know any Jews and have never talked with a person of Jewish descent. "

didn't someone already whip you for this previous comment?

when all else fails, let's fight!! (hey, wasn't that the battle cry against germany??)

Who declared war against whom?

Did the US declare war against the Empire of Japan, or did the Empire of Japan declare war against the US first?

Did the US declare war against the Third Reich, or did the Third Reich declare war against the US first?

Little details like this are more than just interesting. They make all the difference in the world.

FACT: Germany invaded the Rheinland despite having agreed not to.

FACT: Germany annexed Austria and forced an affirmative vote with tanks poised on the border.

FACT: Germany invaded and eviscerated Czecho-Slovakia.

FACT: Germany invaded Poland.

FACT: It was the invasion of Poland, who had iron-clad guarantees from France and Britain, that caused France and Britain to declare war.

FACT: Germany invaded and annexed Denmark, Norway, Belgium and the Netherlands, states that had not threatened nor declared war upon Germany.

FACT: Japan declared war upon the US and attacked the US slightly before the declaration was delivered.

FACT: Germany declared war against the US, not the other way around.

FACT: Germany invaded Russia despite a nonaggression pact.

[grego]

usu78,

if you say you read the posts and links, you are a liar. that simple. anyway, it's there for those who are interested. obvioulsy, you aren't. good luck.

[Pahoran]

I think this would be a great time to close the thread, since it hasn't had anything to do with Mormon things for several pages at least.

Regards,

Pahoran

[Calm]

Politics too. Against board rules. Close it.

[dimbulb]

I'm afraid I've gotten too personal here. Sorry for contributing to a bad atmosphere. I agree: please close this thread.

[Del March]

Grego,

"3. Any theory that stipulates that one group is responsible for basically all the evil in the world is called "conspiracy theory", and I don't believe in conspiracy theories, whether the Evil they describe is called Zionism or America."

obviously you do--it was called germany during ww2, right? 

Hardly! Germany was responsible for a big deal of the evil going on in Western Europe, but that's about it. Not at all on the same scale as your Jewish Conspiracy who supposedly controls pretty much all the Western world.

sorry, i already don't take you seriously.  you can't show, you don't read.  yeah, i've read lots, including "night" (faked!), "the diary of anne frank" (largely faked!), etc.  please, what have you read?

Hundreds of testimonies published in every possible form of media and scholarly studies, throughout my life. I'm French, you see, so WWII, Hitler, Auschwitz, are things that I literally grew up with. Revisionist history too.

i gave you a few very, very straight answers--did you bother to read them?

A "very very straight answer" to a "why?" question starts with "because". I didn't see ANY "because" answer to the following questions:

1. If Hitler didn't want a war, why did he focus Germany's efforts on the production of weapons, breaking quite a few treaties in so doing?

2. If Hitler didn't want a war, why did he systematically invade the German-populated regions of other countries, like Austria, and Czechoslovakia, and even later some Czech provinces of Czechoslovakia?

3. If Hitler didn't want a war, why did he invade neutral countries such as Belgium?

I also didn't see ANY straight answer to those questions:

4. If Hitler didn't want to kill Jews massively, then who organised the meticulous elimination of the Jews (and other "indesirables") in the death camps, and why?

2. Here's another one: who came up with the brilliant idea of forcing all Jews to wear the Star of David?

Those two are VERY easy to answer: give me names.

You might think that you gave straight answers, but you didn't. All you gave was a flood of largely irrelevant information. I asked you about Hitler, you answered about the Jews.

you know, i bet you actually did, which is why i feel something negative here.  does it make your blood boil that so many people can prove something completely contrary to what you want to believe?  does it make you feel cheated, hating for all those years, just to find out you might have hated the wrong people? 

i daresay the evidence i've ladled to you is quite enough to stand on its own.  until you can prove that hitler truly did all you say you believe he did, i will not take you, nor anyone, seriously about this whole thread about what a bad thing to do for such an evil man. 

How do you expect to be taken seriously when you can't even remember who is who ON THIS ONE THREAD??? Let me refresh your memory about where I have always stood IN THIS THREAD:

- We must forgive everyone, because Jesus said so. That includes Hitler.

- Harbouring hate is a self-destructive behaviour, and hate only breeds more hate.

- There is nothing wrong with doing Hitler's temple work, as long as we respect the protocol established by the church for doing work for the dead (ie: we work for our ancestors first, and we don't play the celebrity game)

- Hitler might very well repent. For all we know, he's already repented.

- Other countries had a responsibility in what happened, no doubt about that.

In short: accusing ME of having hate for Hitler is, to put it extremely mildly, silly.

(ps, yes, i have.  many still love him and mussolini.  kind of weird, huh?)

There are people in France who worship our local extreme-right-wing, pro-nazi, political leader (who, by the way, called the extermination camps "a detail"). He made it to the second round of the presidential election last time. And I totally understand why he is so popular.

I've moved to Slovenia since those presidential elections (no relationship between those two events). Slovenia is an ex-Yougoslavia Republic. I very quickly came to understand that no matter what kind of crappy times he put the country through, Tito was literally adored by many, and he still is.

You seem to be under the delusion that I have never encountered the kind of information you've given me. You're wrong. I grew up with it. Which is why I can tell you: anything that says that Hitler didn't want to go to war is CRAP. Hitler WANTED to go to war, he prepared his country just for that, he very carefully prepared the terrain, and he very deliberately pushed the buttons he knew would start the fireworks. Anyone believing otherwise is a blinded fool.

And with this I second Pahoran's motion to close this now-pointless thread.

Del

[SlackTime]

Since I agree... Thread Closed

-SlackTime