Dario_M Posted October 14 Author Share Posted October 14 2 minutes ago, Teancum said: You most certianly are correct. It seems odd to me that @Dario_Mis in a homosexual live in relationship and his local leaders are turning a blind eye. It's not how it normal goes in the church i get that. But what does it matter that my leaders are turning a blind eye actually? It keeps me out of troubles. 2 Link to comment
Tacenda Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 (edited) 16 hours ago, Dario_M said: Thank you so much. I'm gonna dig into it in the morning. Edit, i see that eventually all the gay man married a woman.😌 I could never do that though. I didn't watch the videos currently, probably saw them a few years ago though and forgot, but sometimes these marriages don't last. There's a few instances I've seen. Also, it didn't work out for our own California Boy poster on the board. And btw, the church owned BYU's once mascot, is married to a man. He came out after being the team mascot as a cougar. https://www.edgemedianetwork.com/story/272929#:~:text=A young man named Charlie,Not any more. This might help: Edited October 14 by Tacenda 1 Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 14 Author Share Posted October 14 (edited) 1 hour ago, Tacenda said: I didn't see watch the videos, probably saw them a few years ago though and forgot, but sometimes these marriages don't last. There's a few instances I've seen. Also, it didn't work out for our own California Boy poster on the board. And btw, the church owned BYU's once mascot, is married to a man. He came out after being the team mascot as a cougar. https://www.edgemedianetwork.com/story/272929#:~:text=A young man named Charlie,Not any more. This might help: They are really good looking. 😻 Edited October 14 by Dario_M Link to comment
MustardSeed Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 48 minutes ago, Teancum said: You most certianly are correct. It seems odd to me that @Dario_Mis in a homosexual live in relationship and his local leaders are turning a blind eye. It seems like an aberration. I know it has been a long time since I have been a bishop, but in between time we have seen very hostile policy come, and go a bit, towards same sex relationships. I wish him the best. We know nothing about this situation. Link to comment
Teancum Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 49 minutes ago, Dario_M said: It's not how it normal goes in the church i get that. But what does it matter that my leaders are turning a blind eye actually? It keeps me out of troubles. I am not complaining about what your leaders do or do not do. I just think at some point this trend may reverse. I only wish you the best and happiness. 1 Link to comment
Teancum Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 26 minutes ago, MustardSeed said: We know nothing about this situation. ok Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 14 Author Share Posted October 14 29 minutes ago, Teancum said: I am not complaining about what your leaders do or do not do. I just think at some point this trend may reverse. I only wish you the best and happiness. Thank you. 1 Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 14 Author Share Posted October 14 (edited) 39 minutes ago, MustardSeed said: We know nothing about this situation. Well that's not true. I told you guys a lot about my situation. So you allready know a big chunk about me. Unless you don't read. Edited October 14 by Dario_M Link to comment
Popular Post The Nehor Posted October 14 Popular Post Share Posted October 14 6 hours ago, Tacenda said: This might help: Excuse me. Some of us are TRYING to live the law of chastity here. Look at that walking pornography. How can I be expected to control myself with those two beautiful and happy flaunting their erotic bodies in front of me. It is almost like being back in church when one of the women accidentally exposed their shoulder for a few seconds. Are you trying to turn me into a licked cupcake? 6 Link to comment
Malc Posted October 14 Share Posted October 14 1 hour ago, The Nehor said: Excuse me. Some of us are TRYING to live the law of chastity here. Look at that walking pornography. How can I be expected to control myself with those two beautiful and happy flaunting their erotic bodies in front of me. It is almost like being back in church when one of the women accidentally exposed their shoulder for a few seconds. Are you trying to turn me into a licked cupcake? I have to say that there are times - and this is one of them - when your tongue-in-cheek remarks make me want to LOL. 2 Link to comment
Tacenda Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 (edited) 3 hours ago, The Nehor said: Excuse me. Some of us are TRYING to live the law of chastity here. Look at that walking pornography. How can I be expected to control myself with those two beautiful and happy flaunting their erotic bodies in front of me. It is almost like being back in church when one of the women accidentally exposed their shoulder for a few seconds. Are you trying to turn me into a licked cupcake? We need to give @Dario_Mcontext. Dario, as teens some of us not all, were taught in Young Men's and Young Women's classes on Sunday that we don't want to be like "licked cupcakes" and to save our virginity until marriage. And I guess the video shot is maybe a little too sexy. Sorry, just trying to let Dario know he's not alone with his feelings of love for the same sex and wanting to stay in the LDS church. Edited October 15 by Tacenda 2 Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 15 Author Share Posted October 15 5 hours ago, The Nehor said: Excuse me. Some of us are TRYING to live the law of chastity here. Look at that walking pornography. How can I be expected to control myself with those two beautiful and happy flaunting their erotic bodies in front of me. It is almost like being back in church when one of the women accidentally exposed their shoulder for a few seconds. Are you trying to turn me into a licked cupcake? The same here. Omg that's just plain sexy. 🤣 Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 15 Author Share Posted October 15 (edited) 13 hours ago, Tacenda said: We need to give @Dario_Mcontext. Dario, as teens some of us not all, were taught in Young Men's and Young Women's classes on Sunday that we don't want to be like "licked cupcakes" and to save our virginity until marriage. I'm afrait that have allready happend to me. I've missed those classes because as a teen i wasn't a Mormon yet you know. But i've met Mormons from Utah via friends or on the street in my teen years though. Most of them came from Utah. From that moment on i could have done something with it. But i was to focused on others things. Anyway i'm afrait that i've lost my virginity for a long time allready. Over and over again. 😇 So the law of chastity is not a succes for me. 13 hours ago, Tacenda said: And I guess the video shot is maybe a little too sexy. Sorry, just trying to let Dario know he's not alone with his feelings of love for the same sex and wanting to stay in the LDS church. Yes It looks really sexy. 🤣 but that's not a problem. Edited October 15 by Dario_M Link to comment
Teancum Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 On 10/12/2024 at 11:22 AM, The Nehor said: The cynic in me wonders what the use of seers are if they are blown about by every wind of doctrine. Bingo! I make this point frequently. They really do not seem to have a whole lot of special insight and directives. 3 Link to comment
JVW Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 I don't know how long limited use temple recommends last for before expiring, but normal temple recommends last for two years. After they expire you need to be interviewed in order to renew the recommend. In the temple recommend interview. Here are the questions you'll be asked. Quote Do you have faith in and a testimony of God, the Eternal Father; His Son, Jesus Christ; and the Holy Ghost? Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Jesus Christ and of His role as your Savior and Redeemer? Do you have a testimony of the Restoration of the gospel of Jesus Christ? Do you sustain the President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the prophet, seer, and revelator and as the only person on the earth authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain the members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local leaders of the Church? The Lord has said that all things are to be “done in cleanliness” before Him (Doctrine and Covenants 42:41). Do you strive for moral cleanliness in your thoughts and behavior? Do you obey the law of chastity? Do you follow the teachings of the Church of Jesus Christ in your private and public behavior with members of your family and others? Do you support or promote any teachings, practices, or doctrine contrary to those of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? Do you strive to keep the Sabbath day holy, both at home and at church; attend your meetings; prepare for and worthily partake of the sacrament; and live your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel? Do you strive to be honest in all that you do? Are you a full-tithe payer? For new members seeking a recommend to perform proxy baptisms and confirmations: Are you willing to obey the commandment to pay tithing? Do you understand and obey the Word of Wisdom? (This question is omitted when interviewing a child or youth.) Do you have any financial or other obligations to a former spouse or to children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations? Are there serious sins in your life that need to be resolved with priesthood authorities as part of your repentance? Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord’s house and participate in temple ordinances? From what I can tell @Dario_M would answer yes to all questions except for question 5 and maybe question 7. But at the time when he received his recommend he could have honestly answered yes to all of the questions. So at the time he received his recommend he was worthy to receive it (according to the judgment of the bishop) and now, because there is a "no" answer to at least one question, he wouldn't receive a new recommend. After you have a temple recommend, like the one you currently have, it doesn't matter what you do or believe, the temple recommend is yours and nobody will take it away unless for some reason you want to go to the bishop and explicitly tell him why he should take away your recommend. Anyone who is living together with someone else, unmarried, will not be able to have a temple recommend renewed. The church is pretty clear on that from my understanding, even for limited use recommends. As far as taking the sacrament is concerned, that will depend on the individual. I'm not in church leadership, but knowing everything I know about Dario from the very limited interactions here, I'd heartily agree to him taking the sacrament each week. I'd also encourage him to read the scriptures every day and to pray to God and turn his focus towards Jesus Christ as he continued living in this crazy place we call life. But honestly, at least for me, the most important 2 questions (and the 2 that are easiest for me to lie to myself about) are the first two questions. The more fully I understand God's love for me the more likely I will be to even want to attend the temple at all. And the answers to those first two questions shape every decision I make in my life, regardless of temple recommend status. 3 Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 23 Author Share Posted October 23 8 minutes ago, JVW said: I don't know how long limited use temple recommends last for before expiring, but normal temple recommends last for two years. After they expire you need to be interviewed in order to renew the recommend. In the temple recommend interview. Here are the questions you'll be asked. Well...i don't think i will be doing that again. And with my situation right now i don't even think i will receive a new temple card. 8 minutes ago, JVW said: From what I can tell @Dario_M would answer yes to all questions except for question 5 and maybe question 7. But at the time when he received his recommend he could have honestly answered yes to all of the questions. So at the time he received his recommend he was worthy to receive it (according to the judgment of the bishop) and now, because there is a "no" answer to at least one question, he wouldn't receive a new recommend. I don't really understand what you mean with this reaction? 8 minutes ago, JVW said: After you have a temple recommend, like the one you currently have, it doesn't matter what you do or believe, the temple recommend is yours and nobody will take it away unless for some reason you want to go to the bishop and explicitly tell him why he should take away your recommend. It's not a secret at all in my ward. Everyone knows that i'm gay and live with another man. Btw...my temple card that i have in my possesion right now was given to me in Portugal. And at that time i didn't had a boyfriend. I don't think they will give me another temple recommend after this one is expired. 8 minutes ago, JVW said: Anyone who is living together with someone else, unmarried, will not be able to have a temple recommend renewed. The church is pretty clear on that from my understanding, even for limited use recommends. As far as taking the sacrament is concerned, that will depend on the individual. I'm not in church leadership, but knowing everything I know about Dario from the very limited interactions here, I'd heartily agree to him taking the sacrament each week. I'd also encourage him to read the scriptures every day and to pray to God and turn his focus towards Jesus Christ as he continued living in this crazy place we call life. Yes i will do that. Recently i have prayed in the woods and have even maken a video about it. You can take a fast look if you want. 8 minutes ago, JVW said: But honestly, at least for me, the most important 2 questions (and the 2 that are easiest for me to lie to myself about) are the first two questions. The more fully I understand God's love for me the more likely I will be to even want to attend the temple at all. And the answers to those first two questions shape every decision I make in my life, regardless of temple recommend status. I've never been in any temple. And my interest is not there really on the moment. I'm dealing with some though things right now. Link to comment
JVW Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 7 minutes ago, Dario_M said: I don't really understand what you mean with this reaction? I meant that there are no "rogue" bishops or stake presidents. When you received your temple recommend you were able to honestly answer "yes" to all of the questions and were considered worthy. Your recommend will last until it expires and it doesn't matter what you do or what you believe during the time in which you have an active temple recommend, it won't be taken away. Now you are unworthy for a temple recommend, which will only impact your ability to renew, not your current abilities to worship. I don't see anything wrong with what either of your Bishops and/or Stake Presidents have done in addressing your specific situation. I just noticed in a lot of earlier comments people mentioned that you may have a "rogue" bishop and I am disagreeing with that notion. 7 minutes ago, Dario_M said: Yes i will do that. Recently i have prayed in the woods and have even maken a video about it. You can take a fast look if you want. I don't have access to YouTube on my computer or phone so I can't see it, but I'm glad that you are making efforts to draw closer to Jesus Christ! 7 minutes ago, Dario_M said: I've never been in any temple. And my interest is not there really on the moment. I'm dealing with some though things right now. I understand. I also am not interested, at the moment, in attending the temple. So I don't have a temple recommend because I wouldn't use it. 3 Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 23 Author Share Posted October 23 (edited) 43 minutes ago, JVW said: I meant that there are no "rogue" bishops or stake presidents. When you received your temple recommend you were able to honestly answer "yes" to all of the questions and were considered worthy. Your recommend will last until it expires and it doesn't matter what you do or what you believe during the time in which you have an active temple recommend, it won't be taken away. Now you are unworthy for a temple recommend, which will only impact your ability to renew, not your current abilities to worship. I don't see anything wrong with what either of your Bishops and/or Stake Presidents have done in addressing your specific situation. I just noticed in a lot of earlier comments people mentioned that you may have a "rogue" bishop and I am disagreeing with that notion. Aaahw okay now i understand what you mean. Thanks for the clarification. 43 minutes ago, JVW said: I understand. I also am not interested, at the moment, in attending the temple. So I don't have a temple recommend because I wouldn't use it. Me either. I'm just not in a headspace that i'm thinking about the temple work right now. It's just what it is. 😞 Edited October 23 by Dario_M Link to comment
Rain Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 1 hour ago, JVW said: I meant that there are no "rogue" bishops or stake presidents. It depends on what you mean by rogue. The 2 people I mentioned who drink coffee did tell their bishops. One had no intention of stopping and the bishop knew. The other was on the fence about stopping. Still got their reccomends. 1 hour ago, JVW said: When you received your temple recommend you were able to honestly answer "yes" to all of the questions and were considered worthy. Your recommend will last until it expires and it doesn't matter what you do or what you believe during the time in which you have an active temple recommend, it won't be taken away. Now you are unworthy for a temple recommend, which will only impact your ability to renew, not your current abilities to worship. I don't see anything wrong with what either of your Bishops and/or Stake Presidents have done in addressing your specific situation. I just noticed in a lot of earlier comments people mentioned that you may have a "rogue" bishop and I am disagreeing with that notion. I don't have access to YouTube on my computer or phone so I can't see it, but I'm glad that you are making efforts to draw closer to Jesus Christ! I understand. I also am not interested, at the moment, in attending the temple. So I don't have a temple recommend because I wouldn't use it. Link to comment
Calm Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 (edited) 2 hours ago, JVW said: But at the time when he received his recommend he could have honestly answered yes to all of the questions. This is not to condemn or approve of Dario’s choices, that is not my calling to do so nor has he asked me to give my opinion on this or counsel or anyone else’s here that I remember. I do remember telling him about what I hoped for him in the future, that he would be able to open up to his bishop about his situation and this appears to have happened with his current bishop. Dario seems fully aware of the restrictions the Church has, so I don’t see counsel on his choices as needed. I can certainly understand why Dario was and is making these choices. It’s important to have community and he was and is being strongly drawn towards the Church. And I think that it is a very good thing (offering my opinion here even if not asked) that the Church community can be there for him and that his ward can benefit from him being there for them as much as he is able. But I also think it’s important for Dario not to misunderstand the standards of the Church and I think he might with the above comment you made that I quoted in this post as I am not sure Dario could actually honestly answer “yes” to all of the questions at the time of his interview. The Law of Chastity forbids any sexual relations besides those between a man and a woman who are legally married. Dario told us he was unable to follow the law of chastity in Portugal and was not intending to stop because his loneliness was unbearable iirc (he went into more detail in another post on the why). https://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/74979-i-have-become-a-mormon-3-weeks-ago/?do=findComment&comment=1210132427 He also said he hadn’t been honest in his baptism interview with his bishop. Again very understandable. The choice of the Church to have baptisms in the way it does may not allow for much time for trust to be established with leaders so that investigators in difficult situations will be comfortable enough to open up and share concerns. It is very hard to be vulnerable with strangers. Being very familiar with the missionaries does not always mean one will be comfortable with a bishop one has not interacted with much. I believe Dario said he had very little, if any, interaction with the Bishop prior to his interview. https://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/74979-i-have-become-a-mormon-3-weeks-ago/?do=findComment&comment=1210126181 Though perhaps this had changed by the time he received his temple recommend. If Dario was not sexually active at the time of that interview and had committed in his heart to being fully open with the Bishop if he was asked any details of his past behaviour even if he wasn’t asked such things, then I agree with you he could answer honestly “yes” to the temple recommend questions even if some others might not have felt the same in his situation (perhaps they might feel the need to discuss past issues where Dario was not impressed to do so). I agree that neither of the bishops are rogue since the former bishop was unaware of all the details at the time he gave the recommend and the current one is not required to ask Dario to turn in his recommend because he is living with his boyfriend. I do not know what policy would require of the bishop if he knew Dario was planning on going to the temple with his temple recommend though. Edited October 23 by Calm 1 Link to comment
JVW Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 1 hour ago, Rain said: It depends on what you mean by rogue. The 2 people I mentioned who drink coffee did tell their bishops. One had no intention of stopping and the bishop knew. The other was on the fence about stopping. Still got their reccomends. I don't see either of those bishops as rogue either. I believe that God can tell them if they should say "no" to a person in a temple recommend interview. I know a person who is facing similar challenges to me with sin. He wasn't allowed to baptize his daughter when she turned 8, but I still have full authority to baptize and confirm and did so at my son's baptism. Every situation is unique and every bishop is doing the best they can as a judge in Israel. 3 Link to comment
JVW Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 35 minutes ago, Calm said: This is not to condemn or approve of Dario’s choices, that is not my calling to do so nor has he asked me to give my opinion on this or counsel or anyone else’s here that I remember. I do remember telling him about what I hoped for him in the future, that he would be able to open up to his bishop about his situation and this appears to have happened with his current bishop. Dario seems fully aware of the restrictions the Church has, so I don’t see counsel on his choices as needed. I can certainly understand why Dario was and is making these choices. It’s important to have community and he was and is being strongly drawn towards the Church. And I think that it is a very good thing (offering my opinion here even if not asked) that the Church community can be there for him and that his ward can benefit from him being there for them as much as he is able. But I also think it’s important for Dario not to misunderstand the standards of the Church and I think he might with the above comment you made that I quoted in this post as I am not sure Dario could actually honestly answer “yes” to all of the questions at the time of his interview. The Law of Chastity forbids any sexual relations besides those between a man and a woman who are legally married. Dario told us he was unable to follow the law of chastity in Portugal and was not intending to stop because his loneliness was unbearable iirc (he went into more detail in another post on the why). https://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/74979-i-have-become-a-mormon-3-weeks-ago/?do=findComment&comment=1210132427 He also said he hadn’t been honest in his baptism interview with his bishop. Again very understandable. The choice of the Church to have baptisms in the way it does may not allow for much time for trust to be established with leaders so that investigators in difficult situations will be comfortable enough to open up and share concerns. It is very hard to be vulnerable with strangers. Being very familiar with the missionaries does not always mean one will be comfortable with a bishop one has not interacted with much. I believe Dario said he had very little, if any, interaction with the Bishop prior to his interview. https://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/74979-i-have-become-a-mormon-3-weeks-ago/?do=findComment&comment=1210126181 Though perhaps this had changed by the time he received his temple recommend. If Dario was not sexually active at the time of that interview and had committed in his heart to being fully open with the Bishop if he was asked any details of his past behaviour even if he wasn’t asked such things, then I agree with you he could answer honestly “yes” to the temple recommend questions even if some others might not have felt the same in his situation (perhaps they might feel the need to discuss past issues where Dario was not impressed to do so). I agree that neither of the bishops are rogue since the former bishop was unaware of all the details at the time he gave the recommend and the current one is not required to ask Dario to turn in his recommend because he is living with his boyfriend. I do not know what policy would require of the bishop if he knew Dario was planning on going to the temple with his temple recommend though. I fully agree with your sentiment here. Link to comment
Dario_M Posted October 23 Author Share Posted October 23 54 minutes ago, Calm said: This is not to condemn or approve of Dario’s choices, that is not my calling to do so nor has he asked me to give my opinion on this or counsel or anyone else’s here that I remember. I do remember telling him about what I hoped for him in the future, that he would be able to open up to his bishop about his situation and this appears to have happened with his current bishop. Dario seems fully aware of the restrictions the Church has, so I don’t see counsel on his choices as needed. I can certainly understand why Dario was and is making these choices. It’s important to have community and he was and is being strongly drawn towards the Church. And I think that it is a very good thing (offering my opinion here even if not asked) that the Church community can be there for him and that his ward can benefit from him being there for them as much as he is able. But I also think it’s important for Dario not to misunderstand the standards of the Church and I think he might with the above comment you made that I quoted in this post as I am not sure Dario could actually honestly answer “yes” to all of the questions at the time of his interview. The Law of Chastity forbids any sexual relations besides those between a man and a woman who are legally married. Dario told us he was unable to follow the law of chastity in Portugal and was not intending to stop because his loneliness was unbearable iirc (he went into more detail in another post on the why). https://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/74979-i-have-become-a-mormon-3-weeks-ago/?do=findComment&comment=1210132427 He also said he hadn’t been honest in his baptism interview with his bishop. Again very understandable. The choice of the Church to have baptisms in the way it does may not allow for much time for trust to be established with leaders so that investigators in difficult situations will be comfortable enough to open up and share concerns. It is very hard to be vulnerable with strangers. Being very familiar with the missionaries does not always mean one will be comfortable with a bishop one has not interacted with much. I believe Dario said he had very little, if any, interaction with the Bishop prior to his interview. https://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/74979-i-have-become-a-mormon-3-weeks-ago/?do=findComment&comment=1210126181 Though perhaps this had changed by the time he received his temple recommend. If Dario was not sexually active at the time of that interview and had committed in his heart to being fully open with the Bishop if he was asked any details of his past behaviour even if he wasn’t asked such things, then I agree with you he could answer honestly “yes” to the temple recommend questions even if some others might not have felt the same in his situation (perhaps they might feel the need to discuss past issues where Dario was not impressed to do so). I agree that neither of the bishops are rogue since the former bishop was unaware of all the details at the time he gave the recommend and the current one is not required to ask Dario to turn in his recommend because he is living with his boyfriend. I do not know what policy would require of the bishop if he knew Dario was planning on going to the temple with his temple recommend though. Hmmm, you have a good memorie. 2 Link to comment
Calm Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 (edited) 1 hour ago, Dario_M said: Hmmm, you have a good memorie. Not a lot of people share their backstory so openly immediately on the board, so when they do I usually pay close attention because it helps me understand them better faster. And you are an unusual poster, being from the Netherlands, which definitely helps it stick. Edited October 23 by Calm 1 Link to comment
MustardSeed Posted October 23 Share Posted October 23 (edited) 2 hours ago, Calm said: the current one is not required to ask Dario to turn in his recommend because he is living with his boyfriend. I didn’t know that. I thought Bishops were expected to “bring you in” if there were info indicating clear infraction of these basic “rules”. For the record, I don’t care if he has a recommend not. It’s not in my per view of concerns. Edited October 23 by MustardSeed Link to comment
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