Church magazines will be provided at no cost to members

[CV75]

21 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I really struggle with the idea that all we need is the spirit to learn, understand, and apply the doctrines of the gospel in our lives, and that outside input isn't really very important.  

Of course. Emphasis is not the same as exclusivity, and neither does the Church use the Liahona as its exclusive means of input for members' spiritual learning. We all have the gift of the Holy Ghost which helps us process any and all our experiences, mental states and cognitive activities/operations (in this case, learning). To paraphrase, we are that we might have joy, and some of us find particular joy in scholarly pursuits. I beleive the Spirit will help us in that. 

[manol]

error

Edited August 3, 2023 by manol

[The Nehor]

What is a magazine?

[longview]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

What is a magazine?

Something you clip into a scary-looking AK-47.

[The Nehor]

35 minutes ago, longview said:

Something you clip into a scary-looking AK-47.

It can’t be that scary. It is from the start of a Weird Al song.

 

[Calm]

On 8/3/2023 at 7:52 AM, CV75 said:

The Church doesn't endorse or promote specific vocations or avocations, which is why, as a general magazine, the Liahona would lack a regular feature section covering serious academic topics. The focus on personal discipleship and revelation are a different pursuit altogether (not that there's anything wrong with someone choosing or preferring the pursuit of serious scholarship). I do recall the Liahona presenting the occassional theme and article covering the preservation of discipleship while engaged in responsible scholarship.

I don’t know how old you are, but before the Ensign the Church magazines published accessible material by scholars and my memory says they came at times at least in the predecessor of the Ensign (Instructor I think) with footnotes so you could use those as a springboard. 

So while I agree that the current magazines avoid more scholarly topics, I don’t see it as outside the Church’s mission to provide such. In the past there was heavy emphasis on more advanced religious learning for adults, at least in the wards I was in and from the way my mom and dad said stuff. There were massive ward libraries and the High Priests ran a church bookstore.  

The adult population is from what we draw our church teachers. It seems odd to me that we don’t provide more academically oriented lessons in order to train potential teachers of our youth better. It is harder to teach principles through narrative, imo, if you don’t understand how the narrative fits outside a primary version.   
 

PS:  they also published really cool paper dolls…or so I thought back then. 
 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Calm

[CV75]

11 hours ago, Calm said:

I don’t know how old you are, but before the Ensign the Church magazines published accessible material by scholars and my memory says they came at times at least in the predecessor of the Ensign (Instructor I think) with footnotes so you could use those as a springboard. 

So while I agree that the current magazines avoid more scholarly topics, I don’t see it as outside the Church’s mission to provide such. In the past there was heavy emphasis on more advanced religious learning for adults, at least in the wards I was in and from the way my mom and dad said stuff. There were massive ward libraries and the High Priests ran a church bookstore.  

The adult population is from what we draw our church teachers. It seems odd to me that we don’t provide more academically lessons in order to train potential teachers of our youth better. It is harder to teach principles through narrative, imo, if you don’t understand how the narrative fits outside a primary version. 
 

PS:  they also published really cool paper dolls…or so I thought back then. 
 

I am 66 years old, joined the Church in 1975 and have been an avid reader of the Ensign and Liahona all along. I’ve noted the changes through the years.

I agree that the Church’s mission to provide scholarly material is justified and she has many vehicles through which this is accomplished. The Ensign and hard-copy libraries probably weren’t the most effective way to disseminate scholarly works by today’s standards, plus the scholarship is better today (volume/quantity, quality and scope/subject matter). Fortunately, the Church (and BYU) has moved along with digital/online resources to better make such articles and materials available to more people. This includes teacher training, and Liahona articles would not be the best venue for that either (although I have seen a few here and here).

So, we have the issue [pun!] of the Liahona magazine, scholarly resources maintained by the Church, and Church-provided training resources for unit teachers, each with distinctive reading level and content to meet specific purposes. I think the white stone we will someday receive may provide a unified, integrated resource for all these  !

I love the paper dolls!

[Calm]

3 minutes ago, CV75 said:

I’ve noted the changes through the years.

This was preEnsign, so you wouldn’t have been exposed to the Instructor and other magazines.

[Tacenda]

12 hours ago, Calm said:

I don’t know how old you are, but before the Ensign the Church magazines published accessible material by scholars and my memory says they came at times at least in the predecessor of the Ensign (Instructor I think) with footnotes so you could use those as a springboard. 

So while I agree that the current magazines avoid more scholarly topics, I don’t see it as outside the Church’s mission to provide such. In the past there was heavy emphasis on more advanced religious learning for adults, at least in the wards I was in and from the way my mom and dad said stuff. There were massive ward libraries and the High Priests ran a church bookstore.  

The adult population is from what we draw our church teachers. It seems odd to me that we don’t provide more academically lessons in order to train potential teachers of our youth better. It is harder to teach principles through narrative, imo, if you don’t understand how the narrative fits outside a primary version. 
 

PS:  they also published really cool paper dolls…or so I thought back then. 
 

I remember the cool paper dolls! 

I hope the church doesn't discontinue magazines and only do online. A lot of elderly would hurt over that. When I visit my MIL in her assistant care center, there's always the update Ensign or Liahona? Sitting on the coffee table in the living room when you enter the building. 

[CV75]

37 minutes ago, Calm said:

This was preEnsign, so you wouldn’t have been exposed to the Instructor and other magazines.

I see; yes, I am only familiar with the publications after that.

Was there a reduction in the availability of scholarly material when the "Instructor" (aimed at youth and young adult Sunday School -- I'm going by Wikipedia here The Instructor (LDS Church) - Wikipedia) transitioned to the next phase of publications (New Era, Ensign), and were there no longer footnotes for springboarding?

It does seem to me that as scholarship, technology and Church finances improved, the venues for disseminating it became more focused in their purpose. Liahona not so much (although you can see it indirectly reflected in the articles that professionals have prepared for life skills topics, addiction, marriage, etc.); teacher training materials, a bit more is evident; online scholarship, absolutely.

Edited August 4, 2023 by CV75

[jpv]

On 8/2/2023 at 7:52 PM, MiserereNobis said:

That’s a very traditional Mary. 
 

ETA: I originally said Catholic

And why not both?

[Kenngo1969]

On 8/3/2023 at 12:45 PM, manol said:

error

From you?!!  Perish the thought!  My entire worldview has been shaken to its very foundations!

 

[Kenngo1969]

On 8/4/2023 at 8:07 AM, Tacenda said:

I remember the cool paper dolls! 

I hope the church doesn't discontinue magazines and only do online. A lot of elderly would hurt over that. When I visit my MIL in her assistant care center, there's always the update Ensign or Liahona? Sitting on the coffee table in the living room when you enter the building. 

These may be words I will have to eat someday (if anybody wants to bookmark this post ), but keep in mind, as you yourself hint at ... this is a worldwide organization, and literacy and understanding among its members (not to mention access to technology) runs the entire gamut, from barely able to access technology (if it is available at all), and barely able to read and comprehend, to Ph.D.-level intellects and beyond who have access to the latest technology in the very palms of their hands.

Often, some excoriate the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints for "catering to the lowest common denominator" ... But if an organization wants to reach the widest possible audience, to a greater or lesser extent, it must do that.  Which is a long-winded way of saying, "Don't worry.  I doubt, seriously, that print resources are going away anytime soon"—I don't think it will happen before someone develops some sort of "neural link" technology that will allow for widespread telepathic communication.

[Calm]

6 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

... But if an organization wants to reach the widest possible audience, to a greater or lesser extent, it must do that.

But it doesn’t need to do that by completely excluding more advanced material just as where the Church needs to reach young children so it includes materials in manuals that works well for them, but also adds other age appropriate material for all ages. Why not have basic material plus an additional one scholarly article per month that is presented in a way that teaches an appreciation for scholarship and how to research it well, so that one monthly article becomes a way to train members as they advance in their abilities?

Edited August 5, 2023 by Calm

[manol]

On 8/5/2023 at 10:13 AM, Kenngo1969 said:

From you?!!  Perish the thought!  My entire worldview has been shaken to its very foundations!

 

Yeah I know, I have such a reputation around here for... um... nevermind.

Most of my online activity is at another site related to my day job, and their forum's template puts the "edit" button exactly where the "quote" button is here.  It's embarrassing how often I intend to edit and actually quote myself instead.  I'm not THAT self-centered, or at least am unwilling to leave an evidentiary trail to that effect.  So normally I try to save face by editing the unintentional post into something which at least has the appearance of legitimacy... so it LOOKS like "I meant to do that."

This time I had a dayjob deadline looming and didn't have time to think up something that would fool anyone into thinking I actually intended to make a follow-up post, and fortunately I remembered seeing @mfbukowski post "error" once or twice.  Figured I couldn't go wrong plagiarizing a philosopher. 

 

Edited August 10, 2023 by manol

[Kenngo1969]

1 hour ago, manol said:

... I remembered seeing @mfbukowski post "error" once or twice.  Figured I couldn't go wrong plagiarizing a philosopher. 

Don't worry: I'm an equal-opportunity "needler."  I have given him jazz over doing that, too.   (All in good fun, of course ...) 

Edited August 10, 2023 by Kenngo1969

[Calm]

1 hour ago, manol said:

So normally I try to save face by editing the unintentional post into something which at least has the appearance of legitimacy... so it LOOKS like "I meant to do that."

I adore this because we get more of you posting this way!

[manol]

17 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

Don't worry: I'm an equal-opportunity "needler."  I have given him jazz over doing that, too.   (All in good fun, of course ...) 

Ha!  I'm in good company then.

19 minutes ago, Calm said:

I adore this because we get more of you posting this way!

Thanks.  Sometimes I can't resist the urge to color outside the lines, and then proceed to do so ineptly.  I hope you know I mean no harm to anyone here. 

[Calm]

19 minutes ago, manol said:

Ha!  I'm in good company then.

Thanks.  Sometimes I can't resist the urge to color outside the lines, and then proceed to do so ineptly.  I hope you know I mean no harm to anyone here. 

I enjoy getting a chance to stretch my brain.