Duncan Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 Acting on a clue from another thread one of the verses that was used was John 1:33 that says something to the effect that John did not know Jesus or did not know him as the Messiah and so I was wondering if John knew Jesus previous to Jesus' baptism? or if he knew him but not as the Messiah, what do you think their relationship was? Link to comment
LeSellers Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 I was wondering if John knew Jesus previous to Jesus' baptism? or if he knew him but not as the Messiah, what do you think their relationship was?The word translated "cousin" in Luke 1:36 (also 58) is better "relative". It's unlikely that John and Jesus were second cousins. The only thing that points to the two boys, John and Jesus, being closely related or that their families were close, is that Mary went to Elisabeth right after she became pregnant. However, Jesus tells us that John's father, Zacharias, was killed while seeking refuge by holding the horns of the altar. (See Luke 11:51.) Why? Because he refused to tell Herod's soldiers where John, his ~2yo son was hiding with Elizabeth. John truly "was in the deserts till the day of his shewing unto Israel." He was hiding for some 28 years. As he, John, was incommunicado all the while he and Jesus were growing up, they probably had very little interaction. I do believe, however, that John knew Who he'd be running before, and Who he'd baptize (although he was unaware he'd perform the ordinance) and the the Holy Ghost revealed the personal identity of the Messiah once Jesus came to him in Jordan. Lehi Link to comment
ed2276 Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 The word translated "cousin" in Luke 1:36 (also 58) is better "relative". It's unlikely that John and Jesus were second cousins. The only thing that points to the two boys, John and Jesus, being closely related or that their families were close, is that Mary went to Elisabeth right after she became pregnant. However, Jesus tells us that John's father, Zacharias, was killed while seeking refuge by holding the horns of the altar. (See Luke 11:51.) Why? Because he refused to tell Herod's soldiers where John, his ~2yo son was hiding with Elizabeth. John truly "was in the deserts till the day of his shewing unto Israel." He was hiding for some 28 years. As he, John, was incommunicado all the while he and Jesus were growing up, they probably had very little interaction. I do believe, however, that John knew Who he'd be running before, and Who he'd baptize (although he was unaware he'd perform the ordinance) and the the Holy Ghost revealed the personal identity of the Messiah once Jesus came to him in Jordan. LehiHow does this square with John saying "I did not know him..." (the Chosen One, who would baptize with the Holy Spirit) before he came to John? John was to look for the sign of the Holy Spirit resting on the person, and by that sign he would know that person to be the Chosen One. When John saw the sign of the Holy Spirit resting on Jesus, at that point John received the confirming sign that he was told to look for. Additionally, the Father confirmed that this person was the Chosen One when He told John, "This is my beloved son...". I did a bit of an analysis about this in Bernard Gui's thread "Who told John to baptize with water?". The one thing that did strike me was that even though John said "I did not know him...", John appears to recognize Jesus as the Messiah/Chosen One when Jesus comes to John and before John sees the sign of the Holy Spirit resting on Jesus. John says, I paraphrase, "You want me to baptize you? I am not worthy to baptize you. I have need to be baptized by you." After saying this, John baptizes Jesus and then sees the confirming sign he had been told to look for. Link to comment
LeSellers Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 How does this square with John saying "I did not know him..." (the Chosen One, who would baptize with the Holy Spirit) before he came to John? John was to look for the sign of the Holy Spirit resting on the person, and by that sign he would know that person to be the Chosen One. John knew that he was the one running before the Messiah to prepare the way for Him. He did not know, as I tried to say earlier, the individual's identity (but I believe he did know that it was his kinsman, Jesus, but that he did not recognize Him immediately when he came to Jordan). John did receive a witness, by the Holy Ghost (not that it met the precise criterion he expected), that Jesus was the Messiah when He did show up. In addition, it seems that John did not know that he'd actually perform the baptism for the Master. But that would have been a detail, and hardly means the theory is untenable. Lehi Link to comment
gooseyh011a Posted December 23, 2010 Share Posted December 23, 2010 Since John stayed in the desert "wilderness" (south of Israel) his life until he appeared publically, and since Jesus lived in Nazareth then I don't think they knew each other that well, if at all. Link to comment
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