Retention - Why Do So Many Latter-day Saints Go Inactive,

[blueadept]

I have mixed feelings on this particular issue of retention. From my personal experience I believe it's more appropriate to lengthen the missionary process so that all aspects of the faith can be analyzed and the good and bad parts discussed before someone gets baptized. This will definitely help in keeping the retention numbers up down the road.

Having a follow-up program for new members would be a good thing too. In my church, each candidate is given a sponsor for the last two months to assist or help explain to the candidate about all the practices, beliefs, etc a candidate may have. If LDS did this for their new converts, I think it would help with their new members.

My wife is a convert and was one of those "golden contract" types. I'm not necessarily impressed with her conversion story. On the other hand, Mother Teresa went around picking up the sick and dying (mostly Hindus I believe) and helped them anyway she could. Of course they were all given a "free ticket" (baptism) while she fed and bathed them. So who am I to complain how someone is baptised.

Peace

[Inquisitor]

This board of course is not a norm, but I'd be interested in hearing a few stories (keeping with board rules) about why such people fell away from the Church, what might have retained them in activity, what might bring them back, and suggestions as to what the Church might do better to retain its members in full activity longer.

I'll give you my answer, since I was inactive for about 17 years before becoming a complete non-believer.

Why did I fall away from the church?

Well, partly because of the pressure to live perfectly. Too much of my personal life was exposed to sanction and judgement by people who barely knew me. I was not at all comfortable with that. I believed with all my heart that my relationship with God was my own personal one and the church seemed to want to be in the middle of it. That, and I could not agree with many of the church's teachings. I did not believe that polygamy would be sanctioned in heaven. Nor did I believe that any current prophets spoke to God. I also did not like the services. I found them stale, boring, and completely spiritually uneducational as an adult. I used to attend the New Members classes because I despised Relief Society. I never left a service feeling spiritually uplifted.

What might have retained me?

There were actually things that would have brought me back:

1. Home teaching and visiting teaching would be strictly by request of the member - not required. People should be able to choose who visits their home and when.

2. Allow members to choose their own time to attend meetings. Do not assign them to a ward, where they must stay. Have different services at different times and allow people to attend, as their schedules permit. Furthermore, allow them to decide which classes they want to attend. Offer a variety - maybe some BofM discussions, New Testament discussions, Life lessons, etc.

3. More community/charity involvement - not just involving church members, but also people outside of the church. People get a lot of spiritual food from these kinds of activities, which are often lacking in the LDS church.

4. Allow tithing to be voluntary. Do not attach it to eternal salvation.

5. Essentially, treat the adult members as adults instead of dictating every aspect of their lives. I would have gone much more often if I could have just shown up, attended the classes and/or meetings that I wanted to and been able to leave without being tracked, interrogated, and otherwise harassed. Other churches allow this.

Those are a few things that would have made a big difference to me.

What might the church do to retain more members?

See above.

Look, the biggest problem in any church is keeping their members engaged. If your church is not relavent to your every day life, then you don't have much reason to keep going back. I think that most people believe that their eternal salvation is between them and God. They don't need any church to get them to heaven. Churches are for fellowshipping. A place where people who share like beliefs can get together and keep each other strong. A place of inspiration. If the church wants to keep people active, them engage them. Have carnivals and festivals. Being spiritual doesn't mean you can't laugh and have fun. Inspire them. Try focusing the Sacrement meetings more on inspirational issues from inspirational people instead of having all members get up and try to deliver hack talks.

If the church wants to retain people and draw more people in, they are going to have to re-examine their services at the very least. They will have to be willing to break with tradition and move out of their comfort zone. They will have to unclench their fists that hold the members on short leashes. The tighter control that the church tries to exert, the more people pull away.

Nothing at the end of the day will bring me back at this point, but I think if the church were truly willing to change, they could retain more members.

[Paul Ray]

...I'd be interested in hearing a few stories (keeping with board rules) about why such people fell away from the Church, what might have retained them in activity, what might bring them back, and suggestions as to what the Church might do better to retain its members in full activity longer.

Please be sure to address every one of those points when you tell your personal falling away story, and don't tell someone else's story. This is intended to be a positive constructive sincerely sharing thread, and not a bash, thanks.

I was one of those who fell away very soon after becoming a member of the Church. I had gained a strong testimony and had gone to the temple before falling away after 2 years.

why such people fell away from the Church:

I joined the Church when I was 28 and still single, and I had no real support from my family, and at age 29 I found out about the Young Single Adult ward, where I stayed until after turning 30. At that point I felt uncomfortable about remaining in that ward, and I didn't want to just get married, and it was hard to remain in a normal family ward while still being single in the Church.

Or in other words, in a nutshell, a lack of emotional support played a role.

And then there was the fact that my roommate moved out without giving me much or any notice, and it was hard to pay tithing on the income I received because I wasn't making much money at that time.

Or in other words, in a nutshell, a lack of finances played a role.

And then there was the fact that I was very independent, and didn't like asking for help. I knew at that time I could go to my bishop, but I didn't like asking for charity.

Or in other words, in a nutshell, a great deal of pride played a role.

what might have retained them me in activity:

More emotional support and/or a little more money and/or a little less pride would have helped me.

And I've learned by experience that I'd rather ask for help than go into inactivity again.

what might bring them brought me back:

I had turned age 40 and I was not very satisfied with the direction I was going in life. And I knew, because I was taught, things could really be better if I did what I needed to do.

suggestions as to what the Church might do better to retain its members in full activity longer.

We need to have LOVE, and a LOT more of it, while knowing we're all brothers and sisters.

We're not just a number. We are actually people. And we all should have love for each other.

That's first and foremost, in my opinion. If we can just do that, and be totally sincere, I think the whole world will come running.

[consiglieri]

Retention - why do so many Latter-day Saints go inactive,

and what can be done about it?

While recently serving a senior LDS mission in a foreign country, I saw as many as twelve adults baptized at a single service. Each of them bore a glowing testimony at the time. But I wonder how many of those twelve will be active members and faithful temple attenders ten years from now?

As a faithful Latter-day Saint diligently working on the "enduring" part, I acknowledge that there is a major problem with retention of members in the LDS Church.

The majority of members who go inactive (meaning no longer regularly attending sacrament meetings and/or no longer keeping the commandments and their baptismal covenants) are probably among those people who were perhaps baptized too soon by over-eager missionaries. A good seed was planted in their hearts and minds but for a variety of reasons they never really learn the fulness of the Gospel, or just can't stay away from former commandment breaking habits.

But, even more sadly from my point of view, there are some who stay in the Church a full year or more and take upon themselves sacred temple covenants, then fall away. Perhaps there are some participating on this board who are in that category.

This board of course is not a norm, but I'd be interested in hearing a few stories (keeping with board rules) about why such people fell away from the Church, what might have retained them in activity, what might bring them back, and suggestions as to what the Church might do better to retain its members in full activity longer.

Please be sure to address every one of those points when you tell your personal falling away story, and don't tell someone else's story. This is intended to be a positive constructive sincerely sharing thread, and not a bash, thanks.

The Cumorah Project has worldwide membership and retention statistics to research this subject.

http://www.cumorah.com/cgi-bin/db.cgi?Coun...ds=View+Records

Retention

While LDS activity rates in the United States are among the highest of any country in the world, less than half of members on the rolls are active. The Encyclopedia of Mormonism reports: 'Canada, the South Pacific, and the United States average between 40 percent and 50 percent [attendance at sacrament meeting].' (Source: Encyclopedia of Mormonism, edited by Daniel H. Ludlow, 1992, 4:1527.)

Marginal retention of new converts, and especially potential priesthood holders, remains a serious challenge:

'For the U.S. as a whole, only 59% of baptized males ever receive the Melchizedek Priesthood. In the South Pacific, the figure drops to 35%; in Great Britain, 29%. In Mexico (with almost 850,000 members) the figure is 19%; and in Japan, only 17% of the male members ever make it past the Aaronic Priesthood.' (source: Lowell C. Bennion and Lawrence Young, Dialogue, Spring 1996, p.19.)

Why do people go inactive? A variety of reasons, I suspect. One that doesn't get a lot of play, though, is that church is boring. Has anybody mentioned yet how boring church is as a cause of inactivity? I know people who won't go to church because it is so boring. And the only thing that makes it better is, not only is church boring, it comes in a three-hour block!

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

P.S. Did I mention how boring church is?

[Paul Ray]

Why do people go inactive? A variety of reasons, I suspect. One that doesn't get a lot of play, though, is that church is boring. Has anybody mentioned yet how boring church is as a cause of inactivity? I know people who won't go to church because it is so boring. And the only thing that makes it better is, not only is church boring, it comes in a three-hour block!

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

P.S. Did I mention how boring church is?

Not that I'm trying to argue, but I would like to share my opinion.

I have never found the Church boring... I like hearing from people.

The more I hear from other people the better I know them and think many, many people are interesting.

[emeliza]

I think a huge reason has to be the emotional support. The latest Ensign spoke of how for a new member it isn't just a change in your church, it is a change to your entire life. I have to whole heartedly agree. I also have found that people are terrific and supportive on Sunday's, but otherwise...not so much. I am lucky enough to have a calling that puts me in more activities and have the type of personality to have no problem calling people to get these activities going, but I have yet to find anyone who just wants to hang out. I am single in a family ward which might be part of the problem. But the few singles tend to only want to do thing when it is a singles activity. So for a night of ordering a pizza and renting a movie, I turn to my non-member friends. For babysitting my kids so I can participate in the Church activities (such as doing my VT), I turn to non-member friends (which is getting a bit harder to do). I do call members when I have questions about Church, but honestly very few people within the Church want to hang out (if any). Also now that the newness of my membership has worn off, you don't see the missionaries and families don't invite you over for dinner or FHE (I have a tiny place otherwise I would be inviting families over to my place, but my dinner table only seats four and there are three in my little family). Sometimes people will talk about hanging out or getting together, but no one actually wants to make any real plans. So on Sunday's I tend to find the investigators to sit with and hang out with.

I have used a sports anaology for my conversion before and I will use it again.

Converting for me.

It is funny. All your life you have really enjoyed basketball. All your friends enjoyed basketball. You liked talking about the different teams and the stats and players. You enjoyed going to the games together.

Then one day you discover hockey. You realize after awhile that you like hockey way more than you like basketball. You become a huge fan of hockey. The only problem is that your friend's don't know anything about hockey and really don't care about hockey. Most of them are bias because it isn't basketball and they just can't quite relate to you the same anymore, although they are still your friends. So you figure you will become friends with other hockey fans. Only problem there is that they already have hockey fans for friends. You are a newcomer and they really aren't that interested. You figure eventually I will make friends with the hockey fans, but in the mean time, you just keep enjoying hockey and watch the games from the nosebleed section. But the games are so much more fun when you can be included with the other fans as part of the cheering section.

[Paul Ray]

I have used a sports anaology for my conversion before and I will use it again.

Converting for me.

It is funny. All your life you have really enjoyed basketball. All your friends enjoyed basketball. You liked talking about the different teams and the stats and players. You enjoyed going to the games together.

Then one day you discover hockey. You realize after awhile that you like hockey way more than you like basketball. You become a huge fan of hockey. The only problem is that your friend's don't know anything about hockey and really don't care about hockey. Most of them are bias because it isn't basketball and they just can't quite relate to you the same anymore, although they are still your friends. So you figure you will become friends with other hockey fans. Only problem there is that they already have hockey fans for friends. You are a newcomer and they really aren't that interested. You figure eventually I will make friends with the hockey fans, but in the mean time, you just keep enjoying hockey and watch the games from the nosebleed section. But the games are so much more fun when you can be included with the other fans as part of the cheering section.

Wow, I love that, maybe because I can relate to it.

I wish I had more "substance" to add at this point, but I just wanted to let you know that I liked that.

Oh, okay, here's a thought, which will hopefully you to stay active.

I met my wife at a Singles Conference, and I wasn't trying to get married.

I just became part of her cheering section, and she became part of mine.

And we're trying to reach out to our "neighbors".

[PosterMania]

Somewhere in this thread everyone talked about whether there should be "time" requirements before baptism for converts in order to more solidify them spiritually.

There were those pro and con, some saying it depends and if someone is ready in less than a week, then they should.

I found the following in a letter entitled "Statement on Missionary Work from the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles" which is also dated December 11, 2002

IV. BAPTIZING WORTHY CONVERTS:

A. Preparing Investigators for Baptism:

-"Investigators should live the principles of moral worthiness, the Word of Wisdom, and commit to pay tithing."

-Must attend "several sacrament meetings" before baptism.

-can be confirmed in any sacrament meeting soon after they are baptized.

Apparently with these recommendations we are looking at at least 3 or more weeks.

[Moksha]

What can be done to help retain members?

This is a simple but effective proposal: In addition to the Sunday Gospel Essentials and Gospel Doctrine Classes, offer a third discussion group entitled Wounded Mormons. This would be a non-scripted group that would tackle the issues and concerns members are struggling with.

Pros: It would help to slow the rate of those leaving, increase attendance rates and overall Church satisfaction as well.

Cons: It would involve doing something different.

What can be done to help retain members?

This is a simple but effective proposal: In addition to the Sunday Gospel Essentials and Gospel Doctrine Classes, offer a third discussion group entitled Wounded Mormons. This would be a non-scripted group that would tackle the issues and concerns members are struggling with.

Pros: It would help to slow the rate of those leaving, increase attendance rates and overall Church satisfaction as well.

Cons: It would involve doing something different.

[PosterMania]

PosterMania-I still had many LDS beliefs. I stayed out of loyalty. I still have things in common with LDS. I am a convert to the Community of Christ/RLDS so I retain my Book of Mormon belief. I had hoped maybe the LDS Church would work out for me if I could work myself into adjusting. The big thing is my folks are devout LDS, so I knew by leaving I would risk family oposition.

I did not want to get personal about my sins with my LDS Bishop. I had home teachers, and they had I felt made several unwelcome visits. I am glad they took my no contact request seriously, and stopped the visits. I had one LDS friend, but other than that no friends in the LDS church. My friendship with typical people on the internet was closer than ties to people I had at church. I got handshakes & smiles at church, but nobody I felt close to at any time I can think of, but the one friend. The only exception to persons I felt close to would be family.

I was concerned that if I accepted contact that persons would act as spies for the Bishop. The Home Teachers when I requested no contact threatened me with excommunication. So that bad experience with home teachers caused me to not be to interested in new ones being assigned to me anyway.

The last time I tried to get active I was in the early stages of coming down with Multiple Sclerosis. One of the classes was in a building outside, and it was bothering me to get around. My difficulty in getting around caused me to stay home. I did not know my MS symptoms were starting to get visible. I wasn't diagnosed until a few years later. I have a bad right leg anyway so assumed that was it.

--------------

Uncle Dale & I are two different people. We get confused as being the same person from time to time.

thanks Dale for your personal story

[emeliza]

I am very glad we don't have to be a full tithe payer and show how we can 'earn' our membership status prior to converting. I was incredibly active in my old church right up to my conversion. In the weeks before I received my answer, I still went to services at my old church. I still sometimes go to services at my old church(different times than my ward services). I continue to fulfill my pledge offerings there.

God doesn't have all the requirements to join His Church as the humans who sometimes manage it do. God continues to allow us to learn....line upon line and precept upon precept. Baby steps. It is overwhelming to go from one extreme to the next. To convert you need to be able to answer the questions in the interview. After that, you need to try and live up to the commitments you made....but you need support, not ridicule.

[consiglieri]

Why do people go inactive? A variety of reasons, I suspect. One that doesn't get a lot of play, though, is that church is boring. Has anybody mentioned yet how boring church is as a cause of inactivity? I know people who won't go to church because it is so boring. And the only thing that makes it better is, not only is church boring, it comes in a three-hour block!

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

P.S. Did I mention how boring church is?

Not that I'm trying to argue, but I would like to share my opinion.

I have never found the Church boring... I like hearing from people.

The more I hear from other people the better I know them and think many, many people are interesting.

Dear Paul Ray,

I don't think you are arguing. I am glad you have shared your opinion, and that you have never found Church boring. Is that never, as in really, never? Because I could say that I have never not found Church boring, but that would be an overstatement on my part. On average, I would say that Church is not boring to me a couple of times a year. So I couldn't say that it is never not boring.

I am glad that you like to "hear from other people." [What else would you hear from? ] I like hearing from people, too.

It's not the different people I mind hearing from. It is the fact that they appear to feel restricted in what they say to pabulum. Now, I don't mind hearing the same thing a million times. It's when we start heading for two million that the drool starts coming out of the side of my mouth.

I have often felt that, in the LDS Church, nobody is really allowed to graduate from primary.

But what would you say, Ray, to the people I know who are inactive because church is so boring? Do you think the problem rests solely with them?

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[Paul Ray]

Why do people go inactive? A variety of reasons, I suspect. One that doesn't get a lot of play, though, is that church is boring. Has anybody mentioned yet how boring church is as a cause of inactivity? I know people who won't go to church because it is so boring. And the only thing that makes it better is, not only is church boring, it comes in a three-hour block!

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

P.S. Did I mention how boring church is?

Not that I'm trying to argue, but I would like to share my opinion.

I have never found the Church boring... I like hearing from people.

The more I hear from other people the better I know them and think many, many people are interesting.

Dear Paul Ray,

I don't think you are arguing. I am glad you have shared your opinion, and that you have never found Church boring. Is that never, as in really, never? Because I could say that I have never not found Church boring, but that would be an overstatement on my part. On average, I would say that Church is not boring to me a couple of times a year. So I couldn't say that it is never not boring.

Yes, I really meant never when I actually said never, and I'm glad there are times you're not bored.

I am glad that you like to "hear from other people." [What else would you hear from? ] I like hearing from people, too.

Good. It seems we agree on that point then, and I like it when we tend to agree.

And "what else I would hear from" would be only myself. To me that would really be monotonous.

It's not the different people I mind hearing from. It is the fact that they appear to feel restricted in what they say to pabulum. Now, I don't mind hearing the same thing a million times. It's when we start heading for two million that the drool starts coming out of the side of my mouth.

I'll admit I like it better when someone shares their own thoughts instead of repeating what another person has said, but even then what they're repeating shows a little bit about them or they wouldn't have repeated those thoughts.

And btw, the way I think about it, we learn all truth from God... without violating any copyright agreements!

And there's usually enough variance in each person who says something to help me see some new thoughts from their words.

I have often felt that, in the LDS Church, nobody is really allowed to graduate from primary.

Really? Nobody? I wonder why you've felt that way often.

I know some are allowed. They went all the way through it. And I know because I've seen that myself.

But what would you say, Ray, to the people I know who are inactive because church is so boring? Do you think the problem rests solely with them?

No, not solely, but I believe they are accountable for being inactive.

I believe nobody can force anybody to do anything.

It's all about free will and our choices.

[grego]

Enjoyed your suggestion, Moksha.

Some missionaries would count half of one RS meeting as "several Church meetings".

Though I should have met investigators before their baptism, it was not uncommon for me to meet (actually, SEE) the investigator for the first time at their baptism. (And sometimes the last.)

Restraint?

It would be nice if we could, and would, do everything like we were supposed to. Unfortunately, we can't. We only have so much of everything--time, energy, abilities, people, work, etc. We can only do what we can, and leave the rest to the Lord. We can't exceed our limits. The Lord speaks about this many times: see D&C 86:6, Mosiah 4:27, Jacob 5:65, Deuteronomy 7:22, D&C 10:4. Hopefully we will learn better and more efficient ways to do what which the Lord would have us do.

Sheep into the Fold

What would you think, if many shepherds are working hard at keeping sheep in line, branding them, and sending them into the fold through the the front door; and people inside frantically trying to keep them in, but then the sheep are just running out a huge hole in the back? Or, what if after the sheep get in, they just jump right over the wall?

What should the shepherds do first? Just keep working hard at sending new sheep in (mostly the jumping kind)? Go get those sheep that are jumping out? Fix the fold?

Before putting sheep into the fold, make sure that the fold is secure. The walls must be high, tight, strong, and there can only be one open door, which is guarded. Once the fold is secure, the sheep can be hauled in to capacity.

Which sheep are most likely to kick the walls and jump over? Probably those who arenâ??t converted, or with the weaker testimonies, or the ones that suddenly wonder, "What am I doing in this fold?"

Our ward has old sheep still running wildly all over the place, and we need to keep the fold secured, but then there are all these other new strange sheep that keep being added in. We see all the holes, etc. and see that the new sheep will probably just run out or jump over really soon anyway.

(Any farmers? They can tell you the importance of mending fences.)

Making Cake

Let's say that your store has a daily limit of 50 cakes. So, how many will you cook? 51? No--just 50.

If 100 people call in to order, what do you do?

A. Tell everyone: "Ok, no problem."

B. Get more workers and equipment

C. Say: "Sorryâ??we cannot do it this time. We already have too many orders. Perhaps another time."

If you choose A, you'll be extremely tired and running all over the place. Youâ??ll also have 50 dissatisfied customers (and probably many more). Unless you know who these customers are, apologize profusely, and offer them a free cake, they will probably never buy from you again. (However, as long as you're not ready to make good on your offer, don't offer.)

If you choose C, you'll have 50 disappointed customers that day who couldn't get a cake from you, but they will still be able to order later without having had a bad experience of having bought something horrible from you the first time. (Also, it might be that only those who are really willing and make the effort will be joining, which means member quality might go up.) Also, you will have 50 (or so) satisfied customers who will also be willing to buy from you again and willing to refer you to others.

B, of course, would be the best, if you could. So, we stay at C until we can increase production by the amount of + P; then, we can cook 50 + P cakes every day.

The Olive Tree (Jacob 5)

This allegory can be likened to many things, of which the following is one.

Branches and roots must be balanced and both nurtured to have the ability to produce good fruit. Tree=ward; tree branches=new members; tree roots=old members.

If there are too many new branches, they either draw all the strength out of the roots, or they (and the tree) produce evil fruit (v.37, 48).

If there arenâ??t enough branches, the tree will not produce fruit, and the roots donâ??t serve their purpose.

We need the situation in v.18, where the addition of new members actually strengthens the old members; both are nourished; the tree produces good fruit.

The Leaning Tower of Pisa

If a structure is built on an unsure foundation, it will fall!

Playing Stacking Blocks

Start out with a good, strong, wide base. If you stack too fast, it will fall. Wait until itâ??s balanced well and stopped swinging around, then stack another block on top. Keep going. Stack quickly, but steadily.

Fighting the Lamanites (Book of Mormon)

Alma 51:16, 22. Before we take on lots more new members, current members must have stronger faith and testimonies (real strength), and we need to have unity.

Rearing Children

Some couples want many children, but stop earlier. Why? Too tired, too depressed, a need to find a better schedule & methods to make it work, & more unity on how to rear. Then, they can have some more, hopefully.

President Monsonâ??Emptying the Water (from article below)

"There is an ancient proverb which purports to correctly determine the sanity of an individual. A person is shown a stream of water flowing into a stagnant pond. He is given a bucket and asked to commence to drain the pond. If he first takes steps to effectively dam the inflow to the pond, he is adjudged sane. If, on the other hand, he ignores the inflow and tries to empty the pond bucket by bucket, he is designated as insane."

This is the prospective elder. Why keep looking for good priesthood brethren to teach and baptize when we already have 80 or so, just waiting to be helped along, and some of whom are married and whose wives are even baptized, and maybe even active? Many of these brethren were lost right after baptism--many within a month; in fact, some of them even within one week! (Get baptized on Saturday, show up the next day to get confirmed, but not ever more.)

[Moksha]

What can be done to help retain members?

This is a simple but effective proposal: In addition to the Sunday Gospel Essentials and Gospel Doctrine Classes, offer a third discussion group entitled Wounded Mormons. This would be a non-scripted group that would tackle the issues and concerns members are struggling with.

Pros: It would help to slow the rate of those leaving, increase attendance rates and overall Church satisfaction as well.

Cons: It would involve doing something different.

Thanks Greggo. Elsewhere, one participant named Acorin had this to say:

I would view the wounded members class as an opportunity to actually discuss openly some of our doctrinal differences and the consequences those differences might have for action in our daily lives.

As a marginalized/wounded Mormon, I can tell you that one reason I feel so is that church on Sunday often does not reflect my values or perspective that I have taken from my personal prayer, scripture study and life experience. I would see this class as a way to provide a more honest and valuable spiritual and social experience on Sundays.

I keyed into your thought about the shepards working hard to bring in the sheep only to have them leave or fall through the holes. Discussing these holes could help.

{Hope this is not another double post from a glitch in the Member Ltd. code}

[Paul Ray]

President Monsonâ??Emptying the Water (from article below)

"There is an ancient proverb which purports to correctly determine the sanity of an individual. A person is shown a stream of water flowing into a stagnant pond. He is given a bucket and asked to commence to drain the pond. If he first takes steps to effectively dam the inflow to the pond, he is adjudged sane. If, on the other hand, he ignores the inflow and tries to empty the pond bucket by bucket, he is designated as insane."

This is the prospective elder. Why keep looking for good priesthood brethren to teach and baptize when we already have 80 or so, just waiting to be helped along, and some of whom are married and whose wives are even baptized, and maybe even active? Many of these brethren were lost right after baptism--many within a month; in fact, some of them even within one week! (Get baptized on Saturday, show up the next day to get confirmed, but not ever more.)

I'm a little confused. What do you mean? Whoever said anything about stopping the flow in the Church?

But yes I believe we should take care of the sheep we have first... so they can also take care of the sheep.

And who knows, some sheep may even give birth to some other sheep.

Stranger things have happened, you know. A sheep who gives birth.

Have you seen some?