Olavarria Posted November 4, 2009 Posted November 4, 2009 Who went?What did he speak about? I know it was about BoM and Meso, but what exactly?
Anijen Posted November 4, 2009 Posted November 4, 2009 I am curious, too.Mark uses the Book of Mormon very skillfully and shows parallels, convergences interesting little facts that only a Mayan and Book of Mormon scholar would know. He ties them together very well. His goal is to bring peoples interest in the book of Mormon up, and strengthen their testimonies. He sells no books, DVDs or anything his whole agenda is a spiritual goal to increase the love for the Book of Mormon. Some of his points have been discussed here by other experts ie divine kingship, etc. He uses many (many is understated) verses from the BoM to connect the dots where the finished picture is a greater love for the BoM regardless if you are a HGT or LGT guy/gal. He finishes not with any Mayan archeological proof but with Moroni 10:4-5.Mark, I apologize if I said too much of your presentation.
Anijen Posted November 4, 2009 Posted November 4, 2009 Oh BTW I did not go. I know a little from a guy who went and a lot from Mark himself, I am trying to convince my Stake President to have him do a fireside here in Iowa.
Hashbaz Posted November 4, 2009 Posted November 4, 2009 Who went?What did he speak about? I know it was about BoM and Meso, but what exactly?I basically recycled my Olivewood lecture from last year. I found some pretty good notes here on the board that someone took at the Olivewood lecture (the formatting is weird in some spots, don't know why):Finding Mesoamerica in The Book of MormonDoctrines of Salvation 3:73-74â??Lehi landed in Central AmericaJoseph Smith believed it happened in Central AmericaJohn Clarks similarities between Mesoamerica and BOM cultureshttp://maxwellinstit...p;type=amJtcw==Change of Introduction to BOM- â??Among the ancestorsâ?, matches what was said over 80 years ago by Sjodahl in Improvement Era Dec. 1921 154-5Would we expect to find Nephites among large groups of people?From the Olmec 1500 BC to Aztec 1500 AD, there was a continuation of beliefMaterials that are mentioned in the BOM that would be found in archaeological digs-Metal records-Arts of war-Cities of cement-Royal monuments-Complex calendarsONLY in Mesoamerica:Hel. 3:15 â??But behold, there are many books and many arecords of every kindâ?Codex found in Mesoamerica (something that could be burned)Alma 14:8 â??and they also brought forth their records which contained the holy scriptures, and cast them into the fire also, that they might be bburned and destroyed by fire.â? And possibly Alma 12:1 â??unfold the scripturesâ?. Codex are foldedMetal records found in both the Old World and the New world. Much less gold in the New world after the Spaniards. They took everything made of gold and melted it down and shipped back to Spain. But have found a few writings on gold.Also wrote on Jade, bone, and vessels. Would match BOMs claim that there were records of every kind.Wrote on stone and was called Stela. Stela in Mayan is Lakam tun,meaning large stone. Omni 1:20 reads â??And it came to pass in the days of Mosiah, there was a large astone brought unto him with engravings on it; and he did binterpret the engravings by the gift and power of God.â?Calendrics:It came to pass in Mayan.Utiy= â??since it came to passâ?I-ut= â??then it came to passâ?Utom= â??it shall come to passâ?On one stone there were 96 glyphs, many were the â??it came to passâ? glyph. Mark Twain said if we were to take out all the â??and it came to passâ? out of the Bom, weâ??d only be left with a pamphlet. True in both Mesoamerica and the BOM260 day calendar-tcolkâ??in is 9moons, or monthsOmni 1:21 reads â??And Coriantumr was discovered by the people of Zarahemla; and he dwelt with them for the space of nine moons.â?7 day week mentioned in Mosiah 13:18. There is a seven day week in Mesoamerica. Mentioned in Glyph Y and ZBOM had many calendars. One starting at the time Lehi left Jerusalem, one since the begin of the reign of the judges, one since the time Christ came.Kâ??atun=20 years. When theyâ??d hit this mark, theyâ??d erect a stoneBaktun=400 years (20 cycles of Kâ??atun) theyâ??d have a big partyAlma 45:10, Hel. 13:5, 9, Mormon 8:6, and Moroni 10:1 all are in line with these datesArts of war:Swords. Alma 43:18=cimeter. That means curved sword. Shows ancient Mayan carving of warrior with curved swordAlma 43:19 â??Moroni, had aprepared his people with bbreastplates and with arm-shields, yea, and also shields to defend their heads, and also they were dressed with thick clothingâ??â??Shows ancient drawing of warrior holding sword and shield, wearing armor, helmet, and thick clothing.Legs were usually left uncovered in Mesoamerica. In BOM, it mentions serious wounds to the legs.Alma 43:20-21-â??Now the army of Zerahemnah was not prepared with any such thing; they had only their aswords and their cimeters, their bows and their arrows, their bstones and their slings; and they were cnaked, save it were a skin which was girded about their loins; yea, all were naked, save it were the Zoramites and the Amalekites;â?Shows ancient drawing of Mayan with swords, cimeters and armor, slaying enemies in loincloths.Alma 49:4 â??not cast their stones and their arrows at them that they might take effect,â?How do you cast an arrow? The Mayan had a weapon called the Atlatl, which would cast arrows. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlatlhttp://www.youtube.c...h?v=RX52cl-f6ZUAlma 49:6 â??they had also prepared themselves with garments of skins, yea, very thick garments to cover their nakednessâ?Shows ancient drawing of Mayan warrior dressed in animal skins for protectionAlma 14:22, bound with cords. Shows ancient drawing of prisoners being bound with cordsMosiah 12:5, burden on ones back.They used what is called a Tumpline to place burdens on ones back. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tump_lineAlma 53:4 â??And he caused that they should build a abreastwork of timbers upon the inner bank of the ditch; and they cast up dirt out of the ditch against the breastwork of timbers; and thus they did cause the Lamanites to labor until they had encircled the city of Bountiful round about with a strong wall of timbers and earth, to an exceeding height.â?Shows picture of ancient Mayan city with similar fortifications. They know that there were timbers surrounding city because they found carbon remains of the posts.Mormon 1:7 â??The whole face of the land had become covered with buildings, and the people were as numerous almost, as it were the sand of the sea.â?El Mirador was the size of Manhatten.3 Nephi 6:8 â??And there were many ahighways cast up, and many roads made, which led from city to city, and from land to land, and from place to place.â?Mayans had roads called â??Sacbeâ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SacbeCities of cement, Hel. 3:7-9. Teotihuacan dates to 1st century and was entirely composed of cement. This city was 8 square miles big.The â??ha glyph means by the water.In Alma 51:26, the city of Nephihah is by the waterTemples. Alma 15:7. There is a temple glyph. Temples always had alters near them for sacrifice and burnt offerings.San Bartolo murals. In the Temple of Las Pinturas which dates to around 100 BC there are murals which were to guide on inside the Temple. There was the mural which depicted the creation, the mural which was the theme of sacrifice, and then ends with the person being anointed king.Temple burning was symbolic destruction. (Shows Aztec manuscript depicting â??destructionâ??) Roof was held up by wood pole. When it was burned, the roof came down and signified the buildings desctruction3 Nephit 9:10-11 chiasmus of burned with fire, destruction, destruction, burned with fire. The exact same chiasmus is found in the Dos Pilas Hieroglyphic stairway.Fine woodwork at palaces. In Tikal, wooden lintel of ruler on throne with buckler, surrounded by serpent. Very detailed. Would be considered Fine woodworkEther 9:5 â??and they obtained the head of his father-in-law, as he sat upon his throne, giving audience to his people.â?The â??Seatâ? in Mayan, means that you are kingHel. 9:31 â??But behold, ye shall examine him, and ye shall find blood upon the skirts of his cloak.â?Shows ancient picture of Mayan wearing long cloak. Would be hard not to get blood on.Divine Kings were intermediateries between natural and supernatural realms.-would talk with gods and travel back and forth through space and time-Mosiah 3:2 taught by an angel (which would be considered to be a god by Mesoamerican standards) 1 Nephi 11-14 travel through space and timeAlma 34:11 â??Now there is not any man that can sacrifice his own blood which will atone for the sins of another.â?Kings would cut themselves and bleed onto a paper which theyâ??d burn. The smoke would rise to the heavens and appease the gods.Mosiah 4:2 â??And they had aviewed themselves in their own bcarnal state, even cless than the dust of the earth. And they all cried aloud with one voice, saying: O have mercy, and apply the datoning blood of Christ that we may receive forgiveness of our sins, and our hearts may be epurified; for we believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who fcreated heaven and earth, and all things; who shall come down among the children of men.â?Doesnâ??t say who they were crying to. In Mesoamerica, it was tradition to cry unto the King, who would then cry unto the gods. He then reminds the people that he is only a man.Alma 34:10 â??For it is expedient that there should be a great and last asacrifice; yea, not a bsacrifice of man, neither of beast, neither of any manner of fowl; for it shall not be a human sacrifice; but it must be an cinfinite and deternal esacrifice.â?In Mesoamerica, the three most common sacrifices were man, beasts, and fowl.Mayan cities all had their own 3 gods. Nephites wouldnâ??t have stuck out because they also had 3 Gods.2 Nephi 2:8-9. Both the Mayan and the Nephites had traditions of a dying and resurrecting God.Falling to the Earth as if dead. Alma 36, Alma 18:42-19:13. On deathbed, shamans soul leaves his body as if dead, goes to the heavens and gets healed and comes back to earth to teach others.Diety impersonation. Glyphic expression is image of â?? â?? God, or the image of that god in your countenance (Alma 5:14). The Divine Kings wore literally engraven images of their gods on their facesBEST way to know the BOM is true is in Moroni 10:3-5Q/AMayans rulers boast of captives. BOM mentions exact #â??s of captivesOnly
Anijen Posted November 4, 2009 Posted November 4, 2009 Mark Thank you for the info it is great as always... What was the (number im guessing) _____of 1% of the Mesoamerican cities have been excavated?
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