changed Posted August 22, 2013 Author Posted August 22, 2013 You are wrong on so many levels. For starters, the BoM warns of secret combinations in government. Now we know that the book was written first and foremost for the Lamanite remnants. Let me ask this- what is the number one problem we see in Mexico, and Central America, South America? Corruption in government- secret combinations.Lets start with that. Have you seen this M.M.?https://www.lds.org/youth/video/origin?lang=engdraws wonderful parallels between where we are now, and where Joseph was then... history does tend to repeat itself.
thesometimesaint Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 (edited) exactly - "new world" can mean "new age" or new time period, a place (Disney Wrold), a group of people (world of music) .. there are worlds within worlds, multiple worlds that now stand... and only one of these ill-defined worlds was formed ~6,000 years ago. I do find it is interesting that man first learned how to read and write ~6000 years ago. It opened up whole new worlds to us. Edited August 22, 2013 by thesometimesaint 1
Freedom Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 You are wrong on so many levels. For starters, the BoM warns of secret combinations in government. Now we know that the book was written first and foremost for the Lamanite remnants. Let me ask this- what is the number one problem we see in Mexico, and Central America, South America? Corruption in government- secret combinations. Lets start with that. Are you suggesting that corrupt government is unique to our day? They destroyed his own civilization and he was warning future generations not repeat the mistakes of his own people. Now, if he said drug cartels, and markets for cocaine up north then we can talk but for heaven's sake, secret combinations have been around since men could think. Does 1455 and Prince Suyang of Joseon ring a bell? How about 1529 A.D. anyone? The first evidence we have of organized crime is in ancient eqypt. Secret combinations is no more a unique problem of our day than lying or fornication. Pretty much every government that collapses throughout history can blame secret combinations for its demise. Try again.
Rob Osborn Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 Are you suggesting that corrupt government is unique to our day? They destroyed his own civilization and he was warning future generations not repeat the mistakes of his own people. Now, if he said drug cartels, and markets for cocaine up north then we can talk but for heaven's sake, secret combinations have been around since men could think. Does 1455 and Prince Suyang of Joseon ring a bell? How about 1529 A.D. anyone? The first evidence we have of organized crime is in ancient eqypt. Secret combinations is no more a unique problem of our day than lying or fornication. Pretty much every government that collapses throughout history can blame secret combinations for its demise. Try again.Wrong, I hit the nail righr on its head. It proves that the BoM was written for our day. It proves that the writings apply directly to us for our use immediately.
Freedom Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 Wrong, I hit the nail righr on its head. It proves that the BoM was written for our day. It proves that the writings apply directly to us for our use immediately. No, because you would have to prove that this is a unique problem for our day and that no secret combinations existed in the Americas or anywhere else prior to the coming forth of the Book of Mormon. Is murder unique to our day? The book of mormon warns about that too. What about record keeping?
Rob Osborn Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 No, because you would have to prove that this is a unique problem for our day and that no secret combinations existed in the Americas or anywhere else prior to the coming forth of the Book of Mormon. Is murder unique to our day? The book of mormon warns about that too. What about record keeping?You are looking for some exact thing that perhaps you may never find. The Book of Mormon was written for our latter day which probably expands over several hundred years. The warnings and preparations given for our day are to prepare us for the millennium and Christs return. If you are looking for something more exact then you are searching in vain and end up missing the whole point of why it is meant "for our day".
Freedom Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 You are looking for some exact thing that perhaps you may never find. The Book of Mormon was written for our latter day which probably expands over several hundred years. The warnings and preparations given for our day are to prepare us for the millennium and Christs return. If you are looking for something more exact then you are searching in vain and end up missing the whole point of why it is meant "for our day". Well, since the book never claims to have been written for our day I think it is better to say you are looking in vain for evidence that is not justified by the text. I think the problem is that you are confusing the notion that it is relevant to our day with being written for our day. The book is certainly relevant to our day, but was not written for our day. The author could not possibly written for our day because he had no idea what our day is like. A vehicle that is built for off road is built for that specific purpose. Certainly, you can have a standard street car such as a jeep and use if off road, but it is not necessarily specifically designed for off road uses. The book of mormon has transcendent applications, but it was not specifically written with the needs of our day in mind. It never makes such a claim so stating as such is conjecture that is not justified by the content.
Rob Osborn Posted August 22, 2013 Posted August 22, 2013 Well, since the book never claims to have been written for our day I think it is better to say you are looking in vain for evidence that is not justified by the text. I think the problem is that you are confusing the notion that it is relevant to our day with being written for our day. The book is certainly relevant to our day, but was not written for our day. The author could not possibly written for our day because he had no idea what our day is like. A vehicle that is built for off road is built for that specific purpose. Certainly, you can have a standard street car such as a jeep and use if off road, but it is not necessarily specifically designed for off road uses. The book of mormon has transcendent applications, but it was not specifically written with the needs of our day in mind. It never makes such a claim so stating as such is conjecture that is not justified by the content.You are clearly mistaken. You should go and read the Book of Mormon, it will change your mind, it really was written for our day (a period of time of some 200 years).
Freedom Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 You are clearly mistaken. You should go and read the Book of Mormon, it will change your mind, it really was written for our day (a period of time of some 200 years). Ah yes, when one cannot produce evidence it is best to resort to condescending insults. So are you suggesting that it will not apply in the year 2113? Because that would mean our day was 300 years. Or what about 2213? At what point does 'our day' expire?
Rob Osborn Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 Ah yes, when one cannot produce evidence it is best to resort to condescending insults. So are you suggesting that it will not apply in the year 2113? Because that would mean our day was 300 years. Or what about 2213? At what point does 'our day' expire?The BoM was written for our time for the purpose to convince the Lamanite remnants of who they are, where they came from and to bring them to Christ. Also, it was written to convince both jew and gentile that Jesus is the Christ. Last time I checked all three of tjose purposes were coming to pass. Thus- it applies directly to us and will continue until it achieves its purpose.
Freedom Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 What you don't seem to understand is the basic grammatical construct of 'written for our times'. only something written today can be written for our time. You are confusing being written for our times with directly applying to our times. I find that many of your arguments suffer from the same failing. You change the definition of words and reject evidence to suite your opinion. Your argument about the Maya is a case in point.
Rob Osborn Posted August 23, 2013 Posted August 23, 2013 What you don't seem to understand is the basic grammatical construct of 'written for our times'. only something written today can be written for our time. You are confusing being written for our times with directly applying to our times. I find that many of your arguments suffer from the same failing. You change the definition of words and reject evidence to suite your opinion. Your argument about the Maya is a case in point.I reject opinions of evidence that I find goes against my own findings. We are all smart and can judge things ourselves. If you dont wanna believe the BoM was written for our times then thats fine.The issue with the Maya is the fact that the evidence shows they were a highly evolved and warmongering society that built monumental structures and stela that recorded their constant conquering of kings. A careful reading of the BoM places the Maya more in line with the Jaredite culture rather than the Nephite culture.
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