Utah - A Changing State

[jskains]

That is what is confusing me.. The decrease in LDS, but every report I see is that the net stake growth is still in the positive.

[Grundelwalken]

That is what is confusing me.. The decrease in LDS, but every report I see is that the net stake growth is still in the positive.

Exactly! It's not that population is dwindling -- it's that population is transplanting to other places. Families in the church still grow and converts still join but not in the same areas where they once did. MW

[altersteve]

That is what is confusing me.. The decrease in LDS, but every report I see is that the net stake growth is still in the positive.

The LDS population (in the world, not just in Utah) is rising, and it's rising fast, but the non-LDS population is rising faster. So the percentage of LDS people is decreasing, but the amount of Latter-day Saints worldwide is rising quickly.

[Scott Lloyd]

I don't live in Utah, but I follow the SL Tribune for news and comments. I'm shocked at how many disgruntled people

there are in SLC...bitter towards the LDS. Bitter is perhaps too nice...hatred is a more appropriate word.

Seems like the spirit of Missouri and Illinois has followed the Saints west, set down roots, and is open

for business. Or am I reading too much into what I see?

Bernard

To counter the dreary view reflected in the Tribune, you might like to subscribe to the new Deseret News national edition, a weekly compilation of selected content from the daily paper bundled with the Church News.

[Scott Lloyd]

When I was there 20 something years ago, Utah seemed to be 20 years behind everyone else in the country, are you saying they finally caught up?

How does having a preponderance of LDS in the population equate to being 20 years behind the times?

This is a non-sequitur.

[CARPE DIEM]

How does having a preponderance of LDS in the population equate to being 20 years behind the times?

This is a non-sequitur.

Scott,

Could it mean that the people in Utah were more LDS years ago and more and more non-LDS are moving into Utah for non-LDS reasons therefor making it a more Liberal state and opening things up or more worldly? When I moved there in 2002 and everyone was listening to 80's music.

Edited October 19, 2011 by CARPE DIEM

[Scott Lloyd]

Scott,

Could it mean that the people in Utah were more LDS years ago and more and more non-LDS are moving into Utah for non-LDS reasons therefor making it a more Liberal state and opening things up or more worldly? When I moved there in 2002 and everyone was listening to 80's music.

Hmm. I'm recalling that a few seasons ago David Archuleta, a Mormon from Utah, reached the finals of the "American Idol" competition and went on to a rather lucrative and stellar career.

And right now, "Vocal Point," an a cappella group from BYU, appear to be the favorite act on "The Sing-Off" show.

Of course, this week, they did perform "Footloose," an '80s song. I guess we're hopelessly stuck in the past.

I don't think it has to do with Mormonism though, any more than I think Mormonism influences my taste for the surf songs and British Invasion music of the '60s.

Edited October 19, 2011 by Scott Lloyd

[CQUIRK]

That is what is confusing me.. The decrease in LDS, but every report I see is that the net stake growth is still in the positive.

Did you not read my link?

BTW, the reason why the church decreases in some areas and increases in others mainly has to do with the local economy.

Where I live in Carson City, we had two wards merge together and not much growth. But then again, Carson is not a big city and there are few jobs and opportunities out here- plus our quality of life is also decreasing as well. In fact a lot of the LDS families are moving out of here and either to Reno, Utah, or nearby Dayton- it seems that the church in Dayton is growing better there then in Carson, albeit from all the LDS families relocating over there- owing to the split in the one Dayton ward.

Back to Utah; yes, the Church population was shrinking there until a few years ago. The recession hit, and while Utah is in a better off position then most other states, still, the Utah economy isn't as great as it was before 2007, and the rate of non-LDS moving into the state has somewhat decreased.

I believe, however, that the LDS population (including those that aren't active), will never shrink to the point that they will be less then 60% of the state population- counting the factors of the high birthrate among LDS families, and also the fact that many LDS families and individuals from other states and nations are also relocating to Utah in good numbers, added to the fact that the non-LDS migration has tempered down because of the economy; I believe that Church growth is going to rebound in Utah for awhile.

Its noted that the LDS population always decreases whenever Utah has an economic boom and then increases back during an economic bust; that's how the pattern goes in that state.

On the matter of the counties in Utah- yes, SLC and some counties there have seen decreases in the LDS population, obviously owing to the issues such as the economy and the standard of living. However there are many other counties out there that have increasing numbers/percentages of LDS- including Tooele, Utah County, etc. That can be attributed to many LDS and LDS families moving out of SLC and into areas that they consider to have a better standard of living, and less urban sprawl.

So the decrease in SLC is understandable with those noted factors. Also one must note that SLC has always had a good size non-LDS population since the early 20th Century.

However, one must wonder- with the recent temples the Church has built there, and with the Downtown Rising project that the Church is funding... If there's a possibility that the LDS population could eventually rebound in Salt Lake County and even downtown SLC itself?

[CQUIRK]

I don't live in Utah, but I follow the SL Tribune for news and comments. I'm shocked at how many disgruntled people

there are in SLC...bitter towards the LDS. Bitter is perhaps too nice...hatred is a more appropriate word.

Seems like the spirit of Missouri and Illinois has followed the Saints west, set down roots, and is open

for business. Or am I reading too much into what I see?

Yes you are reading into too mucb of what you see.

The SLT newspaper has always had a bias against the LDS Church, heck the paper was founded by a dissident member of the Church, don't forget that. So I think a paper like that and its blogs are naturally a magnet for all kinds of anti-Mormon kooks and creeps out there, whether religious or secular.

BTW, what makes you think all those bitter, hateful voices actually live in Utah?

YAY! MY 1,000TH POST

Edited October 20, 2011 by CQUIRK

[William Schryver]

How does having a preponderance of LDS in the population equate to being 20 years behind the times?

This is a non-sequitur.

Not only that, but his assertion is patently untrue. All one had to do was spend his youth at Lagoon (as I did) during the late 60s and 70s in order to know that Utah was, in every substantial respect, fully "in step" with what was going on in the "outside" world. Look at the list of rock bands that played at Lagoon in the 60s and 70s (Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, The Doors, The Rolling Stones, Creedence Clearwater Revival, etc., etc., etc.). I also distinctly recall walking through the pavilion area (covered picnic area) of the park in the evenings, where one could see going on everything (and I mean everything) that was going on at Woodstock or San Francisco or Los Angeles.

So, in short, it is a complete myth that Utah was "behind the times" in the way suggested by the poster above. Believe me, you could find anything in Utah that you could find in California at the same time--for better or worse.

[William Schryver]

Scott,

Could it mean that the people in Utah were more LDS years ago and more and more non-LDS are moving into Utah for non-LDS reasons therefor making it a more Liberal state and opening things up or more worldly? When I moved there in 2002 and everyone was listening to 80's music.

Another myth. Actually, Salt Lake City is known around the country for having had one of the best independent radio stations to be found (KRCL). (Available online at http://www.krcl.org/), KRCL has been, for many, many years, the place to go on the radio dial for the widest variety of all kinds of music, from pre-WWII blues to the most current stuff from around the world. I imagine it's a case of knowing where to look, but I was a faithful LDS and I didn't have any trouble finding any of this stuff--as a result I have a collection of some of the best music ever made, from the 1920s to the present day.

I've seen bands perform in Dallas, Phoenix, Tucson, San Diego, San Francisco, Las Vegas, New Orleans ... all around the country, and nowhere I've been has superior venues than have been in SLC over the years. Until it closed a few years ago, The Zephyr Club on Broadway and West Temple was absolutely the finest club venue (greatest ambience and sound system) I have ever been in. It beats the Fillmore West in San Francisco hands down. The Fillmore is a freaking barn; a warehouse with speakers mounted on the wall. Red Butte Gardens and the Gallivan Center in SLC are two of the best outdoor venues I have ever seen.

I'm always amused by the ignorance of people who simply have no idea what they're talking about.

[Jaybear]

I'm always amused by the ignorance of people who simply have no idea what they're talking about.

... or perhaps SLC is the exception to the rule.

I was in Provo last month, and the song that I heard over and over was "Don't Stop Believing", which I remember being a hit back in SLC in the early 80s.

[William Schryver]

... or perhaps SLC is the exception to the rule.

I was in Provo last month, and the song that I heard over and over was "Don't Stop Believing", which I remember being a hit back in SLC in the early 80s.

Maybe you should stop listening to the same classic rock station with a 10 song playlist.

But I do confess I never spent much time in Utah County.

[William Schryver]

Of the places I've been around the country, I'd rank Pittsburgh up there with SLC for radio stations that were as good as KRCL. Dang good radio in Pittsburgh.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

YAY! MY 1,000TH POST

Slow poke.

Lol

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

... or perhaps SLC is the exception to the rule.

I was in Provo last month, and the song that I heard over and over was "Don't Stop Believing", which I remember being a hit back in SLC in the early 80s.

I am pretty sure that that song was not just a hit in SLC in the 80's.

[Jaybear]

Maybe you should stop listening to the same classic rock station with a 10 song playlist.

But I do confess I never spent much time in Utah County.

You are missing out. They are very hospitable. When I was there last month, they gave the Utah team seven footballs.

They also finally learned about flash mobs. Its the hottest rage these days.

[William Schryver]

You are missing out. They are very hospitable. When I was there last month, they gave the Utah team seven footballs.

Oh, my, Jaybear!

That is very likely the funniest thing I can ever remember you posting here.

Yes, for a BYU fan, it was an excruciating sight to behold--from start to finish. Literally from start to finish.

I assume you've already seen this, but I don't think it will ever get old:

If only Hypes had torn his ACL in the first quarter against Ole Miss, then BYU might very well still be unbeaten with Nelson at the helm.

[William Schryver]

You are missing out. They are very hospitable. When I was there last month, they gave the Utah team seven footballs.

They also finally learned about flash mobs. Its the hottest rage these days.

I desperately want back the 4 minutes and 21 seconds of my life I just wasted watching that video.

And I am thoroughly convinced that "Dance Major" must be removed from the curriculum at BYU. Furthermore, I've decided that they must, forthwith, begin supplementing with valium all beverages sold on campus to caucasian males with a BMI over 25. It should not be legal for an overweight white male of the species to move his body in the manner seen above, and I believe barbiturate supplements are the only answer if this type of impulse is common among male BYU students.

(I attended the University of Utah, but I root for BYU football ... I don't have an explanation, so don't ask for one.)

Edited October 20, 2011 by William Schryver

[LeSellers]

(I attended the University of Utah, but I root for BYU football ... I don't have an explanation, so don't ask for one.)

Repentance jumps instantly to mind.

Lehi, who has no allegiance to the UoU, BYU, or own alma mater, the UofMD.

[CARPE DIEM]

Another myth. Actually, Salt Lake City is known around the country for having had one of the best independent radio stations to be found (KRCL). (Available online at http://www.krcl.org/), KRCL has been, for many, many years, the place to go on the radio dial for the widest variety of all kinds of music, from pre-WWII blues to the most current stuff from around the world. I imagine it's a case of knowing where to look, but I was a faithful LDS and I didn't have any trouble finding any of this stuff--as a result I have a collection of some of the best music ever made, from the 1920s to the present day.

I've seen bands perform in Dallas, Phoenix, Tucson, San Diego, San Francisco, Las Vegas, New Orleans ... all around the country, and nowhere I've been has superior venues than have been in SLC over the years. Until it closed a few years ago, The Zephyr Club on Broadway and West Temple was absolutely the finest club venue (greatest ambience and sound system) I have ever been in. It beats the Fillmore West in San Francisco hands down. The Fillmore is a freaking barn; a warehouse with speakers mounted on the wall. Red Butte Gardens and the Gallivan Center in SLC are two of the best outdoor venues I have ever seen.

I'm always amused by the ignorance of people who simply have no idea what they're talking about.

I'm glad your amused. My thoughts were simply opinion and conjecture! I never suggested nor offered any facts. Just another case of misunderstanding? Or perhaps your congenial reputation precedes you on these boards. lol

[William Schryver]

I'm glad your (sic) amused. My thoughts were simply opinion and conjecture! I never suggested nor offered any facts.

That was quite apparent.

Just another case of misunderstanding?

That, or just plain ignorance of the Salt Lake City music scene.

Or perhaps your congenial reputation precedes you on these boards. lol

I'm sure my congenial reputation precedes me everywhere I go that I've already been.

[CARPE DIEM]

Your Humility is touching!