Catholic/Orthodox Theosis and the Creation of Worlds

[Ambrose]

However, whether Democtritus or any other Greek philosopher (their "natural scientists") would agree with either side of the debate is pointless. They did not have the requisite revelation to know what happened during the Creation.

I agree that whether any thinker agrees with the phraseology of Scripture is pointless. But what is of extreme importance to me is the early understanding of "void", and its relation to that which exists.

[3DOP]

For Tsuzuki:

We are through grace children of God, consequently His heirs and co-heirs with Christ. As St. Anselm asks: What is there in Heaven or on earth or beneath the earth that must not obey and be subject to those whom the Lord of all things has chosen as His friends and adopted as His children?

---The Glories of Divine Grace, Fr. Matthias Scheeben, TAN Publishers (2000), ch. 25 (Grace Makes Us Members of the Kingdom of God and Participants of His Dominion Over All Things), p. 148, 149

In the same chapter the author reminds us that the divinized souls are the adopted children of God, and the bride of Christ. What loving father does not pass His choicest things to His children? What good husband, "king of his castle", does not regard his wife as queen? But I would not be misleading. It seems to the author (and me) that the formation of new worlds would not be "high on the list" of activities worthy of deified souls after all Creation made by and for the Son, are made subject to Him.

As man is the crown and glory of the earth, the soul adorned with grace is the crown and glory of Heaven and earth, in short, of all Creation. Our faith teaches that all things were created for the only-begotten Son of God and all things in Heaven and earth are destined for his honor and glory. But the adopted children of God are one with Him. They reign with Him and all His love rests on them. They are, then, together with the Son of God, the highest end and destiny of Creation.

---ibid. p. 149 (emphasis mine)

It seems to this Catholic like the desire for new worlds or any other "things to do" in heaven are symptomatic of a fear of "heavenly malaise". We are always in search of new hobbies and amusements because things "get old" here below. We tire of our favorite movies and our favorite music changes over time because we long to discover and we eventually exhaust created joys by knowing it fully. It is my opinion, nay, my faith, that the grace-filled, deified soul so privileged to an eternity of non-stop mysticism, enjoying the vision of God, will never know weariness in God, ever discovering new wonders. Ever obedient to God's will, I don't think a Catholic can definitively say at this time that it is impossible that the deified soul could be asked by God to participate in new creations, but it would seem to be an anti-climactic activity. My opinion is that they could participate, but that they probably will not.

Ambrose

Remember that in the Catholic understanding of theosis, we are not made gods individually, but as a Church, and as a whole.

3DOP

I haven't heard this distinction made before. Maybe you could explain it a little further? Do not the deified souls enjoy differing degrees of glory? To me this implies individual deification.

Thanks,

3DOP

[Tsuzuki]

Ever obedient to God's will, I don't think a Catholic can definitively say at this time that it is impossible that the deified soul could be asked by God to participate in new creations, but it would seem to be an anti-climactic activity.

On the contrary, I think that participation with God creatively is the most perfect union one can have. Would you consider participation with God in the creation of other humans through procreation to be an anti-climactic activity?

I haven't heard this distinction made before. Maybe you could explain it a little further? Do not the deified souls enjoy differing degrees of glory? To me this implies individual deification.

I may be wrong, but I think he means that it would be impossible for a deified individual to divorce him or herself from the body of Christ.

[3DOP]

On the contrary, I think that participation with God creatively is the most perfect union one can have. Would you consider participation with God in the creation of other humans through procreation to be an anti-climactic activity?

I may be wrong, but I think he means that it would be impossible for a deified individual to divorce him or herself from the body of Christ.

Hi Tsuzuki,

On the contrary, I think that participation with God in what is uncreated is the most perfect union one can have. In this respect, I would think of any and all activity as rather mundane.

Here's the thing...we are told that neither eye hath seen nor ear hat heard what God has prepared for those who love Him. I tend to think that if it is an imaginable activity, it is less than what the reality will be. That's my premise. Making things, even if they are souls or galaxies are imaginable. That is part of the foundation for my lack of enthusiasm about participation in mere creation. But mine is just one fool's opinion. I don't insist that everyone or that anyone agree. I think the Church gives us all kinds of latitude in this area.