The Most Correct Book On Earth

[urroner]

But...but...I thought South Park said the mormons were right!

(Hell, waiting area. Many souls are there, wondering where they are, and why.)

Hell Director: Hello, newcomers, and welcome. Can everybody hear me? (taps the mic a few times) Hello? Can everybuh-? Okay. (the crowd quiets down) Uh, I'm the hell director. Uh, it looks like we have about 8,615 of you newbies today, and for those of you who are a little confused, uh, you are dead, and this is hell, so, abandon all hope and uh yada yada yada. Uh, we are now going to start the orientation process, which will last about-

Man 4: Hey, wait a minute, I shouldn't be here. I was a totally strict and devout Protestant! I thought we went to heaven!

Hell Director: Yes, well I'm afraid you were wrong.

Soldier: I was a practicing Jehovah's Witness.

Hell Director: Uh, you picked the wrong religion as well.

Man 5: Well, who was right? Who gets into heaven?

Hell Director: I'm afraid it was the Mormons. Yes, the Mormons were the correct answer.

Crowd: (disappointed) Awww.

Dang, wes bites himself in the butt again.

[selek]

I never said Twain or South Park were inspired by God. This is why I ignore posts by people like you urroner.

Hmmm.......and yet not one word on Twain's condemnation of the Bible.

Apparently wes is trying to distract us from the flaws in his argument, but he's not quite the accomplished prestidigitator he pretends to be.

[wes]

While Twain did not accept the Bible as the Word of God he did have SOME positive things to say about it. However, he had NOTHING positive to say about the BOM.

[ttribe]

While Twain did not accept the Bible as the Word of God he did have SOME positive things to say about it. However, he had NOTHING positive to say about the BOM.

And that, right there, folks, is all you need to know about the substance of the arguments posed by our esteemed mr. wes.

[Doctor Steuss]

Totally off topic, but all of this Mark Twain talk reminded me of...

When the audience was ended and we were retiring from the presence, [brigham Young] put his hand on my head, beamed down on me in an admiring way, and said to my brother: â??Ahâ??your child, I presume? Boy or girl?"

Mark Twain, Roughing It

[thesometimesaint]

Selek:

Lying is easier to spell and pronounce

[LDSMusic483]

While Twain did not accept the Bible as the Word of God he did have SOME positive things to say about it. However, he had NOTHING positive to say about the BOM.

He thought we should be able to practice our religion as we saw fit and thought governmental intervention was laughable. No, he did not like us but we were just easier to point out.

[urroner]

I never said Twain or South Park were inspired by God. This is why I ignore posts by people like you urroner.

Well wes, if you would answer questions asked to you, people like me wouldn't go around making jabs at you. You make all sorts of wild accusations, but you will not back those accusations up with nothing but empty rhetoric. How can I take what you say seriously when you are doing this?

You hold us to one standard and tell us that we must reject our beliefs because they fail that standard, yet, as has already been mentioned, when your beliefs are held to the same standard, you, by simple logic, must reject your own beliefs, yet you refuse to acknowledge that. How can I take what you are saying seriously when you are doing this?

Either get off the porch and try to stay up with the big dawgs, or stay on the porch and quit whimpering. There are Evangelicals on this board who will hand me my head if I treated them the way you have treated us and most of the Mormons on this board would be cheering the Evangelicals on to do it some more because of my attitude. We have gotten into several good discussions, the EVers and us LDSers, and that's what I'm looking for from you, but all I end up finding is anti-Mormon fluff coming from you sans discussion. How can I take what you are saying seriously when you are doing this?

[selek]

While Twain did not accept the Bible as the Word of God he did have SOME positive things to say about it. However, he had NOTHING positive to say about the BOM.

This can be roughly translated as:

PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN!!!!!!

THE GREAT AND POWERFUL OZ HAS SPOKEN!

And with as little real impact.

Where's Scarecrow when Wes really needs him?

[wes]

Well wes, if you would answer questions asked to you, people like me wouldn't go around making jabs at you. You make all sorts of wild accusations, but you will not back those accusations up with nothing but empty rhetoric. How can I take what you say seriously when you are doing this?

You hold us to one standard and tell us that we must reject our beliefs because they fail that standard, yet, as has already been mentioned, when your beliefs are held to the same standard, you, by simple logic, must reject your own beliefs, yet you refuse to acknowledge that. How can I take what you are saying seriously when you are doing this?

Either get off the porch and try to stay up with the big dawgs, or stay on the porch and quit whimpering. There are Evangelicals on this board who will hand me my head if I treated them the way you have treated us and most of the Mormons on this board would be cheering the Evangelicals on to do it some more because of my attitude. We have gotten into several good discussions, and that's what I'm looking for from you, but all I end up finding is anti-Mormon fluff coming from you sans discussion. How can I take what you are saying seriously when you are doing this?

Jabs are one thing urroner, but you went beyond that and claimed I said something that I did not say.

[selek]

Selek:

Lying is easier to spell and pronounce

Yeah- but I wanted to see Wes take the time to crack a book and figure out what the heck I was calling him!

And I was referring more towards the slieght of hand of the magician than to the deceiptful distraction of the con artist.

Given Wes' behavior, I can, of course, understand your confusing the two.

[thesometimesaint]

selek:

Wes hasn't show such a prodigious accumulated knowledge yet. Maybe we should show him how to use the online dictionaries.

[urroner]

While Twain did not accept the Bible as the Word of God he did have SOME positive things to say about it. However, he had NOTHING positive to say about the BOM.

Mark Twain from "Roughing It"

Then for years the enormous migration across the plains to California poured through the land of the Mormons and yet the church remained staunch and true to its lord and master. Neither hunger, thirst, poverty, grief, hatred, contempt, nor persecution could drive the Mormons from their faith or their allegiance; and even the thirst for gold, which gleaned the flower of the youth and strength of many nations was not able to entice them! That was the final test. An experiment that could survive that was an experiment with some substance to it somewhere.

Nah, Twain never said anything good about them Marmins.

Again, some vile criticism of the Church by MT:

On some of those mountains, to the southwest, it had been raining every day for two weeks, but not a drop had fallen in the city. And on hot days in late spring and early autumn the citizens could quit fanning and growling and go out and cool off by looking at the luxury of a glorious snow-storm going on in the mountains. They could enjoy it at a distance, at those seasons, every day, though no snow would fall in their streets, or anywhere near them.

Salt Lake City was healthy--an extremely healthy city.

They declared there was only one physician in the place and he was arrested every week regularly and held to answer under the vagrant act for having "no visible means of support." They always give you a good substantial article of truth in Salt Lake, and good measure and good weight, too. [Very often, if you wished to weigh one of their airiest little commonplace statements you would want the hay scales.]

[Jason]

I haven't read the whole thread since I posted this morning, but why are people arguing over whether Mark Twain was an expert on the Book of Mormon? Are they claiming that he was a prophet or an archaeologist and not, say, a writer of fiction?

[urroner]

Jabs are one thing urroner, but you went beyond that and claimed I said something that I did not say.

And you are claiming we believe things that we don't and we keep correcting you yet you refuse to acknowledge any of what we say. How far beyond the mark does this go? Are you demanding that we abide by one standard, one which you don't have to abide by?

[selek]

selek:

Wes hasn't show such a prodigious accumulated knowledge yet. Maybe we should show him how to use the online dictionaries.

I dunno- we might start with something more his speed, first.

[wes]

I haven't read the whole thread since I posted this morning, but why are people arguing over whether Mark Twain was an expert on the Book of Mormon? Are they claiming that he was a prophet or an archaeologist and not, say, a writer of fiction?

Twain came up when someone tried to compare the BOM to great literature.

And you are claiming we believe things that we don't and we keep correcting you yet you refuse to acknowledge any of what we say. How far beyond the mark does this go? Are you demanding that we abide by one standard, one which you don't have to abide by?

Please show me where I've claimed you believe things that you don't.

[Zakuska]

I haven't read the whole thread since I posted this morning, but why are people arguing over whether Mark Twain was an expert on the Book of Mormon? Are they claiming that he was a prophet or an archaeologist and not, say, a writer of fiction?

Because wes compared the Bible to some popular Literary Giants and feined the Bible to be even better and superior to their writings.

[Jason]

So someone is arguing that if it's inspired writings then it must also read like great literature?

I don't doubt that God could produce a work of literature that would convince anyone who read it that its source must be divine, but would He?

[LDSMusic483]

Twain came up when someone tried to compare the BOM to great literature.Please show me where I've claimed you believe things that you don't.

Let me clarifiy...WES brought up Twain as the end all judge on literature, claiming that he had nothing good to say about the BoM, which is true. Then again, he had very little good to say about the Bible, but that "very little" that he did mention nicely about the bible is of needs be overwhelming support for it, by the literary expert Twain. Though I don't know as though he would think something that had "1000 lies, a wealth of obscenity, is a drugstore," and "and claims that "it is a greater surprise what it's deity does not know" was great literature, if not a fiction. So I wouldn't be pointing to Twain for any arguments about validity. Though he may think it written better, he obviously had the same opinion of its substance.

[wes]

Let me clarifiy...WES brought up Twain as the end all judge on literature, claiming that he had nothing good to say about the BoM, which is true. Then again, he had very little good to say about the Bible, but that "very little" that he did mention nicely about the bible is of needs be overwhelming support for it, by the literary expert Twain. Though I don't know as though he would think something that had "1000 lies, a wealth of obscenity, is a drugstore," and "and claims that "it is a greater surprise what it's deity does not know" was great literature, if not a fiction. So I wouldn't be pointing to Twain for any arguments about validity. Though he may think it written better, he obviously had the same opinion of its substance.

Not true. Lifeonaplate 1st brought up Twain. Check the thread.

[LDSMusic483]

Not true. Lifeonaplate 1st brought up Twain. Check the thread.

Ahem...my apologies...LifeOnaPlate did in fact mention the name of Mark Twain before.....as it was stated by someone he was quoting. You were the one who ripped out the name of Mark Twain saying "interesting you would mention Mark Twain..." when that wasn't the point of the quote. Mark Twain as a literary genius and anti-BoM was introduced by you.

[urroner]

Twain came up when someone tried to compare the BOM to great literature.Please show me where I've claimed you believe things that you don't.

When I say "we," I mean "we" as in the Church and that includes misquoting BY. You throw up quotes and then refuse to explain yourself or even to explain the quotes, so if I misinterpret your actions, whose fault is it? This is an old rouse used all the time here by those who are critical of the Church. We ask for them to explain their accusations and they only throw up more distorted quotes sans explanation and then they claim innocence in all their actions because they claim to have deniablity.

First you claim BY claimed that every sermon he has preached is equal to scripture, when he never did. Jesus also told us to go get a sword, so I guess that means Jesus is telling all of us to go buys all the guns we can.

From your very first post:

I am curious why people who ask certain questions regarding Mormonism are automatically considered anti-mormons? If something is true, it should hold up to any scrutiny. In fact, any and all questions should be welcomed if something is legitimately true and there is nothing to hide. Am I wrong?

you have demonstrated that you are not willing to discuss things, only throw out accusations and tripe. You'd make a great politician, say a lot, yet say so little.

In the above quote, you are accusing us of considering anybody who criticizes the Church as an AMer, but you said it in such a way that you have deniability in saying that you didn't say that we did that and this is how you do it constantly on this board. You're a definite pot stirrer.

So, why don't you discuss the problems you have with the Church in lieu of throwing out mindless accusations that you won't defend?

So, why do you hold the Church to standards that if your own belief system was held to, it would utterly fail?

Why did you continue to bring MT into the discussion when he has nothing to do with the truthfulness or the lack thereof of the Church?

Why do you behave like a trouble maker and then say that you aren't behaving like one?

[Aquilifer]

Ooh! Ooh! I want to play!

I would rather face an angry mob than 3 Christians who think they are doing the will of God.

-Mark Twain

This is fun!

Can we all agree that Twain's acid tongue is entertaining (even for Mormons), but that his views on religion in general, Christianity in particular, and Mormons specifically aren't exactly dispositive?

[ttribe]

So, why don't you discuss the problems you have with the Church in lieu of throwing out mindless accusations that you won't defend?

So, why do you hold the Church to standards that if your own belief system was held to, it would utterly fail?

Why did you continue to bring MT into the discussion when he has nothing to do with the truthfulness or the lack thereof of the Church?

Why do you behave like a trouble maker and then say that you aren't behaving like one?

Are these rhetorical questions?