Handbook or SOP for our resting loved ones?

[nuclearfuels]

I understand these questions might not be crystal clear currently, so I'm interested in your opinion on the following. If you have a book or talk you'd suggest, please share it also. Thanks in advance.

1- When our loved ones from the Spirit world visit us, and we're aware of their presence by sensing it, feeling it or seeing them, how do they "earn" for lack of a better word the privilege of visiting us (for example when we see them, which would be something they or their leadership allows)? What warrants our eyes being opened, by the leadership in the spirit world area of our loved ones?  I imagine it's not too difficult to avoid sinning in the spirit world, having no physical body, no need to eat, sleep, etc.

2- When loved ones pass away and our resting family members come visit them to welcome them to the Spirit World, what is the chain of command for informing the existing-resting loved ones to visit the soon-to-be-passing away relative? Prophet, Quorum of the Twelve, 70, area authority, stake president, bishop, auxiliary president, ministering bros/sisters? Or would it be more like 10th great grandpa/ma tells 9th great and so on, down to the most recently resting relative who visits the soon to be passing away mortal?

3- Since we don't or I at least do not know when we'll be visited, how can we / me prepare for or "earn" or warrant such visits? How might we successfully seek such visits? If the ministering of angels includes the right to direct such visits (when blessing others that they will be protected and guided, and that He'll be on their right hand and on their left - all of these blessings to me imply angels. what angels are most likely to be there other than our most recently departed, resting loved ones?), can we ask for such a visit when asking for a blessing? 

[rpn]

My take is that everything we know from scripture is that when it is important for something or someone, resurrected beings are allowed to talk with mortals, usually in family lines.   Maybe we could pray, but I wouldn't since it seems rather presumptuous to think I'm entitled to summon people to earth.     I don't know that any of us have any idea who meets us when we die (although I would think anyone we are sealed to in marriage who has kept their covenants would have that privilege if it is part of death process).

[JAHS]

1. Don't know

2. Don't know

3. Don't know

Any other answers are speculation at best.

[Chum]

13 minutes ago, JAHS said:

Any other answers are speculation at best.

To be fair: As a body, we seem to thrive on speculation. ex: Testimonies that associate outcomes with actions.

To pull the rug out now seems, well, unfair.

[nuclearfuels]

4 hours ago, JAHS said:

1. Don't know

2. Don't know

3. Don't know

Any other answers are speculation at best.

Feel free to not respond

[manol]

On 4/27/2025 at 12:52 PM, nuclearfuels said:

1- When our loved ones from the Spirit world visit us, and we're aware of their presence by sensing it, feeling it or seeing them, how do they "earn" for lack of a better word the privilege of visiting us (for example when we see them, which would be something they or their leadership allows)? What warrants our eyes being opened, by the leadership in the spirit world area of our loved ones?  I imagine it's not too difficult to avoid sinning in the spirit world, having no physical body, no need to eat, sleep, etc.

 

I'm with @JAHS on this:  I don't know.   We had one of these incidents in our household about ten days ago.   I have no idea what events or factors on the other side were involved.  On this side, the primary factor seems to have been "a pressing need".  

[speculation] I think there is at least one sense which is prevalent on the other side but which is not prevalent here (although it is not completely absent either).  By way of analogy, imagine a person with a severe vision impairment such that all they can discern is the difference between light and darkness, and even then it requires focused attention and deliberately ignoring distractions for the person to even do that.  So what those of us with normal vision can clearly see in detail, this person at best can tell whether the scene before them is predominantly light or predominantly dark.  With that introduction, and for lack of a better word, I'd call the sense which is prevalent on the other side, and which is not prevalent (but still not completely absent) here, "knowing".  I think that our limited ability to discern that which is light from that which is darkness from this side of the veil is expanded and amplified a millionfold or more on the other side.  So I'm really not sure that a hierarchical "chain of commend" is needed. [/speculation]

 

On 4/27/2025 at 12:52 PM, nuclearfuels said:

2- When loved ones pass away and our resting family members come visit them to welcome them to the Spirit World, what is the chain of command for informing the existing-resting loved ones to visit the soon-to-be-passing away relative? Prophet, Quorum of the Twelve, 70, area authority, stake president, bishop, auxiliary president, ministering bros/sisters? Or would it be more like 10th great grandpa/ma tells 9th great and so on, down to the most recently resting relative who visits the soon to be passing away mortal?

 

While by definition near-death experiencers haven't crossed all the way over, imo what they have to say about meeting relatives on the other side may be useful.  I haven't watched this particular video, but ime this YouTube channel produces excellent content:

Meeting Family On The Other Side - NDE Stories - YouTube

Here is another such video, this one just posted an hour ago.  The first clip is from the NDE of a man with an LDS background.  I highly recommend at least watching that first clip (it's about four minutes long); he meets two relatives but does not actually see them in bodily form, yet he has no trouble distinguishing who they are from how their presence feels to him.  Imo this is an example of the sense that I called "knowing" a few paragraphs up. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SA_OC1o02A

 

On 4/27/2025 at 12:52 PM, nuclearfuels said:

3- Since we don't or I at least do not know when we'll be visited, how can we / me prepare for or "earn" or warrant such visits? How might we successfully seek such visits? If the ministering of angels includes the right to direct such visits (when blessing others that they will be protected and guided, and that He'll be on their right hand and on their left - all of these blessings to me imply angels. what angels are most likely to be there other than our most recently departed, resting loved ones?), can we ask for such a visit when asking for a blessing? 

 

Regarding "having the right to direct such visits":  I suppose you could give it a shot, but my inclination would be to request rather than direct, whether or not one is invoking the ministering of angels (which I've done on occasion, and I think it helped, but I didn't see any angels).  

Here's a minute-and-a-half video which advocates taking an active role in connecting with departed loved ones.  The man speaking does not come from an LDS paradigm, to the best of my knowledge.  The video describes something I've been doing without having words for it, and ime the "sensations in your body" he mentions are not necessarily physical sensations:

How to Visit With A Deceased Loved One - YouTube

 

Edited April 28 by manol

[JVW]

21 hours ago, nuclearfuels said:

1- When our loved ones from the Spirit world visit us, and we're aware of their presence by sensing it, feeling it or seeing them, how do they "earn" for lack of a better word the privilege of visiting us (for example when we see them, which would be something they or their leadership allows)? What warrants our eyes being opened, by the leadership in the spirit world area of our loved ones?  I imagine it's not too difficult to avoid sinning in the spirit world, having no physical body, no need to eat, sleep, etc.

I don't think worthiness of either party matters when it comes to visits from ancestors. It is strictly based on whatever God feels like doing according to His holy will. Asking Him for a visit from a loved one can't hurt, but I won't suggest that it will move the needle. I've explicitly requested from 2 or 3 people I know (now dead), before they passed away, to ask God directly for permission to visit me sometime after they die so that I can know that they made it ok and catch up with them. Those requests have so far been answered, by God, in the negative. But I have been visited by other ancestors before at points in which they were the last thing on my mind. I wasn't seeking for it, I didn't ask for it, and I wouldn't even say I was particularly worthy of it. And during the visit, the actions that the visitor took were according to what God allowed them to do during the visit.

21 hours ago, nuclearfuels said:

2- When loved ones pass away and our resting family members come visit them to welcome them to the Spirit World, what is the chain of command for informing the existing-resting loved ones to visit the soon-to-be-passing away relative? Prophet, Quorum of the Twelve, 70, area authority, stake president, bishop, auxiliary president, ministering bros/sisters? Or would it be more like 10th great grandpa/ma tells 9th great and so on, down to the most recently resting relative who visits the soon to be passing away mortal?

I'm curious about why you're even wondering about this? Spirit World management structure doesn't exactly strike me as a thrilling topic.

21 hours ago, nuclearfuels said:

3- Since we don't or I at least do not know when we'll be visited, how can we / me prepare for or "earn" or warrant such visits? How might we successfully seek such visits? If the ministering of angels includes the right to direct such visits (when blessing others that they will be protected and guided, and that He'll be on their right hand and on their left - all of these blessings to me imply angels. what angels are most likely to be there other than our most recently departed, resting loved ones?), can we ask for such a visit when asking for a blessing? 

All you can do is pray and hope. Any visits from those beyond the grave happen only by the grace of God and has nothing to do with our relationship with Christ or our "worthiness" to receive them.

Anytime I think of meeting with departed ancestors I'm reminded of this talk, though it isn't explicitly about that topic. But maybe there's something in here that will help God answer your questions. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2012/04/how-to-obtain-revelation-and-inspiration-for-your-personal-life?lang=eng#p1

[The Nehor]

Solomonic magic involves the binding and use of supernatural entities. Might want to start there.

[Nofear]

Some 42% of elderly couples report after-death communication (ADC). In the governance of heaven we don't know the requirements needed to allow an ADC.

https://med.virginia.edu/perceptual-studies/wp-content/uploads/sites/360/2024/01/Penberthy2023_Description-and-impact-of-encounters-with-deceased-partners-or-spouses.pdf

[Kenngo1969]

My father received a visit (in his mind's eye, at least) of one of his ancestors who imparted to him vital information that he would not have known otherwise that averted a family tragedy.  Another person whom I like, I know, and I trust imparted an experience of another instance of such communication with a loved one from beyond the veil (albeit with no crucial information imparted beyond, perhaps, "I'm here, I'm happy, I'm as anxiously engaged in the work on this side of the veil as you are on the other side of the veil, and I'm preparing a place for you.").  My father, who recently passed away, appeared to my mother in a dream.  Again, no specific information was imparted (that she told me, anyway!) beyond what I just mentioned.  I couldn't fathom, though, why such communications occur in some cases while they don't in others, or what God's purposes might be.  Such information is waaay above my pay grade.

I asked Microsoft Copilot, an analogue to ChatGPT and other, similar AI information sources, the following:

Quote

From a Latter-day Saint perspective, why are beings that have died before us allowed to return to Earth to communicate with us, or why are they not?  Is God simply a "bureaucrat-in-chief" who allows such communication in some circumstances while denying it in others according to His own personal whims?

Here is the (surprisingly insightful, for a robot, I thought) answer I got (Hey!  That rhymes!  Cool!):

Quote

 

From a Latter-day Saint perspective, communication with those who have passed on is deeply tied to the doctrines of the spirit world, the plan of salvation, and the will of God.  The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints teaches that the spirit world is a place where spirits reside after death, awaiting resurrection and judgment.  While there are instances in Church history where communication between the living and the dead has occurred, such events are considered rare and purposeful.

The Church emphasizes that such communication is not arbitrary or whimsical, but is governed by divine wisdom and purpose.  For example, instances of communication might occur to provide comfort, guidance, or to fulfill certain aspects of God's plan.  However, the Church also warns against seeking out such interactions through unauthorized means, such as seances or other occult practices, as these are not sanctioned by God and can lead to deception.  [Hiram Page's seer stone comes to mind.]

The idea of God as a "bureaucrat-in-chief" might not align with the Latter-day Saint understanding of His nature.  God is seen as a loving, omniscient Father who acts in the best interest of His  children, even if His reasons are not always clear to us.  His decisions are believed to be rooted in eternal principles and a perfect understanding of what will bring about the greatest good.[1]

 

___________________

END NOTE

1. Here, I might add, "His decisions are believed to be rooted in eternal principles and a perfect understanding of what will bring about the greatest good" ... eventually.  I've said here many times that I don't know why God has seen fit to grant certain blessings that I have sought earnestly while (at least as yet) denying (or at least withholding) others, but I have said, also, that I believe God is really good at "playing the long game": Whether in time or in Eternity, if we are faithful, no blessing will be denied us.

 

[ksfisher]

On 4/27/2025 at 6:17 PM, nuclearfuels said:

Feel free to not respond

JAHS answer to your question was the truth.  There has been no specific revelation on any of the questions you asked.  Don’t you want the truth? 

[Doctor Steuss]

On 4/27/2025 at 1:12 PM, Chum said:

To be fair: As a body, we seem to thrive on speculation. ex: Testimonies that associate outcomes with actions.

To pull the rug out now seems, well, unfair.

This reminded me of something my grandpa said once (i.e. the juxtaposition of a drive for speculation, with the passing of loved ones).

"If you ever find yourself hungering for the preaching of false doctrine, just go to a funeral."

[The Nehor]

3 hours ago, Doctor Steuss said:

This reminded me of something my grandpa said once (i.e. the juxtaposition of a drive for speculation, with the passing of loved ones).

"If you ever find yourself hungering for the preaching of false doctrine, just go to a funeral."

“He had a good heart and loved those around him.”

Me thinking: “Am I the only one here who ever met him?”

[Chum]

I twice gave a blessing to a brother who was suffering a migraine. Once in the evening and again the following morning. Both times it came out that he ought to put his affairs in order and there was some other language to that effect. Neither time was I thinking that going in. I may have apologized after the 1st blessing, I'm not certain.

Other than his headache, his health was at the better end of the never-great scale. That night he had a seizure (not unusual for him) but it was in the bathroom where the floor and walls were unyielding and he passed from his injuries. 

I often speculated that this brother was given some advanced warning and that speculation has always been well accepted. It's like a currency for us.  Which is fine. People doing people things.

[Nofear]

An interesting video of a hospice nurse's experiences.
 

 

[JAHS]

I did have one experience while working as an orderly in a hospital. The nurse and I went into the room of an old man who was close to death and pretty much unconscious.
He had slid down the bed and so  we both grabbed him and pulled him up to a more comfortable position. When we did that he lifted his head up off the pillow his eyes opened up wide and stared down at the end of the bed and got this big smile on his face, then laid back down and took his last breaths. The nurse and I both looked in the same direction to see what he was smiling at but saw nothing. We told his daughter about it later and she said he was probably smiling at his wife who had come to get him. 

[manol]

19 hours ago, Nofear said:

An interesting video of a hospice nurse's experiences.

Thanks for posting that, enjoyed it very much.  I've watched several of her other videos but hadn't seen that one before.

Kinda sorta related:

One of my sons delivered medical equipment to nursing homes.  One time as he was signing out after a delivery the nurse at the front desk asked him to look at one of the closed-circuit TV monitors she had. It showed the entrance area, which was nearby so they could turn their heads and see it.  On the monitor they could both see an elderly woman sitting in one of the chairs, but when they looked at that chair directly, they could not see anyone there.  

So my son walked over to the chair and knelt beside it and gently touched the air with the palms of his hands.  He could feel something so he called back to the nurse at the desk, "Is this where she is?"  The nurse could see them both on the monitor so she replied, "Yes, she's right there, you hands are on her."  My recollection is that he said something to the elderly woman in the chair but I don't remember what it was.  On the monitor, the elderly woman did not appear to react to his presence, and he didn't want to be intrusive, so he left.  To the best of my knowledge they never found out any more than that. 

On another topic, upthread a bit I mentioned some speculation about "knowing" being a much more well-developed sense on the other side than it is here.  Today I stumbled across an NDE account which attempts to describe this "knowing", and according to her description, it VASTLY transcends our "knowing" down here.  Here it is, cued up to that part; she gets her point across within about two minutes.  You might have to crank the volume a bit and/or turn on captioning, as the audio is not very loud for some reason:

 

Edited May 4 by manol

[Stargazer]

On 4/27/2025 at 6:52 PM, nuclearfuels said:

I understand these questions might not be crystal clear currently, so I'm interested in your opinion on the following. If you have a book or talk you'd suggest, please share it also. Thanks in advance.

1- When our loved ones from the Spirit world visit us, and we're aware of their presence by sensing it, feeling it or seeing them, how do they "earn" for lack of a better word the privilege of visiting us (for example when we see them, which would be something they or their leadership allows)? What warrants our eyes being opened, by the leadership in the spirit world area of our loved ones?  I imagine it's not too difficult to avoid sinning in the spirit world, having no physical body, no need to eat, sleep, etc.

2- When loved ones pass away and our resting family members come visit them to welcome them to the Spirit World, what is the chain of command for informing the existing-resting loved ones to visit the soon-to-be-passing away relative? Prophet, Quorum of the Twelve, 70, area authority, stake president, bishop, auxiliary president, ministering bros/sisters? Or would it be more like 10th great grandpa/ma tells 9th great and so on, down to the most recently resting relative who visits the soon to be passing away mortal?

3- Since we don't or I at least do not know when we'll be visited, how can we / me prepare for or "earn" or warrant such visits? How might we successfully seek such visits? If the ministering of angels includes the right to direct such visits (when blessing others that they will be protected and guided, and that He'll be on their right hand and on their left - all of these blessings to me imply angels. what angels are most likely to be there other than our most recently departed, resting loved ones?), can we ask for such a visit when asking for a blessing? 

Interesting questions! 

Aside from the "I have no clue" and "how can we even know," all else is speculation. But there is this story in the book "Saints at War: Inspiring Stories of Courage and Valor":

Told by Gerald Mervin Bolton (World War II, Europe, Army): "Gerald was with another GI who was a Latter-day Saint. This was unusual; there were very few men he had found in his regiment that were Mormons. The two men were behind some rubble and could see a German soldier creeping toward them from a path below with his rifle ready. Gerald’s companion fired and killed the German. They went down to search him and found he had papers on him that identified him as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Gerald’s buddy sat and cried. He was so devastated because he had killed another Mormon. He was so overcome that he couldn’t stop crying, and Gerald feared that he would have a mental breakdown and requested that he be sent back of the line for a few days rest.

"A couple of nights later he had a dream. He told Gerald that it was so real he wasn’t sure if it was a dream or if the man was actually there. The German soldier came to him and said 'Please don’t mourn for me. You’ve done me a favor, for now I am out of the war and have found happiness as you will never know on earth. I thank you, and am sorry that you still have to endure the hell I have been so fortunate to leave.' From that night on the GI was alright and his faith had been strengthened."

Freeman, Robert. Saints at War: Inspiring Stories of Courage and Valor (pp. 9-10). Cedar Fort, Inc.. Kindle Edition. 

Was it real, or a delusion? Gerald's buddy seemed to think it was real. The German soldier wasn't a relative, or even a friend, and yet the visit was either authorized or requested by someone.