Repressed Church History?

[moriancamur]

CFR [Call for reference]

Read "in sacred lonliness" written by a acclaimed mormon historian. Then get back to me. Loads of references in that book.

[Dale]

As far as I know Todd Comptom does not believe Fanny Alger and Joseph had an adulterous affair. He believes instead that she was Joseph Smith's plural wife. I was not impressed with his citations that argue it was polygamy. The one's at the time who accused Joseph Smith of adultury were most disgruntled from him. But I believe that Joseph Smith had an affair.

One of his citations from Mosiah reports that Levi Hancock arranges the marriage for Joseph Smith. I don't find Mosiah Hancock or his father a reliable source. Some of the witnesses for this being polygamy look like second hand, or thirdhand witnesses of what happened.

I have my copy of In Sacred Lonliness marked up.

[LifeOnaPlate]

Read "in sacred lonliness" written by a acclaimed mormon historian. Then get back to me. Loads of references in that book.

I've read it, and haven't seen proof of what you accuse. Care to point out any specifics? Thanks!

[Thinking]

Thinking, how old are you?

44. Why?

[Thinking]

Indeed I may be. And if we take your collection of context-free snippets as examples of "attacking the person," why is it the case that nothing comparable can be found in such venues as the FARMS Review?

What does FARMS have to do with the "context-free snippets" which I provided?

[Dale]

I am open to the possibility of a marriage with Fanny Alger as being a small possibility. But I am yet to see one reputed witness of the ceremony come forward in any citation. Some like Benjamin Johnson did portray it as a marriage based on the rumor mill of the times. Certainly portraying her as a wife was easier than confessing Joseph just had an affair. But he had no conversation with Joseph Smith, or Fanny Alger on what happened. One of the witnesses only proofs it was a marriage was Joseph Smith and Fanny were found alone together. None of this seem's like solid evidence of a marriage to me, but speculation.

With Levi Hancock and his son Mosiah I have a reason why I doubt the claim. The document is online at the Book of Abraham Project. Mosiah also claim's Levi Hancock warned Mosiah not to follow Joseph Smith 3rd. The reason why was that Joseph Smith had prophecied his son would become a false prophet, and shouldn't be followed. If Levi, or his son Mosiah made up a mythical statement attributing it to Joseph Smith it hurts their credibility as witnesses in the Fanny Alger episode.

Ann Eliza Webb was I heard about two years old when the even occured, or born after the event. That would disqualify her from being a major witness. Her Father Chauncey may have repeated slander about Fanny Alger being pregnant. Him repeated something that may, or may not have happened hardly makes him a trustworthy witness.

With history I don't believe telling bad history, and someone refusing to tell the same version of events is repressing history. I am cautious about fully accepting all the sources Todd Comptom uses in his book.

[Pahoran]

Like its clear Joseph commited adultery then married Fanny Alger, that clear, or a different clear, like he was a prophet of God so anything that doesn't fit with total honesty must either not be true or he was commanded to be an exception kind of clear? Which is your kind of clear?

Neither of the above. That is a classic example of the fallacy of the false dilemma.

It is not even remotely clear that Joseph committed adultery. Nor does his status as a prophet make him perfect and incapable of sinning. That is a claim that no Latter-day Saint has ever, to my knowledge, made.

Feel free to try again.

Regards,

Pahoran

[Jan]

One of his citations from Mosiah reports that Levi Hancock arranges the marriage for Joseph Smith. I don't find Mosiah Hancock or his father a reliable source. Some of the witnesses for this being polygamy look like second hand, or thirdhand witnesses of what happened.

On what basis do you find them not to be reliable?

[LifeOnaPlate]

On what basis do you find them not to be reliable?

Sympathetic or exhonnerating reports obviously must be fabrications by their very nature; I mean, come on, they are defending Joe Smith!

[Dale]

Jan on what basis do you trust Mosiah or his father Levi? It's kind of convenient after Joseph Smith 3rd became president of the Community of Christ that Mosiah reports a a reputed prophecy of Joseph Smith in regards to his son. This is I think a thirdhand account of what Joseph Smith said from Mosiah who claimed Levy told him it. If Mosiah didn't hear his Father say any such thing then Joseph Smith never said it and Mosiah made it up. I see great reason's to be cautious about person's that report historical events they themselves arn't a reliable first-hand witness of.