Olavarria Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 (edited) [media=] One of the classic digs against the Book of Mormon is why a party of 30 Israelites, landing at around 600bc, among millions of "Behring Straiters" wouldn't leave behind Hebrew language in a native lexicon. Brian Stubbs has done work in this area, showing that they did. I don't know if they have or haven't; I lean towards "no". Either way, I present to you the Macanese.Macao was a Chinese colony of Portugal up until the 1990's much like Hong Kong was to the United Kingdom. Macanese is form of Sino-Portuguese that only has 50 remaining speakers, all elderly. If Portugal's cultural influence on Macao is waning, despite hundreds of years of direct colonial influence and contact. What are we to expect from a dynasty founded by 30 or so people, isolated from the motherland, 2,400 years ago?If nothing else, the song is fun:) Edited June 27, 2012 by Olavarria
Grillmeister Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 Millions of Behring Straiters? I thought the Promised Land had been preserved by God for only those He directed there? Ether says this is limited to "a righteous people" and only those who would "serve him or be swept off". Why would it say that if, in fact, the Jaredites and Lehites were just a drop in the bucket of people already living in the Americas?And what about the Brass Plates, taken for the express purpose of preserving the language of the people? Shouldn't the millions of Nephites and Lamanites have all been speaking Hebrew (or something related) because of this?I think the reason why this continues to be a "classic dig" is because it adheres to the interpretation of the Book of Mormon given by church authorities, not by apologists. The apologetic interpretation (limited geography theory) just doesn't match up with what the prophets and apostles have taught, nor with the text of the BoM.
Hamilton Porter Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 (edited) Millions of Behring Straiters? I thought the Promised Land had been preserved by God for only those He directed there?That's ancient near eastern hyperbolic rhetoric, just chill out enjoy the funny video. Edited June 27, 2012 by Hamilton Porter
Calm Posted June 28, 2012 Posted June 28, 2012 If nothing else, the song is fun:)So I know Spanish, not Portuguese but it is very strange to hear what sounds like Spanish spoken with a Chinese accent.
JeremyOrbe-Smith Posted June 28, 2012 Posted June 28, 2012 So maybe God inspired the Bering Straiters. Heck, the Book of Mormon already says that the "pagan" Great Spirit of the Native Americans is the same as God the Father (who, in John, is Spirit as we all are). If every people of the world have had the gospel and all are related, then it shouldn't surprise us to find closer and closer relationships between world religions to further back in history we go; for instance the Tengriism of the Central Asian steppes is similar to so many religions, as are the names shared from Egypt to Polynesia, as are the Indo-European stories which stretch into our own civilization, etc. etc.. It's all part of the worldwide root of all religions, the mother tree the Book of Mormon is attempting to graft us back into by showing us the effects which schism and civil war have.
bcuzbcuz Posted June 28, 2012 Posted June 28, 2012 [media=] One of the classic digs against the Book of Mormon is why a party of 30 Israelites, landing at around 600bc, among millions of "Behring Straiters" wouldn't leave behind Hebrew language in a native lexicon. Brian Stubbs has done work in this area, showing that they did. I don't know if they have or haven't; I lean towards "no". Either way, I present to you the Macanese.Macao was a Chinese colony of Portugal up until the 1990's much like Hong Kong was to the United Kingdom. Macanese is form of Sino-Portuguese that only has 50 remaining speakers, all elderly. If Portugal's cultural influence on Macao is waning, despite hundreds of years of direct colonial influence and contact. What are we to expect from a dynasty founded by 30 or so people, isolated from the motherland, 2,400 years ago?If nothing else, the song is fun:)Your comparison is a poor one. My son-in-law, born i Macao, currently living in Portugal, recently competed in an art competition in Macao. During his two week stay there he visited a Portugese school but there are an additional 5 schools that teach Portugese. The Chinese government recently lengthened the treaty for Macao and sees an advantage in having people learning Portugese for business dealings with Portugal and Brazil. He's spoke mostly Portugese and English while there but commented that Cantonese was everywhere and that speaking Mandarin only resulted in blank stares.Since Macau's law system is based on Portugese law, including their legislature, the law structures remain the same. If you get stopped by the police you will have your rights stated in Cantonese and Portugese.
brightpath Posted July 4, 2012 Posted July 4, 2012 Thank you Grillmaester! There were no Asians here when Lehi landed. To make this statement means they do not understand the Book of Mormon or Gods prophecies.
ERayR Posted July 4, 2012 Posted July 4, 2012 Grillmeister;Thou hast confused me. That is because he is confused.
ANACO Posted July 5, 2012 Posted July 5, 2012 I believe Grillmeister was stating that since Sino-Portugese appeared to be on the way out from a colony in or near mainland China, which Portugese influence was recent (17th-18th Century) why should we expect to see Hebrew in Native American languages from 420 A.D.?Decent point.
ERayR Posted July 5, 2012 Posted July 5, 2012 Thank you Grillmaester! There were no Asians here when Lehi landed. To make this statement means they do not understand the Book of Mormon or Gods prophecies.Is this a first hand observation or can I safely assume you are guessing?
Ron Beron Posted July 5, 2012 Posted July 5, 2012 Thank you Grillmaester! There were no Asians here when Lehi landed. To make this statement means they do not understand the Book of Mormon or Gods prophecies.Tell that to the 500 tribes of Native Americans who traveled from Asia.BTW, the Portuguese also made it to Japan where there too they influenced the language with loan words, e.g., tobako, Iesu Kirisuto, etc.
Hamilton Porter Posted July 5, 2012 Posted July 5, 2012 Your comparison is a poor one. My son-in-law, born i Macao, currently living in Portugal, recently competed in an art competition in Macao. During his two week stay there he visited a Portugese school but there are an additional 5 schools that teach Portugese. The Chinese government recently lengthened the treaty for Macao and sees an advantage in having people learning Portugese for business dealings with Portugal and Brazil. He's spoke mostly Portugese and English while there but commented that Cantonese was everywhere and that speaking Mandarin only resulted in blank stares.Since Macau's law system is based on Portugese law, including their legislature, the law structures remain the same. If you get stopped by the police you will have your rights stated in Cantonese and Portugese.The couple of Macao people I've known speak only some Portuguese and they were pretty educated. Their passports were Portuguese. But compared to Portugal's other colonies, the Portuguese influence is quite small.
Recommended Posts