Libs Posted August 19, 2012 Posted August 19, 2012 You think that was mean, wait'll I tell you what I made for dessert last night and didn't share!Ah, there you go, taunting me we desserts again. If it was something chocolate, I may never speak to you again! Fair enough.Thank you.
selek1 Posted August 19, 2012 Posted August 19, 2012 Ah, there you go, taunting me we desserts again. If it was something chocolate, I may never speak to you again! No such luck.Cheesecake over a graham cracker/praline crust drizzled with fresh, warm goat's milk caramel and sprinkled with butterscotch chips and toffee bits.
Calm Posted August 19, 2012 Posted August 19, 2012 Got to ask the difference using goat's milk makes (I love fresh goat's milk, but certain members of my family gag on it).
Libs Posted August 19, 2012 Posted August 19, 2012 I have never had goat's milk, but your dessert sounds delicious, selek. I would certainly try it.
selek1 Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 Got to ask the difference using goat's milk makes (I love fresh goat's milk, but certain members of my family gag on it).It alters the final flavor of the caramel.I should also clarify that it is the caramel, not the goat's milk that was fresh (I don't own a goat, but I have a number of friends who do).I generally prefer to make my own, but you should be able to find Quemada in the Hispanic foods section of your local Walmart.It can be used wherever normal caramel sauce is used- but it is very potent.I sent just one small jar and my SIL accused my of trying to kill off her diabetic husband for the inheritance.
tyler90az Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 (edited) Got to ask the difference using goat's milk makes (I love fresh goat's milk, but certain members of my family gag on it).sorry for going off topicIs goat milk really as healthy as my MIL makes it out to be? She says it will cure any sickness... Edited August 20, 2012 by tyler90az
KevinG Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 sorry for going off topicIs goat milk really as healthy as my MIL makes it out to be? She says it will cure any sickness or disease...No. That would be Windex.**My Big Fat Greek Wedding
thesometimesaint Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 I haven't tried goats milk. But it does make wonderful cheese.
thesometimesaint Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 Selek 1:I've already got the best advocate with the Father.
selek1 Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 Selek 1:I've already got the best advocate with the Father. True- but we might still convict with some well-timed jury-tampering....
selek1 Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 sorry for going off topicIs goat milk really as healthy as my MIL makes it out to be? She says it will cure any sickness... To be honest, I don't know- I can't stand the stuff.Like Storehouse Peanut Butter, I only use it for cooking, never for tasting.Well this topic is gone. :/ IMNSHO, this thread was gone somewhere around eight pages back when the dialogue switched from substance to volume. Hot Air and bureaucracy are like any other gases- they will expand to fill any volume containing them.Still- you clearly feel there's more that needs to be said, so I will bow out to avoid any further distractions or derails.
Libs Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 I think everyone has, pretty much, had their say.(I only take issue with SS claiming he is, possibly, far more liberal than I. That is just not possible. )
thesometimesaint Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 Libs:I didn't say that. I said I was as politically liberal if not more so than you. In other ways I'm probably more moderate, and my religion certainly is more conservative than yours. So I guess I'm just a moderately conservative liberal. 1
ERayR Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 Got to ask the difference using goat's milk makes (I love fresh goat's milk, but certain members of my family gag on it).Well he had me on the desert until he added the goats milk then I gave mine to the next person in line. 1
JCNowandForever Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 Can this be considered "bullying the church into submission"?The following information is circulating in several forums in the internet in which members are paying tithing as a Conditional Donation with the following stipulations:On the back of their tithing check, the following words are written:“SUBJECT TO REFUND UPON REQUEST (SEE TERMS AND CONDITIONS).”They said when they give the donations to their Bishops (or counselors), the check and the tithing receipts are enclosed with the following information:TERMS AND CONDITIONS:· This donation is a conditional donation· This conditional donation is given voluntarily and will be used by the Church as it sees fit· The condition to exercise for a complete refund of all conditional donations will never be exercise by this member while membership in the Church remains in good status.· This member reserves the right to exercise a complete refund of all conditional donations upon termination of membership in the Church.o Upon voluntary termination (resignation) of membership in the Church, this member reserves the right to exercise a request for a complete refund of all conditional donations.o In the event of an excommunication action, this member reserves the right to exercise a request for a complete refund of all donations.· All donations are conditional donations, unless otherwise noted.What would the effect of this if members start to do this in large numbers? Would it be bullying?
ERayR Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 Can this be considered "bullying the church into submission"?The following information is circulating in several forums in the internet in which members are paying tithing as a Conditional Donation with the following stipulations:On the back of their tithing check, the following words are written:“SUBJECT TO REFUND UPON REQUEST (SEE TERMS AND CONDITIONS).”They said when they give the donations to their Bishops (or counselors), the check and the tithing receipts are enclosed with the following information:TERMS AND CONDITIONS:· This donation is a conditional donation· This conditional donation is given voluntarily and will be used by the Church as it sees fit· The condition to exercise for a complete refund of all conditional donations will never be exercise by this member while membership in the Church remains in good status.· This member reserves the right to exercise a complete refund of all conditional donations upon termination of membership in the Church.o Upon voluntary termination (resignation) of membership in the Church, this member reserves the right to exercise a request for a complete refund of all conditional donations.o In the event of an excommunication action, this member reserves the right to exercise a request for a complete refund of all donations.· All donations are conditional donations, unless otherwise noted.What would the effect of this if members start to do this in large numbers? Would it be bullying?The bishop would most likely return the donation and thank them for the thought. The IRS on the other hand would deny a charitable donation deduction because by definition such donations are not complete until the stipulations are meet and the donation relinquished to the donee. In this scenario the stipulation can not be considered complete until the death of the doner. Perhaps on the final tax return.
JCNowandForever Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 The IRS on the other hand would deny a charitable donation deduction because by definition such donations are not complete until the stipulations are meet and the donation relinquished to the donee. I doubt the IRS would deny such donation, For individual tax returns, these returns are mostly filed on a CASH BASIS of accounting. (Meaning, from an accounting standpoint, expenditures are recognized by the IRS when actually spent, (ie, cash was constructively transferred from Donor's bank account to Donee's bank account). Thus it's deductible. However it is used (conditionally or non-conditionally) is between donor and donee, not the IRS.
ERayR Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 (edited) I doubt the IRS would deny such donation, For individual tax returns, these returns are mostly filed on a CASH BASIS of accounting. (Meaning, from an accounting standpoint, expenditures are recognized by the IRS when actually spent, (ie, cash was constructively transferred from Donor's bank account to Donee's bank account). Thus it's deductible. However it is used (conditionally or non-conditionally) is between donor and donee, not the IRS.Are you an accountant. If so you better look at the requirements for a charitable donation. If the doner remains in control of the donation it is not a completed gift. Or do you mean it is unlikely the IRS would ever find out? That is the most likely scenario. The conditions of the gift are between doner and donee. Whether they meet IRS regulations is definitely an IRS concern and charitable contributions is always an area of scrutiny. Edited August 20, 2012 by ERayR
JCNowandForever Posted August 20, 2012 Posted August 20, 2012 My wife is an accountant and here's what she provided from the IRS website: The IRS allows for conditional donations."Conditional gift. If your contribution is a conditional gift that depends on a future act or event that may not take place, you cannot take a deduction. But if there is only a negligible chance that the act or event will not take place, you can take a deduction." Based on the stipulation above, there's a negligible chance that a member will be excommunicated or resign (meaning it doesn't happen every year when taxes are filed that they are excommunicated or resigned. In other words, there's a small (negligible) chance of the event from ever happening.). So based on that the conditional donation it is deductible. (but consult your tax accountant on this).The conditional donation above says that upon deposit into the Church bank account (which I call constructive transfer of funds from donor to donee), the Church as full control of it and can use it as it sees fit.
ERayR Posted August 21, 2012 Posted August 21, 2012 My wife is an accountant and here's what she provided from the IRS website: The IRS allows for conditional donations."Conditional gift. If your contribution is a conditional gift that depends on a future act or event that may not take place, you cannot take a deduction. But if there is only a negligible chance that the act or event will not take place, you can take a deduction." Based on the stipulation above, there's a negligible chance that a member will be excommunicated or resign (meaning it doesn't happen every year when taxes are filed that they are excommunicated or resigned. In other words, there's a small (negligible) chance of the event from ever happening.). So based on that the conditional donation it is deductible. (but consult your tax accountant on this).The conditional donation above says that upon deposit into the Church bank account (which I call constructive transfer of funds from donor to donee), the Church as full control of it and can use it as it sees fit. Well I am a tax accountant and I would advise my clients that the stipulation in and and of itself raises the distinct possibility of it happening. On top of that it would negate the statute of limitations if it were to occur and adjustments would have to be made in all years affected thus leaving the taxpayer open to huge tax recoveries by the IRS plus interest on years of refund affected. The possibilities, and might I say probabilities when going into this with that mind set, could be catastrophic.
JCNowandForever Posted August 21, 2012 Posted August 21, 2012 Well I am a tax accountant and I would advise my clients that the stipulation in and and of itself raises the distinct possibility of it happening. On top of that it would negate the statute of limitations if it were to occur and adjustments would have to be made in all years affected thus leaving the taxpayer open to huge tax recoveries by the IRS plus interest on years of refund affected. The possibilities, and might I say probabilities when going into this with that mind set, could be catastrophic.The only distinct possibility of it happening is when a member is excommunicated. But that is not like to happen every year a member files a return. It is a remote possibility.I think that receiving a refund of a donations is no different from winning the lottery. Both are taxable income and are both are taxed in the year received, isn't it? I don't see why it affects prior year. Here's what I read from Turbo Tax help section about reimbursed donations:About Reimbursed DeductionsIf you are reimbursed or refunded for a deduction you took in a prior year, you may need to report it on this year's tax return as taxable income.That's because you already received the benefit of the deduction in the prior year and the reimbursement you're receiving now would be like a double benefit if it wasn't taxable.
CASteinman Posted August 21, 2012 Posted August 21, 2012 What would the effect of this if members start to do this in large numbers? Would it be bullying?Can't be bullying in my mind when the Church will certainly refuse the "Donation". I know that if I were the Bishop, I would be tempted to take the money but inform the person that it would not count toward tithing -- and ask if they still wanted to make a donation.However, I am sure the Church would not want to include that in their funds.
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