Advice For Witnessing To Mormons; Try Living A Moral Life.

[jo1952]

I think Pa Pa is not concerned so much with the fact that the guy is sinning, but that he seems to think his unchaste behavior is ok and not something to be left behind. He, of course, is free to correct me if I have misinterpreted him.

I ran into a guy like that on my mission. The guy claimed it was perfectly acceptable for him to do what ever he wanted, no matter how vile, since he believed in Jesus. He also said I was going to hell since I believed that Joseph Smith was one of Christ's chosen prophets and Joseph was a polygamist.

Hi Nathair,

I love that we are helping to love each other, as evidenced by Pa Pa, Stormrider, you and others. BTW, I don't believe it was Pa Pa's intention for the thread to take the direction it did. It is so easy to cross the line--sometimes it seems we are unawares because the adversary is sooooo crafty. It reminds me of Peter's receiving revelation from the Spirit about Jesus' true identity...and only a few verses later he is rebuked by Jesus, "Satan, get thee behind me". Yet Peter's reason for saying the things which brought on this rebuke, were rooted in his great love for Jesus. Thus we see how the adversary will use our strengths against us. I am extremely imperfect. I believe that the first and second great commandments are given to help us to grow toward the oneness that we seek.

Humbly,

jo

[DarkScythe]

In the small things, He does a mighty work. Satan doesn't need to go BIG to encourage sin.

[jo1952]

In the small things, He does a mighty work. Satan doesn't need to go BIG to encourage sin.

Indeed! If he were too obvious, we wouldn't be so easily fooled or blinded.

Regards,

jo

[DarkScythe]

Satan also uses the old favorite, "play on Emotion" Tactic.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

I think Pa Pa is not concerned so much with the fact that the guy is sinning, but that he seems to think his unchaste behavior is ok and not something to be left behind. He, of course, is free to correct me if I have misinterpreted him.

This was my point.

[KevinG]

We could retitle this thread - Advice for being a Mormon - Try living a moral life. I would still agree that the Mormons should be a trustworthy and righteous people if they want their testimony to be heard or believed.

In that case I would not be defending "saved by grace alone".

This is often criticized by Evangelicals and Non-denominationals as over reliance on works. Reliance on Grace alone coupled with a causal attitude about behaviors is not atypical of the Christians I associate with in the South. They are not bad people but they all too often excuse their own bad behaviors as being "covered" without any attitude of repentance.

Claiming that this is a misrepresentation of Christians is just silly, just as defending a Mormon who sinned without remorse would be silly and non-doctrinal.

Edited October 26, 2011 by DaddyG

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

I love you, Pa Pa.

jo

Thank You, I was not trying to sit in judgment; I just found the entire thing odd and at odds with Christ's teachings.

[K-2]

I used to talk to a guy I knew at work about religion, who is an evangelical Christian. I invited him to go to Church with me and he promised he would if I went to his church (Calvary Chapel) first and I agreed. In our conversation he was insisting that Jesus saves sinners in their sins rather than from their sins. I agreed that he saves sinners in their sins but said that I also believe He saves them from their sins -- that sanctification is as much a part of salvation as justification is. This guy insisted I was wrong so I said well what if I am an exhibitionist/nudist and then get saved. I still would not have given up the idea of walking around naked and if I died and went into God's presence I'd probably throw off my white robes, walk around naked, and probably be immediately ejected. Well we agreed that I'd pick him up after work to go to his church service, so I went to his house and went in and there was a big professional portrait of him with a nice looking lady. I said "Oh, this must be your wife!" and he was like "Uh... um... er... well that's my fiance." I was like "Oh, when are you getting married?" and he goes "Uh, well we haven't set a date yet but when she moved in last year we talked about marriage sometime soon." So anyway, I went to his church sevice as promised but he never kept his promise to go to mine.

[diglot]

So anyway, I went to his church sevice as promised but he never kept his promise to go to mine.

I think some evangelicals have the idea that if you go to their church service, you will be slain by the Spirit of God and convert to mainstream Christianity. When this doesn't happen, they don't reciprocate and go to your church because they never intended to in the first place (because they thought they wouldn't need to since you would convert after going to their church).

Edited October 27, 2011 by diglot

[Saints Alive]

I think some evangelicals have the idea that if you go to their church service, you will be slain by the Spirit of God and convert to mainstream Christianity. When this doesn't happen, they don't reciprocate and go to your church because they intended to in the first place (because they thought they wouldn't need to since you would convert after going to their church).

In other words they practice the same type of deception and dishonesty that the accuse LDS of?

[jo1952]

Thank You, I was not trying to sit in judgment; I just found the entire thing odd and at odds with Christ's teachings.

Hi Pa Pa,

I hope you read my post #26.

Love,

jo

[KevinG]

In other words they practice the same type of deception and dishonesty that the accuse LDS of?

I guess it could be projection but that seems a bit of a harsh judgement to me...

I tell my friends up front that it would be great if they joined my church but that my greater interest is that they know about us. What they do with the information they receive is up to them and I won't change my feelings of friendship either way.

I have visited other religious services (usually for special occasions like baptisms and confirmations) and been edified and enlightened but not converted. I think my friends appreciate my willingness to learn about them.

We teach, the Holy Spirit converts.

[jo1952]

Back to General Discussions

I guess it could be projection but that seems a bit of a harsh judgement to me...

I tell my friends up front that it would be great if they joined my church but that my greater interest is that they know about us. What they do with the information they receive is up to them and I won't change my feelings of friendship either way.

I have visited other religious services (usually for special occasions like baptisms and confirmations) and been edified and enlightened but not converted. I think my friends appreciate my willingness to learn about them.

We teach, the Holy Spirit converts.

I would offer that, in order for God to accomplish His purposes, He does NOT always instruct the Holy Ghost to "convert" a person to any prescribed religious institution; not even to convert them to the LDS Faith (though the Holy Ghost will ALWAYS witness of the Father and of the Son once a person exercises faith/believes in Christ). They certainly do not need to receive that witness through the efforts of the LDS Church. For instance, I believe Ghandi was an instrument in God's hands; and, if he had become a Christian, he could not have been as successful as he was in doing the great good which was the fruit of his efforts. (God works in mysterious ways....)

I believe that whatever circumstance we are in, God will use those circumstances to bring about His purposes. He also knows that a person's Ordinance work is ultimately going to be performed. As such, I really do believe that all persons, be they non-believers, non-LDS believers, or LDS believers bring about His purposes WHERE they are best suited to do the most Good for themselves (as pertaining to storing up treasures in Heaven) as well as for the benefit of others (if ye have done unto the least of these, ye have done it unto Me).

Regards,

jo

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

Hi Pa Pa,

I hope you read my post #26.

Love,

jo

I did, I got the point...my thank You should have had a smiley face.

[jo1952]

I did, I got the point...my thank You should have had a smiley face.

Awww. Just for the record, I thought the smiley was implied in the first "thank you".

Love,

jo