What's with multiple names in LDS teachings?

[Doug the Hutt]

According to LDS teachings --

* Adam = Michael

* Noah = Gabriel

* Jehovah = Jesus

* you = <your ~new name~ here>

What's the point of listing Biblical person X as both X and sometimes Y, and never at the same time in the same context in the Bible. The only times we get these person X is really Y is in modern LDS instruction. Why not just call X, X the whole time and keep it clear? How do we know that Adam and Michael aren't two very different beings -- what if Michael is actually Jesus http://scriptures.lds.org/en/rev/12/1-17#7 ? What if Michael is just Michael and our LDS leaders had wisdom-of-men- moments when they combined them? How do we know Noah is Gabriel -- maybe the angel Gabriel is just Gabriel? After all, they have two distinct names....why introduce confusion by claiming that they are one and the same (and if they were the same person why not introduce the character that way in the first place with both names)? It makes more sense that character X is just X, character Y is just Y -- separate people with unambiguous names to keep them separated. It's not like the difference between John and Joan, or Paul and Pol, or Paco and Taco which could have been typos.

Do any of the hundreds of ancient Biblical documents such as the Dead Sea Scrolls vindicate these LDS teachings, specifically of person X being also known as Y?

I don't see any indication in the Bible to suggest that one is a first name and one their surname or even occupation (such as "Sir Adam Michael, Ancient of Days, Dragon-slayer of the Kingdom of God" or "Noe de Gabriel"), and there's nothing in the Book of Mormon to confirm anything other than what the Bible indicates. And if those guys have two names why don't the rest of the Biblical prophets and Apostles? Why no standard? Why some but not the others? Consistency is hard to come by in some LDS doctrines, and those are the times my brain waves giant red warning flags (being ever-en-guard for false prophets per Jesus' instruction). What if this teaching is just another stage prop we point at and claim that because we have *new instruction Z* right there it proves that we're the True Church, but in reality is simply false?

[semlogo]

Saul = Paul

Simon = Peter

[volgadon]

According to LDS teachings --

* Adam = Michael

* Noah = Gabriel

* Jehovah = Jesus

* you = <your ~new name~ here>

What's the point of listing Biblical person X as both X and sometimes Y, and never at the same time in the same context in the Bible. The only times we get these person X is really Y is in modern LDS instruction. Why not just call X, X the whole time and keep it clear? How do we know that Adam and Michael aren't two very different beings -- what if Michael is actually Jesus http://scriptures.lds.org/en/rev/12/1-17#7 ? What if Michael is just Michael and our LDS leaders had wisdom-of-men- moments when they combined them? How do we know Noah is Gabriel -- maybe the angel Gabriel is just Gabriel? After all, they have two distinct names....why introduce confusion by claiming that they are one and the same (and if they were the same person why not introduce the character that way in the first place with both names)? It makes more sense that character X is just X, character Y is just Y -- separate people with unambiguous names to keep them separated. It's not like the difference between John and Joan, or Paul and Pol, or Paco and Taco which could have been typos.

Do any of the hundreds of ancient Biblical documents such as the Dead Sea Scrolls vindicate these LDS teachings, specifically of person X being also known as Y?

I don't see any indication in the Bible to suggest that one is a first name and one their surname or even occupation (such as "Sir Adam Michael, Ancient of Days, Dragon-slayer of the Kingdom of God" or "Noe de Gabriel"), and there's nothing in the Book of Mormon to confirm anything other than what the Bible indicates. And if those guys have two names why don't the rest of the Biblical prophets and Apostles? Why no standard? Why some but not the others? Consistency is hard to come by in some LDS doctrines, and those are the times my brain waves giant red warning flags (being ever-en-guard for false prophets per Jesus' instruction). What if this teaching is just another stage prop we point at and claim that because we have *new instruction Z* right there it proves that we're the True Church, but in reality is simply false?

New names appear in the Revelation of St. John, like 2:17 and 19:12,16.

Jacob is known both as Jacob and Israel, Jethro is also Reuel. In extra-biblical literature there are several examples, such as Enoch/Metatron, or Shem/Melchizedek, Malachi/Ezra or Malachi/Mordechai.

The name is more a descriptive title than just something you go by.

[Joseph Antley]

In the ancient world, one's name--especially in a religious context--was understood to be a mystical attribute with powerful significance. For example, in the book of Hebrews, Christ's exalted status is indicated by his new name:

[David T]

You may find this blog post of interest: The Power of the Name.

[Jason]

You forgot:

Lucifer = Satan

Abram = Abraham

Saria = Sarah

Jacob = Israel

Jesus = Immanuel, etc.

[Que]

I also don't see how this issue can be understood without the context: that of an individual pre-existence. In each of the examples given in the OP, the two names are the name used to identify an individual in his pre-mortal state (Michael, Gabriel, Jehovah) and the name used in mortality (Adam, Noah, Jesus). One would assume that we all have a name used in pre-mortal life, and a name given at birth...

[Vance]

Jacobus = James

Oh, wait that is a post Biblical change.

[Zakuska]

Jacobus = James

Oh, wait that is a post Biblical change.

You mean theres been a change in the Bible... some one better inform RocMonkey in my sig line of that fact!

RE: OP ...

Metatron = Enoch

(He is rummored to have been the "Angel" that stopped Abraham for slaying Isaac)

Enoch walked with God; then he was no more, because God took him away. [Genesis 5:24 NIV.]

This Enoch, whose flesh was turned to flame, his veins to fire, his eye-lashes to flashes of lightning, his eye-balls to flaming torches, and whom God placed on a throne next to the throne of glory, received after this heavenly transformation the name Metatron. [Gershom G. Scholem, Major Trends in Jewish Mysticism (1941/1961) p. 67. Extract of 3 Enoch.]

While this identification of Metatron with Enoch is not to be found in the Talmud itself, the connection is assumed by some of the earliest kabbalists. There also seem to be two Metatrons, one spelled with six letters (??????), and one spelled with seven (???????). The former may be the transformed Enoch, Prince of the Countenance within the divine palace; the latter, the Primordial Metatron, an emanation of the "Cause of Causes," specifically the tenth and last emanation, identified with the earthly Divine Presence.^[7]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metatron

Kerry has got some video on that one too.

[Tsuzuki]

Lucifer = Satan

Also:

Christ = Lucifer (2 Peter 1:19)

[Zakuska]

Also:

Christ = Lucifer (2 Peter 1:19)

Lets not forget...

Lucifer = Satan = Azazel = Beelzebub

And to continue...

Rev. 9: 11

11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

I think that some of these Double-Names might just be caused by virtue of the Bible coming from a multi-cultural background. (ie Persian, Greek, Hebrew,Roman etc. etc. etc.)

[LeSellers]

* Adam = Michael

* Noah = Gabriel

* Jehovah = Jesus

* you = <your ~new name~ here>

The list is much, much longer than that.

Solomon was also named "Jedediah", Jethro is Ruel, most non-Israelite kings have many names in the Bible. What's the beef with the Saints and our doctrines when there is so much in the Bible that is essentially identical. Oh, it's not limited to (Judeo-Christian) religions, either. Secular history is the same.

What's the point of listing Biblical person X as both X and sometimes Y, and never at the same time in the same context in the Bible. The only times we get these person X is really Y is in modern LDS instruction. Why not just call X, X the whole time and keep it clear?

Keeping it clear is not the primary goal. Getting the message of the Gospel is the goal.

And, as others have noted, the name a person uses is often affected by the audience, or the image one wants to project at the time. After all, Marion Mitchell Morrison was born Marion Robert Morrison, changed his name once, went by "Duke" but is best known as "John Wayne".

Lehi

[volgadon]

In the ancient world, one's name--especially in a religious context--was understood to be a mystical attribute with powerful significance. For example, in the book of Hebrews, Christ's exalted status is indicated by his new name:

[Connolly]

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

[Maidservant]

Not to mention that you may be comparing to "western" naming traditions or practices. A friend of mine, Muslim, Afghani, he was given a name by his parents when born (of course), but when he became old enough, an adult, he chose a name for himself. And that doesn't include his clan name and his family name. So he has four names and he goes by all four, together, individually, and in a variety of combinations of twos or threes. And that doesn't include that his father (for example) has a similar number of names that don't particularly match the son's, in the way we are used to thinking of it, except for the common clan name, and the son could appropriate any of his father's names in a given situation if he was so inclined.

[Zakuska]

Any one who has been on a Mission to Europe and performed a baptism has run into this issue...

Maria de Almeida dos Santos das Gracas de Oliveira Parede Carmino de Pomba Sagrada de Jerusalem

I baptize you....

[David T]

Any one who has been on a Mission to Europe and performed a baptism has run into this issue...

Maria de Almeida dos Santos das Gracas de Oliveira Parede Carmino de Pomba Sagrada de Jerusalem

I baptize you....

I served a Spanish-speaking mission in Seattle, Washington. There was once an entire 5th Sunday Lesson on the proper way to fill out tithing slips and other church records, because the records had the same people under multiple names, and sometimes their toddler kids as a separate head of household, due to the long multiple naming conventions and other such issues.

[Zakuska]

And don't forget Nick names.

[phaedrus ut]

List of code names in the Doctrine and Covenants

* Ahashdah: Newel K. Whitney

* Alam: Edward Partridge

* Baneemy: originally Lyman Wight, reinterpreted by Orson Pratt as "mine elders" in 1876, perhaps corrupt Hebrew for

[David T]

List of code names in the Doctrine and Covenants

* Ahashdah: Newel K. Whitney

* Alam: Edward Partridge

* Baneemy: originally Lyman Wight, reinterpreted by Orson Pratt as "mine elders" in 1876, perhaps corrupt Hebrew for

[volgadon]

Here is part of the entry for name in the Dictionary of Deities and Demons in the Bible.

I.

Name (Heb sem, representing a common Semitic noun) refers to a designation of a person, an animal, a plant or a thing.

It also refers to reputation, progeny (as continuation, remembrance), and posthumous fame.

The name of a person or deity is especially closely associated with that person or deity, so that knowledge of the name is connected with access to and influence with even magical control of-the named.

In particular, God's name, which in some traditions is specifically revealed, can become a separate aspect of God, in such a way as to represent God as a virtual hypostasis.

It is not as developed a hypostasis in the OT as is God's word or God's wisdom or even God's spirit (RINGGREN

1947), but it is more significant than the role of God's arm (e.g. Isa 51:9).

II.

Certain deities in the Ancient Near East are celebrated for the multiplicity of their names or titles. e.g. the 50 names of Marduk in EIIlI11IlJ Elish, the 74 names of Re in the tomb of Thutmosis III and the 100-142 names of Osiris in Spell 142 of

the Book of the Dead. The deities may also

have hidden or secret names so as to emphasize

their otherness and to guard against

improper invocation by devotees. (Note the

story about how Isis persuaded Re to

divulge his secret name, thereby lending

great power to her magic; ANET 12-14.)

[volgadon]

From the Chapter of Rabbi Nehuniah ben ha-Qanah.

He adjured me by the great seal, by the great oath, in the name of Yad Naqof Yad Nakuy Yad Heras Yad suqas; by his great seal, by Zebudiel Yah, by Akhtariel Yah, by heaven and by earth. As soon as I heard this great secret, my eyes became enlightened. Whatever I heard- Scripture, Mishnah, anything else- I forgot no more. The world was made new for me in purity, and it was as if I had come from a new world. Now: any student [talmid] who knows what he learns does not stay with him should stand and say a blessing, rise and speak an adjuration, in the name of Margobiel Giwat

[cinepro]

Also Elijah = Elias

Oops!

[wenglund]

Wade Englund = son, brother, friend, neighbor, citizen, constitunt, Elder, servant, boss, employee, american, visitor, customer, data point, coach, teacher, ect. (hopefully some day I will be called "father")

Other names I have been given include: idiot, goof-ball, Wadester, Wade-O, guy, etc.

It is all very confusing...I know.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[volgadon]

Also Elijah = Elias

Oops!

Yes, oops. Of course. It could never be that Elijah and Elias are convenient ways in English to tell two Elijah's apart.