Mudcat Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 I saw another thread regarding 'Alpha and Omega' on the board and it reminded me of running across this in 3 Nephi. Apparently the phrase appears in Revelations 3 times and in the D&C another 12 times. Rev. 22: 13 13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.3 Ne. 9: 18 18 I am the alight and the life of the world. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end.I did a little net searching on the phrase this a.m. and discovered that it doesn't actually appear in the earliest biblical manuscripts and may very well have been a later addition.What I find interesting is that in 3 Nephi, we have Christ, declaring in the darkness to be the 'Alpha and Omega'. These are letters from the Greek alphabet and there are some English translations of the Bible that refer to the same title as the 'A to the Z'. So there is the appearance of Greek in the Book of Mormon. It seems apparent that if the Nephites existed they weren't Greek speaking, so the term seems a little out of place.What are the possible theories on such an appearance?I posted the verse in Revelations as it is verbatim across that portion. Do you think JS used the KJV in this portion?
Robspectre Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 We are familiar with this term (alpha and omega). I believe what the actual plates may have said something like beginning and end, first and last, or something simular. I believe the BOM was traslated to relate to us. Thats how I see it. Maybe my answer is simple, because maybe I am simple.
charity's child Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 I saw another thread regarding 'Alpha and Omega' on the board and it reminded me of running across this in 3 Nephi. Apparently the phrase appears in Revelations 3 times and in the D&C another 12 times. I did a little net searching on the phrase this a.m. and discovered that it doesn't actually appear in the earliest biblical manuscripts and may very well have been a later addition.What I find interesting is that in 3 Nephi, we have Christ, declaring in the darkness to be the 'Alpha and Omega'. These are letters from the Greek alphabet and there are some English translations of the Bible that refer to the same title as the 'A to the Z'. So there is the appearance of Greek in the Book of Mormon. It seems apparent that if the Nephites existed they weren't Greek speaking, so the term seems a little out of place.What are the possible theories on such an appearance?I posted the verse in Revelations as it is verbatim across that portion. Do you think JS used the KJV in this portion?The phrase means beginning to end and Joseph used familiar terms to express it. Although the translation came from revelation, we have to remember it came through a man. Joseph had read the KJV Bible a lot. It's language was what he was most comfortable with scripturally.
Mudcat Posted January 2, 2009 Author Posted January 2, 2009 We are familiar with this term (alpha and omega). I believe what the actual plates may have said something like beginning and end, first and last, or something simular. I believe the BOM was traslated to relate to us. Thats how I see it. Maybe my answer is simple, because maybe I am simple. The phrase means beginning to end and Joseph used familiar terms to express it. Although the translation came from revelation, we have to remember it came through a man. Joseph had read the KJV Bible a lot. It's language was what he was most comfortable with scripturally.Thanks for your thoughts Rob and CC.At present, I feel the proffered explanations are the only ones that would seem to fit. As somehow I picture translating a Greek word into Ref. Egyptian, then into English would yield a different result. Given the accounts of the scribes for the translation, it still seems to create some difficulty overall though.
urroner Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 I saw another thread regarding 'Alpha and Omega' on the board and it reminded me of running across this in 3 Nephi. Apparently the phrase appears in Revelations 3 times and in the D&C another 12 times. I did a little net searching on the phrase this a.m. and discovered that it doesn't actually appear in the earliest biblical manuscripts and may very well have been a later addition.What I find interesting is that in 3 Nephi, we have Christ, declaring in the darkness to be the 'Alpha and Omega'. These are letters from the Greek alphabet and there are some English translations of the Bible that refer to the same title as the 'A to the Z'. So there is the appearance of Greek in the Book of Mormon. It seems apparent that if the Nephites existed they weren't Greek speaking, so the term seems a little out of place.What are the possible theories on such an appearance?I posted the verse in Revelations as it is verbatim across that portion. Do you think JS used the KJV in this portion?Daniel C. Peterson wrote in an article:Again, Ankerberg and Weldon are much amused by the fact that the English translation of 3 Nephi 9:18 features the Greek words "Alpha and Omega." What, they chortle, is Greek doing in the supposedly Hebrew Book of Mormon? They don't seem to realize that "Alpha and Omega" may be a perfectly good translation of original phrasing, found on the plates, that contained no Greek. So, likewise, it could serve as a fine translation of the common Arabic phrase al-bidaya wa-al-nihaya, "the beginning and the end." So, too, "A and Z" would be a perfectly legitimate translation of the Greek "Alpha and Omega" without implying even for a moment that English letters occurred in the Greek New Testament.
urroner Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 translationAhhh, a one word post . Her Amun, you need to parti cipate more in that "Three Word" thread, except you need to use more words.
Benjamin McGuire Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 The Book of Mormon, of course, is an early 19th century work, produced by Joseph Smith, in English. Alpha and Omega are English words found in Webster's 1828 dictionary of the English language. I suppose we could also ask why the words crisis, abyss, angel, anchor, history, and so on are also in the text (they all come staight from the greek too), but the argument wouldn't sound quite as nice, and everyone would see it for what it was ...Ben M.
Jason Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 What are English words doing in the Book of Mormon? English didn't even exist in the 5th century AD!
Mudcat Posted January 2, 2009 Author Posted January 2, 2009 The Book of Mormon, of course, is an early 19th century work, produced by Joseph Smith, in English. Alpha and Omega are English words found in Webster's 1828 dictionary of the English language. I suppose we could also ask why the words crisis, abyss, angel, anchor, history, and so on are also in the text (they all come staight from the greek too), but the argument wouldn't sound quite as nice, and everyone would see it for what it was ...Ben M.Hi Ben,Personally I see words like crisis, abyss, angel, anchor, history and so forth as commonly used words. Alpha and Omega, don't necessarily in fit in to that description. At least in my own opinion, which by the way is totally bereft of scholarship of course. The words I asked about appear almost title like and seem to reference the same words used in Revelations. I didn't know I was making an argument, I thought I was asking a question. But perceiving such as an argument would be much more fitting the polemic agenda you feel I maintain.Polemically,Mudcat
ebeddoulos Posted January 2, 2009 Posted January 2, 2009 Alpha & Omega is Greek? Next thing ya know, someone is going to try to say that rodeo is not English or even Cowboy but Spanish and does not mean haute couture or even pr
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