Tithing

[Jeff K.]

Does anyone here pay directly to SLC? I started doing that when my bishop started getting too nosey.

I did for several years. We were living in other nations where the tax codes were different, in Mexico for example tithing is not tax deductible and we were under a tax equalization plan that would not have allowed us the tax advantages (generally only three things are tax deductible in Mexico, donations to political parties, hospitalization and burial). So we gave generously to the local branch through fast offerings and sent our tithing through Salt Lake City.

[Hughes]

Back to the subject of tithing, I had been putting it off intending to pay it lump sum before the end of the year because of financial tightness in general. But I felt I needed to pay it, so I did. Within a week I heard from a friend that a former business associate wanted a payoff letter and he would pay me back several thousand dollars that he had borrowed years ago. I had written that one off as a loss.

We're under a stricter law then the law of Moses. It's called the law of Christ.

Read Mathew chapters 5,6 and 7.

The law (of Moses) was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ. Much like Algebra is our schoolmaster to bring us unto calculus or

calisthenics is our schoolmaster to bring us unto weight training.

Tithe Mathew 23:23 "not to leave the other(tithing) undone..

Mathew 28:20 teaching them to observe ALL THINGS whatsoever I have COMMANDED you.

Oh oh, commandments..

note this is AFTER the resurrection..

So is this..

Revelation chapter 2

Not exactly. It's a different topic I'm sure.

But, my response is this, the law was powerless (Rom. 8 ). Only God's love and grace can change the hearts of men. Yes, the law was our school master, it exposed out weaknesses, and our need for God.

Edited June 29, 2011 by Hughes

[LeSellers]

the law was powerless (Rom. 8 ). Only God's love and grace can change the hearts of men. Yes, the law was our school master, it exposed out weaknesses, and our need for God.

Once again, like nearly every Protestant, especially of the Evangelical stripe, you erroneously conflate "the law" with "every law".

When Paul speaks of "the law", he invariably means "the Law of Moses", and never means "the law of the Gospel". Context makes this abundantly clear.

There are far too many refernces to obedience in the New Testament to come to any conclusion other than with reference to the Law of Moses, its having been fulfilled, we do not follow it any more, but that we must still obey the higher law, that of the Gospel, to "be saved".

Lehi

[Hughes]

Once again, like nearly every Protestant, especially of the Evangelical stripe, you erroneously conflate "the law" with "every law".

When Paul speaks of "the law", he invariably means "the Law of Moses", and never means "the law of the Gospel". Context makes this abundantly clear.

There are far too many refernces to obedience in the New Testament to come to any conclusion other than with reference to the Law of Moses, its having been fulfilled, we do not follow it any more, but that we must still obey the higher law, that of the Gospel, to "be saved".

Lehi

Please tell me where in the Bible it says, "the law of the Gospel" - I'd love to read it.

[LeSellers]

Please tell me where in the Bible it says, "the law of the Gospel" - I'd love to read it.

Yeah, I know. Just another thing missing from the Bible. Too bad they who chose the books we have in it today didn't have the inspiration of prophets and Apostles, isn't it?

Lehi

[Hughes]

Yeah, I know. Just another thing missing from the Bible. Too bad they who chose the books we have in it today didn't have the inspiration of prophets and Apostles, isn't it?

Lehi

So there's no "the law of the Gospel" in the Bible then.

making this statement false:

"When Paul speaks of "the law", he invariably means "the Law of Moses", and never means "the law of the Gospel". Context makes this abundantly clear."

It's obviously not "abundantly clear."

[LeSellers]

So there's no "the law of the Gospel" in the Bible then.

In those words, no, but the concept is there. Modern terminology, as revealed to living prophets, makes it clear.

making this statement false:

"When Paul speaks of "the law", he invariably means "the Law of Moses", and never means "the law of the Gospel". Context makes this abundantly clear."

No, it's not false. You might have heard the word "euphemism". It describes one way this sort of thing happens in every day life.

One can (and often does) easily mean something that the words do not explicitly state. We do it all the time, and more so when the formal terminology does not yet exist (or has been forgotten.

It's obviously not "abundantly clear."

Not to someone whose mind is blinded by the traditions of men.

Lehi

[Ares]

Evangelical and LDS views on works vs. faith is a separate topic. Please don't derail this one, especially with snide or personal quips.

[shalamabobbi]

Faith vs works is pertinent to this thread with respect to the law of tithing. If the mods disagree feel free to remove this post.

(actually faith vs works is a false dichotomy but that is another thread..)

Abraham lived before the law of Moses. So the laws he obeyed were something other than the law of Moses that was discontinued.

Gal 3:26-29

For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

And if ye be Christ's, THEN ARE YE ABRAHAM'S SEED, and heirs according to the promise.

John 8:39

If ye were Abraham's children, ye would DO THE WORKS of Abraham.

Tithing is one of the works of Abraham

Gen 14:17-20

And the king of Sodom went out to meet him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the lings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale.

And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God.

And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:

And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him TITHES OF ALL.

The law of Moses was understood to be about Christ even before Christ came.

John 1:45

Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the Son of Joseph.

John 12:34

The people answered him, We have heard out of the law that Christ abideth for ever: and how sayest thou, The Son of man must be lifted up? who is this Son of Man?

1 Cor 10: 1-4

Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea:

And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;

And did all eat the same spiritual meat;

And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for THEY DRANK OF THAT SPIRITUAL ROCK THAT FOLLOWED THEM: and that Rock was Christ.

verses 5-13 explain that what is expected behavior wise hasn't really changed..

Edited June 30, 2011 by shalamabobbi

[Jeff K.]

Tithing is simply one manifestation of faith. I have faith in the Lord that he will accept my sacrifice and put it to good use to help others. I seek nothing from the tithing because I am a debtor with a debt that can never be repaid by me. I merely manifest with a grateful heart, my faith in Him and my thanks for his mercy and grace.

To me that is tithing.