Controversy: Red Sea vs. Reed Sea

[WalkerW]

Sorry, perhaps I didn

[MormonMason]

The question is, did he use suf or kaneh for the whither part.

Probably neither. The Book of Mormon was written in the language of the Egyptians with the learning of the Jews.

On another matter, the Bible mentions two cities on the shore of yam suph. (See 1 Kings 9:26). The Septuagint translates "Erythrean Sea" or Red Sea. These are located by the shore of what we nowadays call Red Sea.

[David Bokovoy]

David,

I'm kind of new to the whole Documentary Hypothesis. I've understood the general concept and alluded to it in debates and discussions, but mainly as a secondary point. I remember reading that in the Elohist texts (I think) the parting of the Red Sea is not even mentioned and that the "angel of God" clogs the chariot wheels. Why do you think this text lacks the actual parting?

It's a good question, however, I honestly don't know what to make of it. The account in Exodus 14 derives primarily from the P source, even though we can reconstruct a J account of the events. Only a few verses from the narrative can be attributed to E at all.

I would not conclude that this observation indicates that the E source does not know the tradition of the Red Sea parting. The Song of the Sea in Exodus 15 is generally believed to contain some of the earliest poetry in the Bible, and to be older than both J and E. Significantly, this archaic poem features the statement, "Pharaoh

[volgadon]

Sorry, perhaps I didn

[WalkerW]

I would not conclude that this observation indicates that the E source does not know the tradition of the Red Sea parting. The Song of the Sea in Exodus 15 is generally believed to contain some of the earliest poetry in the Bible, and to be older than both J and E. Significantly, this archaic poem features the statement, "Pharaoh

[David Bokovoy]

Honestly, I fail to see where the pun is that makes the banks of the yeor a a yam suf.

The word suf appears only 28 times in the Hebrew Bible. If we exclude the two references to the suf where Moses lay in Exodus 2:3,5, out of the 26 times suf appears, only twice does the word not directly refer to the Red Sea, Isaiah 19:6 and Jonah 2:5.

This fact indicates that when the word suf appears in the text, as learned readers of the Bible, suf will immediately trigger an image of the Yam Suf or Reed Sea. Given the word

[David Bokovoy]

Hello Mortal Man,

For the record, Volgadon's answer to this question was in my estimate very good:

The word name in the OT does not refer solely to given names. Compare with Isaiah 9:6. Titles. So, yes, and his name shalled be called Messiah would work just fine.

The matter that you raised is often presented by critics of the Book of Mormon and I believe that Volgadon hit the nail on the head. In Hebrew, the Book of Mormon expression would read that his name shall be called Joshua which means "savior," and Messiah which means "Christ" or the "anointed one." Hence, the Son of God's name shall be called Savior, Messiah.

As Volgadon suggests, the phraseology really does parallel Isaiah 9:6 where we read "his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." Even the biblical name/title Elohim points to this unique sort of biblical nuance. Hence, rather than a challenge to the Book of Mormon's authenticity, the phraseology in 2 Nephi 25:19 provides a nice parallel with biblical name/title usage.

Best,

-DB

[volgadon]

The word suf appears only 28 times in the Hebrew Bible. If we exclude the two references to the suf where Moses lay in Exodus 2:3,5, out of the 26 times suf appears, only twice does the word not directly refer to the Red Sea, Isaiah 19:6 and Jonah 2:5.

This fact indicates that when the word suf appears in the text, as learned readers of the Bible, suf will immediately trigger an image of the Yam Suf or Reed Sea. Given the word