Hyrum And Joseph's Last Words

[Cold Steel]

Based on everything we know, Joseph knew his time was up. When Emma wrote her scathing letter to him when he had the chance to get away, he said, "If my life has no value to my friends, it has none to me." He had previously called the Twelve together and conferred upon them all the keys of the kingdom, after which he said he was just as subject to death as anyone else. His friends noticed a sense of relief after this conferral of keys and one said he was like a school child let off early from class. He had placed his hands on Hyrum's head and blessed him with the the opportunity of living on and being a pillar in the church, but Hyrum refused the blessing and said that he would mix his fate with Joseph's fate. And on the way to Carthage, he made a number of references to his not returning alive, but of being slaughtered.

Not only that, he had prophesied that Elder Richards, who was easily the largest person with them, would survive unscathed though he would be in the midst of a hail of bullets.

Finally, those of you who have had the opportunity to be around live gunfire with no hearing protection know that it can be an unsettling experience, especially indoors and especially with many of them going off in succession. There also was the sound of the balls themselves, that, too, an unsettling sound. Joseph had just watched his brother take a large ball in the face and die. About that time, Joseph goes to the window and is hit twice. At that point he yells, "Oh Lord, my God!" and falls through the window. Granting that most peoples' last words are, "Oh, God!" or "Oh, [expletive]!" how likely is it that Joseph would have the calmness and presence of mind to give a distress signal to a mob of people with blackened faces shouting obscenities? If it were you, could you have had the presence of mind to say, "I, Nephi, having been born of goodly parents" if you had been convinced that it would have saved yourself and the people in that room? That's essentially what you're asking us to believe of Joseph.

[Lamanite]

Being a TBM I don't mind if Joseph employed the Masonic distress call. I also consider it a possibility that at that moment he saw God the Father on His thornes in the Celestial Kindom and cried out to Him. What I don't understand is why there is so much resistance to the former?

[Baurak Ale]

I think Baurak Ale implied that there might have been more to it than just a Masonic distress call by mentioning that Joseph restored the true version of the Grand Hailing Sign of Distress. This quote would seem to lend support to that idea:

Brother Richards was very much troubled, and exclaimed, "Oh! Brother Taylor, is it possible that they have killed both Brother Hyrum and Joseph? It cannot surely be, and yet I saw them shoot them;" and elevating his hands two or three times, he exclaimed, "Oh Lord, my God, spare Thy servants!" He then said, "Brother Taylor, this is a terrible event;" and he dragged me farther into the cell, saying, "I am sorry I can not do better for you;" and, taking an old, filthy mattress, he covered me with it, and said, "That may hide you, and you may yet live to tell the tale, but I expect they will kill me in a few moments!

--John Taylor, The Gospel Kingdom, p.362.

Thankyou Karmenraider that was exactly my point, I recently read a book with this entire account aswell as many others. As a young man I was quiet surprised if not a little unsettled that one of the purposes behind this form of prayer did not appear to be known or understood by members, that is being a distress call, a kind of "Broken Aarow" Distress call if you like.

Wiki: Broken arrow is also a type of code word that has been used to request close air support from all available aircraft when a ground position is in extreme danger of being overrun by enemy troops

Willard Richards fearing for his life in desperation: "and ELEVATING HIS HANDS TWO OR THREE TIMES, he exclaimed, "OH LORD, MY GOD, spare Thy servants!"

Everyone in the jail cell was familiar with both Masonic Signs and Temple Signs, Richards had heard the Prophet exclaim "Oh Lord, My God" but Joseph was killed before he could properly execute the Sign and Call. If he had of finished it he may not of died. Taylor was unconcious near the window sill as he made the first failed attempt to jump out the window but was shot in the knee. Taylor makes an allusion to some supernatural reason that prevented himself falling out the window. Moments after the Prophet issued forth the words "Oh Lord, My God" while making a dash for the window, Richards does the same sign and distress call, 2 or 3 times ELEVATING HIS HANDS with each invocation, not to be heard of the Masons in the Mob but to be heard of God.

[myleague]

how likely is it that Joseph would have the calmness and presence of mind to give a distress signal to a mob of people with blackened faces shouting obscenities? If it were you, could you have had the presence of mind to say, "I, Nephi, having been born of goodly parents" if you had been convinced that it would have saved yourself and the people in that room? That's essentially what you're asking us to believe of Joseph.

Probably a knee jerk reaction. This wasn't Joseph's first encounter with mobs and being in hostile circumstances. Knowing his end was coming I'm sure he rehearsed his last moments and actions over and over again.

I've never been in a gun battle but the sound of guns blazing doesn't unsettle me, I'm sure watching his brother die was probably the most troubling part of that night, but he knew it was coming.

If we pray for courage, does the Lord give us courage or opportunities to be courageous...

[Nevo]

Everyone in the jail cell was familiar with both Masonic Signs and Temple Signs, Richards had heard the Prophet exclaim "Oh Lord, My God" but Joseph was killed before he could properly execute the Sign and Call. If he had of finished it he may not of died. Taylor was unconcious near the window sill as he made the first failed attempt to jump out the window but was shot in the knee. Taylor makes an allusion to some supernatural reason that prevented himself falling out the window. Moments after the Prophet issued forth the words "Oh Lord, My God" while making a dash for the window, Richards does the same sign and distress call, 2 or 3 times ELEVATING HIS HANDS with each invocation, not to be heard of the Masons in the Mob but to be heard of God.

This is ridiculous.

Anyway, Willard Richards didn't give a temple sign or a masonic one, based on the description given. John Taylor was prevented from exiting the window by a musket ball smashing into his left thigh from behind and causing him to crumple to the floor, where he was hit by multiple shots--one ball striking his left forearm and lodging in his wrist, another striking below his left knee, and another tearing a chunk of flesh off his left hip which splattered the wall with blood. "Supernatural reason" indeed.

[Baurak Ale]

I don't think he rehearsed very much at all. A lot of what transpired in that small room the voilent breach and intrusion then the explosive volleys of gun fire had to be reacted to. All the men in the room made a lot of quick unrehearsed decisions living in the moment. I have thought a lot about Joseph's decision to make a leap dive attempt through the window.

IMO drawing from personal experience, I think the Prophet after the death of Hyrum, came into his own zone and had a moment of absolute calm crystal clarity not impinged upon by the surrounding ruckus or gunfire. In that moment where I imagine time stood still for him he understood perfectly that if he did not make an attempt to get out of that room the mob would not relent until they had killed every man in the room. I think the main reason behind the leap from the window was the understanding he would placate the mob and save remaining lives of the other men in the room.

[Baurak Ale]

This is ridiculous.

Anyway, Willard Richards didn't give a temple sign (#3) or a masonic one, based on the description given. John Taylor was prevented from exiting the window by a musket ball smashing into his left thigh from behind and causing him to crumple to the floor, where he was hit by multiple shots--one ball striking his left forearm and lodging in his wrist, another striking below his left knee, and another tearing a chunk of flesh off his left hip which splattered the wall with blood. "Supernatural reason" indeed.

John Taylor: "Not possessing any power to move, I felt myself falling outside of the window, but immediately I fell inside, from some, at that time, unknown cause." DHC, 7:99-108

Why does Willard Richards, raise his hands up and down three times while exclaiming 'Oh Lord My God', that would be my question and the logical one?

[Nevo]

Why does Willard Richards, raise his hands up and down three times while exclaiming 'Oh Lord My God', that would be my question and the logical one?

I don't think it's unheard of to pray with uplifted hands, especially in times of distress. In any case, Richards does not give the temple sign. The temple sign is not a cry of distress and it does not include the words "Oh Lord, my God, spare Thy servants!"

[Baurak Ale]

I don't think it's unheard of to pray with uplifted hands, especially in times of distress. In any case, Richards does not give the temple sign. The temple sign is not a cry of distress and it does not include the words "Oh Lord, my God, spare Thy servants!"

With a little more understanding it becomes obvious, however it is not easy as lds are not taught the language of symbolism or esoterics and its almost impossible without this equipment to pierce the veils and peal back the layers of the onion. Side note I think Nibley outlines the sole origin of prayer with uplifted hands comes from israelite temple worship, see temple and the cosmos (illustrations).

"We live in a world of symbols. No man or woman can come out of the temple endowed as he should be, unless he has seen, beyond the symbol, the mighty realities for which the symbols stand. (John A. Widtsoe, "Temple Worship," Utah Genealogical and Historical Magazine, April 1921, p. 62)"

[Nevo]

With a little more understanding it becomes obvious, however it is not easy as lds are not taught the language of symbolism or esoterics and its almost impossible without this equipment to pierce the veils and peal back the layers of the onion.

Well, I'll just have to take your word for it then. Willard Richards's prayer was really a secret "Sign and Call" that in some mysterious way known only to yourself summoned celestial "air support" and preserved him--though not his companions--from harm. If the others managed to properly perform the ritual they too would have been saved.

I guess I'm always going to be out of the loop on tin-foil hat Church history.

[Calm]

Why does Willard Richards, raise his hands up and down three times while exclaiming 'Oh Lord My God'...

CFR

[LifeOnaPlate]

I also haven't seen a reference on the Richards detail.

[kamenraider]

CFR

This was already posted by me on pg. 4 of this thread:

Brother Richards was very much troubled, and exclaimed, "Oh! Brother Taylor, is it possible that they have killed both Brother Hyrum and Joseph? It cannot surely be, and yet I saw them shoot them;" and elevating his hands two or three times, he exclaimed, "Oh Lord, my God, spare Thy servants!" He then said, "Brother Taylor, this is a terrible event;" and he dragged me farther into the cell, saying, "I am sorry I can not do better for you;" and, taking an old, filthy mattress, he covered me with it, and said, "That may hide you, and you may yet live to tell the tale, but I expect they will kill me in a few moments!

--John Taylor, The Gospel Kingdom, p.362.

[LifeOnaPlate]

Thanks, kaman!

[Calm]

Yes, thanks. Missed it the first time around.

[Baurak Ale]

Nevo let me get this straight as I am only a simple creature, and I want to be sure to understand you.

You are saying that inspite of Joseph Smith yelling out, 'Oh Lord My God' before his leap from the window then only moments later after the mob has rushed down stairs. Willard Richards then drags John Taylor into the opposite adjoining cell, also up stairs because it seems more secure having an iron door, covers Talor in a matress then raises his arms up and down three times while exclaiming, 'Oh Lord My God, Spare thy Servants". You are saying he is not giving a temple sign at all, as you say its not uncommon for people to pray with uplifted hands? So Richards is sort of just for some strange reason raising his hands up and down 3 times while saying 'Oh Lord My God, Spare thy Servants"?

Nevo:

I don't think it's unheard of to pray with uplifted hands, especially in times of distress. In any case, Richards does not give the temple sign. The temple sign is not a cry of distress and it does not include the words "Oh Lord, my God, spare Thy servants!"

"The temple sign is not a sign of distress", that it cannot be used as such is news to me, and its also news to me the wording is static.

[Nevo]

Nevo let me get this straight as I am only a simple creature, and I want to be sure to understand you.

You are saying that inspite of Joseph Smith yelling out, 'Oh Lord My God' before his leap from the window then only moments later after the mob has rushed down stairs. Willard Richards then drags John Taylor into the opposite adjoining cell, also up stairs because it seems more secure having an iron door, covers Talor in a matress then raises his arms up and down three times while exclaiming, 'Oh Lord My God, Spare thy Servants". You are saying he is not giving a temple sign at all, as you say its not uncommon for people to pray with uplifted hands? So Richards is sort of just for some strange reason raising his hands up and down 3 times while saying 'Oh Lord My God, Spare thy Servants"?

Yes, I am saying that I am not aware of any temple sign where someone raises their hands "two or three times" while exclaiming "Oh Lord, my God, spare thy servants" (either in Adamic or English). Of course, I don't know exactly what the endowment ceremony was like in Nauvoo but it doesn't match anything in the current ceremony.

"The temple sign is not a sign of distress", that it cannot be used as such is news to me, and its also news to me the wording is static.

Was Adam in mortal danger when he built an altar of stones and offered up prayer? Was that a "broken arrow" distress call? That would be news to me. (And yes, I do think the wording of temple rituals is fairly static. It tends not to be freely improvised in any case.)