Mike Reed Posted October 21, 2011 Posted October 21, 2011 It has been a long time since I've studied the Book of Mormon as intensely as I have the last week. I've got to tell you that I am seeing a “fullness” of the Nauvoo gospel in it. The more I look and research the Book of Mormon, the more apparent it seems to me that Nauvoo soteriology (that Joseph later introduced) was largely developed before 1830. I have discovered a useful key for seeing this. The key is (for lack of better words) a magnetic mirror—a polarized reflection. The key is apparently Joseph Smith's, and seems to have the potential for unlocking many details contained in the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. I am not ready to share what I am learning, since there is still much more research to do. My effort to say and not say something simultaneously is probably confusing to people reading this post. But here is one other clue:He who has eyes to see, ears to hear, and a mind to expand... 1
Joshua M. Posted October 21, 2011 Posted October 21, 2011 The more I look and research the Book of Mormon, the more apparent it seems to me that Nauvoo soteriology (that Joseph later introduced) was largely developed before 1830.Could you please explain what you mean by this? Thanks in advance.
Cobalt-70 Posted October 21, 2011 Posted October 21, 2011 Yin and yang? Are you talking about good not existing without evil, etc., which is expressed in the Book of Mormon? I'll have to wait to see what the connection is to Nauvoo soteriology, which I understand to be highly gnostic and universalistic.
zerinus Posted October 21, 2011 Posted October 21, 2011 It has been a long time since I've studied the Book of Mormon as intensely as I have the last week. I've got to tell you that I am seeing a “fullness” of the Nauvoo gospel in it. The more I look and research the Book of Mormon, the more apparent it seems to me that Nauvoo soteriology (that Joseph later introduced) was largely developed before 1830. I have discovered a useful key for seeing this. The key is (for lack of better words) a magnetic mirror—a polarized reflection. The key is apparently Joseph Smith's, and seems to have the potential for unlocking many details contained in the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. I am not ready to share what I am learning, since there is still much more research to do.My effort to say and not say something simultaneously is probably confusing to people reading this post. But here is one other clue:He who has eyes to see, ears to hear, and a mind to expand...The most important thing that you need to know about the Book of Mormon is that it is true. 1
Joshua M. Posted October 21, 2011 Posted October 21, 2011 The most important thing that you need to know about the Book of Mormon is that it is true.Zerinus,Is your comment directed toward Mike Reed? If so, I think you should know that Mike has meticulously studied the BoM and has personally come to a different conclusion.
zerinus Posted October 21, 2011 Posted October 21, 2011 (edited) Zerinus,Is your comment directed toward Mike Reed? If so, I think you should know that Mike has meticulously studied the BoM and has personally come to a different conclusion.So have I! Edited October 21, 2011 by zerinus
stevedallas Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 To say the Book of Mormon is true or not true is the wrong answer to the wrong question. Is it true? sure it is. There is no doubt it is a book. The question is, is it what it purports to be? Is it the inspired Word of God? Is it a history book?I, too, have studied it. I studied it a lot. I have studied LDS Books about it. It is not what it purports to be. No reputable, non-LDS archeologist can claim there is any evidence of it. No reputable, non-LDS historian can accept it as history. Can a person learn about God's love from it? Yes. Just as they can from reading any Religious Fiction. I loved being LDS and will always miss it. I wish it were true. But it isn't. 1
David T Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 The question of the truth of the BOM is boring. I'm intetested in thr discussions about what inspiration and meaning one has pulled from its pages. Non believers can give just as good insight on that question as believing members.
LDSToronto Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 It has been a long time since I've studied the Book of Mormon as intensely as I have the last week. I've got to tell you that I am seeing a “fullness” of the Nauvoo gospel in it. The more I look and research the Book of Mormon, the more apparent it seems to me that Nauvoo soteriology (that Joseph later introduced) was largely developed before 1830. I have discovered a useful key for seeing this. The key is (for lack of better words) a magnetic mirror—a polarized reflection. The key is apparently Joseph Smith's, and seems to have the potential for unlocking many details contained in the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. I am not ready to share what I am learning, since there is still much more research to do.My effort to say and not say something simultaneously is probably confusing to people reading this post. But here is one other clue:He who has eyes to see, ears to hear, and a mind to expand...I'm feeling sleepy, very sleepy. Off to the somnambulist.H.
Mike Reed Posted October 22, 2011 Author Posted October 22, 2011 Could you please explain what you mean by this? Thanks in advance.I mean that I see the endowment, eternal marriage, and three degrees of glory in it. Strange, right?
Joshua M. Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 I mean that I see the endowment, eternal marriage, and three degrees of glory in it. Strange, right?Wow. I look forward to reading more about this. Are you planning on posting this on your website?
Glenn101 Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 I mean that I see the endowment, eternal marriage, and three degrees of glory in it. Strange, right?Well, we already have the autobiography of Joseph in it. Why should another hindsight insight be strange?Glenn
TAO Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) Ah, Mike, you would be talking about the time-line of the book as a whole, from start to finish? Is that where you see endowment, eternal marriage, and the three degrees of glory?Hehe, I love guessing. Edited October 22, 2011 by TAO
Questing Beast Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 There is no endowment, eternal marriage or three degrees of glory in the BofM. Joseph Smith's later theology is quite different from the Lehite theology; which is quite orthodox and black and white. Nothing in the BofM allows for Joseph Smith's later salvation for the dead and temple work or even saving those in spirit prison. In the BofM, when you die your fate is sealed in either heaven or hell: Protestant hell of eternal fire, etc. The state you find yourself in at death is the foretaste of eternity, either hell and misery, or heaven and eternal rest from all care and sorrow....
TAO Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) There is no endowment, eternal marriage or three degrees of glory in the BofM. Joseph Smith's later theology is quite different from the Lehite theology; which is quite orthodox and black and white. Nothing in the BofM allows for Joseph Smith's later salvation for the dead and temple work or even saving those in spirit prison. In the BofM, when you die your fate is sealed in either heaven or hell: Protestant hell of eternal fire, etc. The state you find yourself in at death is the foretaste of eternity, either hell and misery, or heaven and eternal rest from all care and sorrow....Questing Beast, he is talking about a metaphorical representation. Like how Chronicles of Narnia represents the life of Christ. Edited October 22, 2011 by TAO
ldsfaqs Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 Let's see which way this now goes..... Of course, won't hold my breath given the past.BTW Mike..... The Temple teachings are all through the Bible, BOM, etc. for those who have the eyes to see. One of those little "mystery's".
Mike Reed Posted October 22, 2011 Author Posted October 22, 2011 There is no endowment, eternal marriage or three degrees of glory in the BofM.I didn't think so either. I have since changed my mind. Doing more research, but I am guessing that this will probably be my next conference paper topic.
zerinus Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 To say the Book of Mormon is true or not true is the wrong answer to the wrong question. Is it true? sure it is. There is no doubt it is a book. The question is, is it what it purports to be? Is it the inspired Word of God? Is it a history book?Of course it is. That is what we mean when we say that it is true.I, too, have studied it. I studied it a lot. I have studied LDS Books about it. It is not what it purports to be. No reputable, non-LDS archeologist can claim there is any evidence of it. No reputable, non-LDS historian can accept it as history.But the Holy Ghost does!Can a person learn about God's love from it? Yes. Just as they can from reading any Religious Fiction.You can't learn about God's love from religious fiction. You can learn it only from the revealed word of God. And of course, you can learn a lot more from the Book of Mormon than just about "God's Love". You can learn true gospel doctrine from it. You can learn about God's dealings with a portion of the Human family. You can learn about God's covenants with mankind, and in particular with the house of Israel, and how it has been fulfilled in connection with the Nephites, and how it will continue to be fulfilled in the future. You can even learn true history from it. You can learn a lot from the Book of Mormon.I loved being LDS and will always miss it. I wish it were true. But it isn't.There is a way that you can know that it is true; but there is no way that you can know that it is not true. Therefore your confident assertion that it isn't is misplaced. You can take my word for it that it is true.
zerinus Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 The question of the truth of the BOM is boring.I am sure you would be; but you should be liberal minded enough to realize that not everyone thinks the same as you do.I'm intetested in thr discussions about what inspiration and meaning one has pulled from its pages. Non believers can give just as good insight on that question as believing members.I couldn't possibly agree with that. While I am sure non-believers can gain some insight into the Book of Mormon, I don't believe that they can gain the same insight, without becoming believers themselves.
Mike Reed Posted October 22, 2011 Author Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) Yin and yang? half right. Edited October 22, 2011 by Mike Reed
Mike Reed Posted October 22, 2011 Author Posted October 22, 2011 I couldn't possibly agree with that. While I am sure non-believers can gain some insight into the Book of Mormon, I don't believe that they can gain the same insight, without becoming believers themselves.It appears to me that you have the key, but can't use it.And you can't use it, since you aren't able to identify it. It is difficult to identify what is red while wearing red glasses, is it not?
Mike Reed Posted October 22, 2011 Author Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) The most important thing that you need to know about the Book of Mormon is that it is true.And if you are eating a sandwich? Is it most important to know if the sandwich is true?Hat-tip to Delin. Edited October 22, 2011 by Mike Reed
Mike Reed Posted October 22, 2011 Author Posted October 22, 2011 Wow. I look forward to reading more about this. Are you planning on posting this on your website?I'll probably save it for a conference paper or journal article.Bummer that you've been banned. I checked you posts and can't figure out what the deal is.
zerinus Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 It appears to me that you have the key, but can't use it.And you can't use it, since you aren't able to identify it. It is difficult to identify what is red while wearing red glasses, is it not?Sorry, that didn't make a lot of sense to me.And if you are eating a sandwich? Is it most important to know if the sandwich is true?Hat-tip to Delin.When we say that the Book of Mormon is true, we mean that it is factually true, doctrinally true, historically true, theologically true, even the manner of its production, transmission, discovery, and translation is true.
LDSToronto Posted October 22, 2011 Posted October 22, 2011 I'm feeling sleepy, very sleepy. Off to the somnambulist.H.Throw me a bone here - did I get even close on this topic with my mysterious reply? Seems I didn't.
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