inquiringmind Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 (edited) I've been wondering why the name of the church was changed from "The Church of Christ," to "The Church of Jesus Christ," to "The Church of Latter Day Saints," to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints' (it's my understanding that this is the hisatory of the name changes, and if I'm mistaken here, please correct me.)Were these name changes primarily due to legal issues arising from the Campblelites calling themselves "The Church of Christ"? (Also, does anyone know when wine was first replaced with water in the sacrament service?) Edited August 4, 2011 by inquiringmind
LeSellers Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 I've been wondering why the name of the church was changed from "The Church of Christ," to "The Church of Jesus Christ," to "The Church of Latter Day Saints," to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints' (it's my understanding that this is the hisatory of the name changes, and if I'm mistaken here, please correct me.)Were these name changes primarily due to legal issues arising from the Campblelites calling themselves "The Church of Christ"? God either commanded it explicitly or He simply changed the name through revelation. In any case, the name has always meant the same thing.Lehi
inquiringmind Posted August 4, 2011 Author Posted August 4, 2011 God either commanded it explicitly or He simply changed the name through revelation. In any case, the name has always meant the same thing.LehiI'm interested in why God would command the change..Was it a legal necessity because the Campblelites already had the name "Church of Christ"?
LeSellers Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 I'm interested in why God would command the change..Was it a legal necessity because the Campblelites already had the name "Church of Christ"?Those were not such litiginous times. It may have been for any number of reasons—we have not been told. Your hypothesis is one of those possibilities. Lehi
Thinking Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 (edited) I've been wondering why the name of the church was changed from "The Church of Christ," to "The Church of Jesus Christ," to "The Church of Latter Day Saints," to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints' (it's my understanding that this is the hisatory of the name changes, and if I'm mistaken here, please correct me.)Were these name changes primarily due to legal issues arising from the Campblelites calling themselves "The Church of Christ"? (Also, does anyone know when wine was first replaced with water in the sacrament service?)The second name was The Church of the Latter Day Saints not The Church of Jesus Christ. Edited August 4, 2011 by Thinking
alter idem Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 I'm interested in why God would command the change..Was it a legal necessity because the Campblelites already had the name "Church of Christ"?Inquiring mind, here's a good explanation:http://fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_church_organization/Changes_in_the_name_of_the_ChurchI think if you'd find answers to a lot of your questions on the Fair site.The scriptural reference for the name is found in D&C 115:3 as well as 3 Nephi 27:8
Craig Paxton Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 (edited) I've been wondering why the name of the church was changed from "The Church of Christ," to "The Church of Jesus Christ," to "The Church of Latter Day Saints," to "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints' (it's my understanding that this is the hisatory of the name changes, and if I'm mistaken here, please correct me.)Were these name changes primarily due to legal issues arising from the Campblelites calling themselves "The Church of Christ"? (Also, does anyone know when wine was first replaced with water in the sacrament service?)When God told Joseph what the name of the church was...he was always distracted with other seemingly more important matters and couldn't give God his full attention. Kind of like how I claim I can listen to my wife talk AND read the newspaper at the same time. Imagine if you had 33 wife's all talking at the same time...no wonder it took him so many attempts to get it right and had to change it so many times... Gosh I hope everyone can take a joke.... Edited August 4, 2011 by Craig Paxton 1
LeSellers Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 Gosh I hope everyone can take a joke....I, for one, cannot take this one, if you even meant it as a joke, an implication I doubt.Lehi
alter idem Posted August 4, 2011 Posted August 4, 2011 (Also, does anyone know when wine was first replaced with water in the sacrament service?)Here's the Fair response regarding the Sacrament and use of water/wine:http://fairmormon.org/Mormon_ordinances/Sacrament/Uses_water_instead_of_wineSome think that LDS are different because we use water, but the article gives examples that water was used in the past as well. From the article:Samuele Bacchiocchi, a non-Mormon scholar, has observed that An investigation... of such Jewish Christian sects as the Ebionites, the Nazarenes, the Elkesaites, and the Encratites, might provide considerable support for abstinence from fermented wine in the Apostolic Church. The fact that some of these sects went to the extreme of rejecting altogether both fermented and unfermented wine using only water, even in the celebration of the Lord's Supper, suggests the existence of a prevailing concern for abstinence in the Apostolic ChurchThe change to wine was as early as Joseph Smith's day as you can see in D&C 27:2 given in 1830:..I say unto you, that it mattereth not what you shall eat or what ye shall drink when ye partake of the sacrament, if it so be that ye do it with an eye single to my glory..LDS have used water for the sacrament exclusively since abt. 1906.
inquiringmind Posted August 4, 2011 Author Posted August 4, 2011 LDS have used water for the sacrament exclusively since abt. 1906So water was never used in Joseph's lifetime?
Nenahnezad Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 So water was never used in Joseph's lifetime?Just for baptisms.
LeSellers Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 So water was never used in Joseph's lifetime?I believe it would have been, however, it was not used exclusively, nor routinely, as it is now. Lehi
Questing Beast Posted August 5, 2011 Posted August 5, 2011 Joseph Smith drank wine. Not until well into the 20th century, was the Word of Wisdom tightly "enforced". Individual compliance was the normal response to the revelation that was given"not by commandment ... but by the word of wisdom." The first generation of Mormons could hold high priesthood office and still be drunkards (e.g. Porter Rockwell). Brigham Young had a collection of pipes (but unless he was a "closet smoker", he only held them, not used them). It is my understanding that the early use of wine was according to the scriptures the most correct. But using water would have been alright anytime that wine was not available. Eventually, the use of water was mandated, simply because "wine" is the result of aging grape juice, and the Word of Wisdom was gaining increased importance as a "commandment" and not any longer simply a good idea for the wise to follow....
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