Missionaries Now To Live With Members!

[Pahoran]

If you say so Pahoran.

Actually you said so.

What a shame, two years of extreme personal sacrifice and I didn't earn your approval.

My approval isn't so important. But extreme personal sacrifice? Granted, it's not usually the lap of luxury, but extreme? What, did you have to leave your Gameboy at home?

Guess it was a wasted venture then. Haven't seen you in a while. Maybe you are just getting back from the border with the other militiamen shooting at poor Latinamerican immigrants as they try to find a better life?

Yup, that's me. I flew all the way from New Zealand to defend America's borders against Spanish-speaking immigrants. There's nothing more important to me.

Where did you serve Pahoran? Didn't serve a mission? whaaaa?

Yes, in Melbourne, Australia. Sorry to disappoint.

With that winning personality of yours?

Well, my "winning personality" and I didn't think it an "extreme personal sacrifice" to not watch TV.

If your going to follow Christ, try picking up at least one quality of the leader you profess to believe in. Just one, is that too much to ask?

Okay.

Now excuse me while I go and make a whip of small cords.

Regards,

Pahoran

[Tchild2]

Well, my "winning personality" and I didn't think it an "extreme personal sacrifice" to not watch TV.

Okay.

Regards,

Pahoran

Pahoran, you sacrificed T.V. but not your self righteous piousness and judgementalism? Well good for you. I can see you have your priorities in order. That is Mormonism for some members you know, all superficialities and no substance.

[mnn727]

Cheaper than Walmart? ok...

Much cheaper, I don;t pay more than $2.09 for hamburger, $1.00 for a jar of peanut butter - yes I do look for sales and stock up where I can, but $5.00 for hamburger??? what are you buying ground sirloin??

[Pahoran]

Pahoran, you sacrificed T.V. but not your self righteous piousness and judgementalism?

It's a funny thing, Tkid; some people are judgemental of those they think are sinning, while others are judgemental of those who are too religious for their taste. For example, you wrote:

Well good for you. I can see you have your priorities in order. That is Mormonism for some members you know, all superficialities and no substance.

Pretty darn judgemental, isn't it?

Regards,

Pahoran

[Tchild2]

It's a funny thing, Tkid; some people are judgemental of those they think are sinning, while others are judgemental of those who are too religious for their taste. For example, you wrote:

Pretty darn judgemental, isn't it?

Regards,

Pahoran

Right - I watched a few minutes of T.V. and I am now "sinning" and a "muck off missionary"? It is almost like you have shot all the little rack rabbits running around your home and now are bored and looking to argue with anyone over the most inane topics. Aren't there some small animals running around your place that need to be exterminated? It would keep you busy, and probably put a smile on your face.

[nana]

It's a funny thing, Tkid; some people are judgemental of those they think are sinning, while others are judgemental of those who are too religious for their taste. For example, you wrote:

Pretty darn judgemental, isn't it?

Regards,

Pahoran

I like your statement at the end of your posts, Pahoran, too bad you can't seem to follow it. And no I am not here tearing down your house, (before you speak) I am here to learn and discuss.

[spinner]

I am curious for those who have heard / read the announcement: is this a new mandatory requirement or is it something phrased more along the lines of it should be done where feasible? Also, is it being introduced as a trial balloon or is it being put into play wholesale?

Thinking in economic terms (I took a lot of courses in the dismal science at BYU), my first thought is that this is a reallocation of wealth from areas with low LDS population to those with higher populations. Here's why: Assuming that it is being done, at least in part, to save on missionaries' expenses, then the clear implication is that missionaries will be living with members on the cheap; i.e., members will be receiving less than market rates for the rented space. In areas that send out more missionaries than they receive (i.e., the Mormon corridor), this will create a net savings for missionaries' families. On the other hand, in areas where more missionaries are assigned than sent out, members will be putting up space for less than they could otherwise receive. The overall effect, in purely economic terms, is a net savings for areas with high LDS populations but a net loss for areas of low member concentration.

[gatorboy]

In areas that send out more missionaries than they receive (i.e., the Mormon corridor), this will create a net savings for missionaries' families.

Nope - there won't be a change in the $$ per month for missionaries IMO.

On the other hand, in areas where more missionaries are assigned than sent out, members will be putting up space for less than they could otherwise receive.

Possible, although many of the families hosting missionaries may not rent out their space otherwise, so it's hard to tell.

If this were up for a vote, I'd vote to keep the missionaries separate from members, or have the missionaries live with non-member landlords only. Seems to me that there is too much downside to missionaries living with members than the alternative.

You know, every member a mission-PRESIDENT.

I was fortunate enough to never have had the pleasure of living with members on my mission even though we had about 1/3 of the areas w/members.

[spinner]

Nope - there won't be a change in the $$ per month for missionaries IMO.

My point was a little more subtle than simple per-month fees per missionary. It may be that this program keeps the the cost of missions steady for a few years longer than otherwise possible. If this delayed inflation happens because a large proportion of members in areas with low member concentration are renting on the cheap, this still constitutes the members outside of the corridor subsidizing these missions.

Possible, although many of the families hosting missionaries may not rent out their space otherwise, so it's hard to tell.

Again, possible, but I didn't intend costs to be interpreted in strict in dollar terms. These may be people who would never have considered renting out their place otherwise but may now do it out of a sense of duty. I would guess, in fact, that most retirees, if they have an adequate income otherwise, would want nothing less than a couple of 20 year olds living in their basement. Not a strict dollar expense, but still a 'cost'.

If this were up for a vote, I'd vote to keep the missionaries separate from members, or have the missionaries live with non-member landlords only. Seems to me that there is too much downside to missionaries living with members than the alternative.

You know, every member a mission-PRESIDENT.

I was fortunate enough to never have had the pleasure of living with members on my mission even though we had about 1/3 of the areas w/members.

Agreed. I am really surprised at this program.

[gatorboy]

Agreed. I am really surprised at this program.

I suspect that this is one mission's policy with a new Mission President mixing things up after too many Elders were partying it up... Truth is sad at times

The mission is the best kept secret in the church.

[auteur55]

Here is another link to a site talking about the change. Here they confirm it is a nationwide change as well.

http://theworldaccordingtomarc.blogspot.com/

You half to scroll down just a bit to where the paragraph starts "we had the missionaries over for dinner..."

[Lachoneus]

. . . members will be receiving less than market rates for the rented space.

Members will not be paid rent. They will be paid only for the extra utility expenses, including a separate phone line for the missionaries.

[Pahoran]

I like your statement at the end of your posts, Pahoran, too bad you can't seem to follow it. And no I am not here tearing down your house, (before you speak) I am here to learn and discuss.

Then I suggest you try to restrain your knee-jerk impulse to slip in irrelevant cheap shots at every opportunity, and ask actual questions seeking actual information instead. Just once in a while.

Missionary housing has nothing whatsoever to do with any mall anywhere. Trying to conflate the two was a cheap shot. Got it?

Regards,

Pahoran

[gatorboy]

Here is another link to a site talking about the change. Here they confirm it is a nationwide change as well.

Interesting - must be the "big news" our bishop wouldn't talk about that got him all juiced up... hmm....

[spinner]

Members will not be paid rent. They will be paid only for the extra utility expenses, including a separate phone line for the missionaries.

Wow.

Does anybody have details on how they're signing members up for this? Is it a calling? Is it on a volunteer only basis? Or is it somewhere in between?

Also, I wonder if the responsibility of providing missionary apartments could keep some seniors from doing missions of their own?

[spinner]

OK, sorry for the two consecutive posts, but I cannot help but think of all sorts of potential difficulties for this new arrangement:

1) I wonder to what degree the missionaries will be answerable to the homeowners? For instance, if the homeowner requires them to keep their apartment cleaner than the missionaries otherwise would in a rented place, will the missionaries be forced to do so?

2) What exactly will be the nature of the agreement to house the missionaries? Will it be a "sign on the dotted line" agreement, or more of an honor system / calling type thing? If the member gets absolutely fed up with the behavior of non-rent paying missionaries, is there a chance that the missionaries will return home one day to find their luggage on the curb?

3) What will the status of the house be when the members are on vacation? In such a situation, I can just picture a number of "When the cat's away..." scenarios.

If I were still a missionary, I think I would not be too happy about this program. Missionary work is stressful, but at the end of the day, we had an apartment, small and squalid though it may have been, and it was ours. We could relax and be 20 year-olds for a little while before starting all over the next day.

[beamer]

I'm not too aware of homeowners insurance regulations either, but I wonder what the process is and the coverage entails for something like this. I guess it would affect the policy and its coverage.

[auteur55]

Does anybody have details on how they're signing members up for this? Is it a calling? Is it on a volunteer only basis? Or is it somewhere in between

Well the handout says its part of our member missionary responsibilities. It also says that great blessings are in store for those that invite the missionaries in.

[mocnarf]

Pahoran, why are you seemingly so mean and spitefull when some disagrees with you?

Some people just have a way about them, that makes everyone around them feel that somehow they have desended into hell.

[mocnarf]

Members will not be paid rent. They will be paid only for the extra utility expenses, including a separate phone line for the missionaries.

Can a member consider the rent value of the missionary space as part of their tithing donation and reduce their cash tithe by the rental value?

[gatorboy]

Can a member consider the rent value of the missionary space as part of their tithing donation and reduce their cash tithe by the rental value?

Might be a great question for the Gifts in Kind Department... Hmm...

I've always pondered the moral relativism of deducting my dish network from my tithing because I can receive general conference...

[Deborah]

Can a member consider the rent value of the missionary space as part of their tithing donation and reduce their cash tithe by the rental value?

I would think they could apply it as a deduction on their taxes as some charitable contribution.

[kantgomo]

This news of missionaries to live with members is really not new. They have been working toward this end for at least a year now.

[cdowis]

I've always pondered the moral relativism of deducting my dish network from my tithing because I can receive general conference...

I guess you could deduct the cost of refreshments for pot luck dinner from your fast offering as well.

[cdowis]

I'm not too aware of homeowners insurance regulations either, but I wonder what the process is and the coverage entails for something like this. I guess it would affect the policy and its coverage.

I would assume they are simply guests (since they are not paying rent) and are covered as such.