How Do Church Members Become Extremists?

[Malc]

19 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Polygamists perhaps? I see them in the DI's in St. George. Maybe you're invading their turf.

Just a bunch of young "kids" - certainly nothing in their appearance suggested polygamists, especially the women. Other than the gun incident, I would have said that they were perfectly normal, average, everyday early-20s folks.

A funny thing happened to me in a discussion group that I mentioned this incident in. About half of the folks who replied to me said I should have reported the incident, perhaps filed a police complaint. The other half called me a variety of names, ranging from liar, to leftie (which I am - if they wanted to insult me they went the wrong way with that  ), to enemy of the 2nd amendment, etc. I replied a couple of times to one of the latter, but I'm sure I didn't convince any of them that I was telling the truth.

I still go to DI when I'm in St George ... perhaps I have a death wish‽‽

[Tacenda]

46 minutes ago, Malc said:

Just a bunch of young "kids" - certainly nothing in their appearance suggested polygamists, especially the women. Other than the gun incident, I would have said that they were perfectly normal, average, everyday early-20s folks.

A funny thing happened to me in a discussion group that I mentioned this incident in. About half of the folks who replied to me said I should have reported the incident, perhaps filed a police complaint. The other half called me a variety of names, ranging from liar, to leftie (which I am - if they wanted to insult me they went the wrong way with that  ), to enemy of the 2nd amendment, etc. I replied a couple of times to one of the latter, but I'm sure I didn't convince any of them that I was telling the truth.

I still go to DI when I'm in St George ... perhaps I have a death wish‽‽

Ya know, I should have thought it might be the younger crowd they love the DI, and the ones in high school, are saving their parents $$!

Don't you ever dare tell a soul that you lean to the left!! We are like the old wild west now! Half kidding! 

 

[Malc]

2 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Ya know, I should have thought it might be the younger crowd they love the DI, and the ones in high school, are saving their parents $$!

Don't you ever dare tell a soul that you lean to the left!! We are like the old wild west now! Half kidding! 

 

Then I'll depend on your discretion too, Tacenda.

As far as the US is concerned, many people would likely consider me close to being a communist. BUt I believe that's only because the US leans so far right that most other western democracies appear to be socialist. I was brought up in the vicinity of "Red Clydeside" in Scotland. My father was a union man, through and through; he was a shop steward for many years; and he had friends who were actually communists, though he himself, to my knowledge, never embraced that philosophy. 

But we'll keep this info just between you & me, all right?

[Tacenda]

9 minutes ago, Malc said:

Then I'll depend on your discretion too, Tacenda.

As far as the US is concerned, many people would likely consider me close to being a communist. BUt I believe that's only because the US leans so far right that most other western democracies appear to be socialist. I was brought up in the vicinity of "Red Clydeside" in Scotland. My father was a union man, through and through; he was a shop steward for many years; and he had friends who were actually communists, though he himself, to my knowledge, never embraced that philosophy. 

But we'll keep this info just between you & me, all right?

My husband is a retired union ironworker.  But not fully retired, started work afterwards with another job. 

So I was torn between the two parties, now I'm proudly an Independent. 

[MorningStar]

We have a ward clerk and two assistant ward clerks. I feel comforted that they’re all normal. 🤣 

[Tacenda]

https://www.ksl.com/article/50708387/truth-social-tip-prompted-investigation-into-man-killed-in-provo-fbi-raid 

Here's maybe new information for some of you. I like to read the comments on KSL, gives me such hope in my home state.

Also, this video talks about how these evangelical groups have turned militant, and turn their backs on Jesus. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nPXUOsUiwo

Very scary.

[Navidad]

9 hours ago, Calm said:

Just an fyi, I don’t know about official mentions in speeches and manuals, etc, but typically when the extermination order comes up in conversation around me the last 25 years or so, more context than used to be is added generally, including Rigdon’s sermons mentioned as upping the tension and contributing to the violence. 

Yes, you are right. Sorry, if I seemed to be ignoring that recent progress. Now, if we could just figure out if Butch Cassidy (aka Robert Parker) really lived in Colonia Dublan instead of Paraguay/Bolivia, the world would all be set back in order. Once I am done with my current project/book/thesis, I hope to give more attention to that myth/truth. Oh, and as I sit here at 6:11am writing this, I must make note of the fact that "raindrops keep falling on my roof!" Given our current drought, it is wonderful to hear the rain!

Anyone on the forum know any descendants of the Bowmans who lived here for many years? It is said that Cassidy lived in their attic for years. The house was torn down years ago. The Dublan cemetery has a number of unmarked graves from the thirties. Hmmmm!

Several months ago, we had staff from the Mexico City and SLC church history archives here in our home for a number of hours talking about all things Mexican Mormon colonies/LeBaron-related. When we were done recording, they thanked me and asked me if there was anything they could do to help me. I told them it would help me if they could dig into the church archives to find all things Butch Cassidy-related. They all knew of his LDS connections, but not about the theories of his last years lived here. Needless to say, they didn't leave for another half hour as we discussed it all. Maybe some day I'll get a big email full of helpful files! That would be fun! Best wishes to all. Try and get the "Raindrops keep falling on my head" tune out of you mind, once it is there! Not possible! Ha!

[Navidad]

8 hours ago, Tacenda said:

Ya know, I should have thought it might be the younger crowd they love the DI, and the ones in high school, are saving their parents $$!

Don't you ever dare tell a soul that you lean to the left!! We are like the old wild west now! Half kidding! 

 

Sorry to be dumb - but what is DI? All I can think of is Day's Inn. I live in Mexico, so I may be culturally impaired!?

[Malc]

2 hours ago, Navidad said:

Sorry to be dumb - but what is DI? All I can think of is Day's Inn. I live in Mexico, so I may be culturally impaired!?

Sorry - my fault. You're not dumb at all (I read your posts/comments). A  misunderstanding like this is something I should be aware of, having lived outside Utah for all of m y life, but hearing members talk about church/Utah things.

I was referring to Deseret Industries - a bit like a Mormon version of Goodwill - tons of mostly good used items.

I remember being mildly embarrassed in a conversation in which a bunch of people at church were talking about "The Y", and I commented that I had heard that the recreation facilities were great, but it was considered to be an iffy place to stay, especially in cities like New York. Everybody was looking at me with puzzled expressions, wondering what on earth I was on about. They meant "BYU", and I was referring to "YMCA".

[Calm]

32 minutes ago, Malc said:

Sorry - my fault. You're not dumb at all (I read your posts/comments). A  misunderstanding like this is something I should be aware of, having lived outside Utah for all of m y life, but hearing members talk about church/Utah things.

I was referring to Deseret Industries - a bit like a Mormon version of Goodwill - tons of mostly good used items.

I remember being mildly embarrassed in a conversation in which a bunch of people at church were talking about "The Y", and I commented that I had heard that the recreation facilities were great, but it was considered to be an iffy place to stay, especially in cities like New York. Everybody was looking at me with puzzled expressions, wondering what on earth I was on about. They meant "BYU", and I was referring to "YMCA".

It took me a bit to switch in hearing YMCA to BYU when I heard “Y”.  We used to have swimming lessons every summer at the Y when we lived in the Chicago area.

[The Nehor]

10 hours ago, MorningStar said:

We have a ward clerk and two assistant ward clerks. I feel comforted that they’re all normal. 🤣 

Your ward is that short on weirdos?

[Chum]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

Your ward is that short on weirdos?

I think that's one factor. Another is if leadership prefers support that is more flavored by agreement or helpful challenge.

Edited August 13 by Chum

[jonah747]

On 8/11/2023 at 4:41 PM, MorningStar said:

When the church talks about the order to exterminate the saints in Missouri, these types of people hear, "And we should buy a ton of guns in case it happens again!"

I would say that self-defense is justified. Like what happened in Esther chapters 8 and 9.

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, jonah747 said:

I would say that self-defense is justified. Like what happened in Esther chapters 8 and 9.

So self-defense is justified…..when the legal authorities tell you you can do so? That story in Esther is an odd choice for a reference.

[MorningStar]

5 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Your ward is that short on weirdos?

I’m a weirdo, but they can’t make me ward clerk. Hahahahahaha

[blackstrap]

There are few things more dangerous than a loaded firearm in the hands of the untrained/unskilled. Even LEOs in a stressful situation seem to resort to a "spray and pray " method with dozens of shots fired at one perp and may only hit a couple of times. 

[jonah747]

19 hours ago, The Nehor said:

So self-defense is justified…..when the legal authorities tell you you can do so? That story in Esther is an odd choice for a reference.

Yes. I think its called "stand-your-ground" law.

[The Nehor]

2 hours ago, jonah747 said:

Yes. I think its called "stand-your-ground" law.

I don't think even Stretch Armstrong could reach that comparison.