New testament Greek geeks - aorist imperative active

[gav]

Do we have anybody who can help out with aorist imperative active. I'm intrigued by its use in Rev 13:18.

Quote

¹⁸ Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

From what I see:

"hath understanding" is the action that occured in the past and "count" is the command that must be executed in the present. Thereby John is stipulating that understanding must precede the counting/computation of the number. Most commentators have seemed to interpret this in such a way that some person reading the work in John's future would have first to develop the understanding and then be able to count or compute the number of the beast.

Could this alternatively include a person that had understanding prior to John's writing using that understanding to count what John was then writing in his(John's) present? i.e. a previous prophets understanding (counting/computing style) could be applied to what John was then writing?

[Pyreaux]

Absolutely. There would have been those who have understood John before he wrote his letter, to first know after being initiated into the inner circle, the temple priesthood, to know the secret knowledge, or Gnosis, to understand what hierophants would only feel they could safely convey in public through coded phrases, parables and apocalypses such as the Book of Revelations, obscured for the purpose of preventing the uninitiated from interpreting his commands. But there were those that understood then.

Edited December 18, 2022 by Pyreaux

[Pyreaux]

6 is the number of beasts, as beasts were made on day 6 of creation. But it's also the number of men, flesh, sacrifice. 

7 is the number of completeness, as creation was completed on day 7. But also, literally swearing (an oath).

8 is the number of fatness, a surplus (to completeness), abundance, fertility, and transformation. Because the 8th day transforms into the 1st day, the day of oneness and angel birth. So, 8 is also associated with initiate angel-rebirth and resurrections on Sundays.

In apocalypses, beasts refer to men and men were divine.

Beast = men; a ram with two horns = the two kings of Media; the ten-horned dragon = the ten Roman rulers; the lamb with seven eyes = human Jesus and his seven archangels.

Men = divine; the man Gabriel = the angel Gabiel; the Son of Man = Son of God; 70 shepherds = the 70 elohim.

When beasts become men = men become gods. Noah was a white bull who became a man when he was told a secret = Noah transfigured and walked with God; Moses was a white sheep who became a man on Mount Sinai = Moses was transfigured on Mount Sinai.

In ancient times, initiations used to take 7 days, in black sackcloth and ashes before the 8th day when they'd wash and get their white robes in the dawn hours of next Sunday. 8 carries a meaning of God's acceptance; 8 days the get circumcised; 8 years to be baptized; 8 days for Aaron to be initiated a priest; 8 days for Asenath to dawn white wedding robes; 8 days Jesus waited on a mountain to be endowed in his white temple priest's robe and made Peter, James and John swear to secrecy. John's "Lord's Day" is the 8th day of the Day of Atonement, the Sunday morning the High Priest returned with Judgments.

The Christian initiates were temple priests who've sworn the oaths and through transformative ordinances, they to turn men into divine beings. Secrecy, like Jesus only speaking parables to the public, but only explaining the meaning privately. John was writing to only the "true" that "hath the key of David" referring to the binding/sealing power of the priesthood, only those who can hear (priests) can hear what he's saying.

Edited December 22, 2022 by Pyreaux

[Navidad]

There must be hundreds of interpretations of verses like this. The best interpretation in my mind is humility. Humility says that we have no idea what this verses and others like it involving numbers mean in the modern day. The more we extrapolate or use numerology to understand texts, the more we open the door to personal speculation. We find some way to explain, add up or attach significance to a text and then that becomes the truth of the text because it validates our position. Biblical interpreters have been doing that for two thousand years! It gets even wilder when we attach prophetic meaning to these kinds of texts.

I think these type of verses are best interpreted as something that had metaphorical meaning the first century. If I say "It took me an eternity to put together our new vacuum cleaner" that implies nothing literal at all except that I had a hard time putting it together. If I say "I was on pins and needles about singing the solo" - you don't need to look for pins and needles on the carpet. It means I was nervous or anxious about the task. If I say it took an eternity to get through the song and I was on pins and needles the whole time - the whole thing is metaphorical of difficulty, challenge, and stress. Nothing is literal about what I said. Much of the apocalyptic literature of the Bible is about the folks who at that time were on pins and needles. The Bible is full of metaphors. Metaphors are not meant to be taking literally. Anyone who thinks differently is splitting hairs! It makes me feel under the weather. It puts me at sixes and sevens! Got the idea? Over and out!

[Pyreaux]

Right you are, aside from things we are explicitly told in Greek are hidden secrets, such a “mysteries” in English means something that is incomprehensible, or unknowable, in contrast to the Greek word musterion means secret teachings and ordinances of initiation rites. There is indeed a lot of simple and basic contexts lost in translation, time and culture. It's harder for a rich man to get into heaven than for a camel to fit through the "eye of a needle". So, it's impossible? No. The eye of a needle is a slit in a city wall wide enough for a single man to fit through. Aa camel could fit, it just needs to be brought to its knees, to take its burdens off its back, and with a bit of force, push and pull it through. So, a rich man can get into heaven, if he's prayerful, not materialistic, and not stubborn.

Edited December 24, 2022 by Pyreaux