Navidad Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 I would be very interested to hear your individual and collective thoughts on how the human soul, body, and spirit connect and interact with each other. I am interested in the spiritual, psychological, and physical implications of the same. Thanks. Link to comment
Popular Post InCognitus Posted October 9, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted October 9, 2022 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Navidad said: I would be very interested to hear your individual and collective thoughts on how the human soul, body, and spirit connect and interact with each other. I am interested in the spiritual, psychological, and physical implications of the same. Thanks. There is some common confusion in language between "spirit" and "soul". In some cases they are used interchangeably. But as you probably know, in Latter-day Saint doctrine, the "soul" of man is the spirit and body combined: "And the spirit and the body are the soul of man. And the resurrection from the dead is the redemption of the soul." (Doctrine and Covenants 88:15–16) And as in Gen 2:7 "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground [body], and breathed into his nostrils the breath [spirit] of life; and man became a living soul." I think those are the "physical" implications of what is a soul and what makes us who we are. I think our personality and many other traits come primarily from our spirit, although I'm sure our physical body influences that to some degree (depending on brain physiology and other biological factors). Edited October 9, 2022 by InCognitus 7 Link to comment
CV75 Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Navidad said: I would be very interested to hear your individual and collective thoughts on how the human soul, body, and spirit connect and interact with each other. I am interested in the spiritual, psychological, and physical implications of the same. Thanks. As @InCognitus described, we believe that when spirit and element are connected, we have a soul. This connection occurs in at least two different forms (separably and inseparably; I'll go out on a limb here and suggest that would include what we might observe to be "entanglement"); in at least three different phases (mortal, translated and resurrected); and, with various attendant degrees of glory (paradisiacal or terrestrial as with Adam and Eve; telestial as with our natural and everyday life; and, transfigured, which I use liberally to include heightened mortal and the post-resurrection states). Spirit and element are forms of matter so at some fundamental level they are compatibly functional as the same thing. I have no idea how any of this is done, but the process might be called “quickening”, and the light of Christ has everything to do with it. The spiritual, psychological and physical implications can be described in terms of the plan of salvation. Edited October 9, 2022 by CV75 4 Link to comment
tagriffy Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 I need to start by noting this is not a fully developed thought; it's just an idea. I've been thinking about the spirit as more akin to a recording device than anything else. The more we learn about the brain, the more it appears that our psychologies, personalities, and so forth are pysiologically rooted in the brain as it has interacted with our environment. But the spirit is there, recording, so that we have something to take with us. 3 Link to comment
Steve Thompson Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 Are you interested in specifically LDS perspectives on the topic, or perspectives in general? If the latter, and since you mentioned "psychological" I'd recommend Jesse Bering, The Belief Instinct The Psychology of souls, destiny and the meaning of life. Link to comment
OGHoosier Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 It seems obvious to me that the "spirit body" cannot retain its form when combined with the mortal body since the mortal body ages, changes, etc. So, I'm not really sure what purpose it serves, though I like @tagriffy's thought about spirit as "recorder". I am fairly partial to an Aristotelian view of the mind, and consequently I am not convinced that mind = brain - quite the contrary. However, a "different form of matter" such as a body of spirit matter doesn't really answer that either, so I'm committed to a fully non-material view of "intelligence", which I interpret as the seat of experience, the "sensor" behind the senses. This intelligence gets attached to various bodies in order to interact with the world - first the spiritual body then the physical body when we are born. On this view we could retain a spirit body as a kind of recorder, or the spirit body could just be dissolved and reconstituted at birth and death, and then fully merged with the physical in resurrection. 2 Link to comment
Nofear Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 From a physics type perspective there seems to be two basic kinds of determinate* matter in the universe what we call spirit and physical matter. There is a third "substance" which we call intelligence. I believe it is indeterminate**. Spirit matter seems to have the narrowest of interactions with physical matter and vice versa. Intelligence can interact with both physical and spirit matter. If, I, as a divine being only have a physical body, then much of the universe is invisible to me. If I only have a spirit body, much of the universe would also be invisible to me. Thus, it is very desirable to have perceptual access to both "sides" of the universe. More that can be said on the matter (hehe, pun). Of particular problem is the redundancy of memory with the brain, etc. I think there is perhaps something to the transducer concept (https://mindmatters.ai/2021/08/a-neuroscience-theory-that-actually-helps-explain-the-brain/). * Determinate: can only act when acted upon. ** Indeterminate: it can act without being acted upon -- though that breaks all kinds of physics. 2 Link to comment
Navidad Posted October 10, 2022 Author Share Posted October 10, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Steve Thompson said: Are you interested in specifically LDS perspectives on the topic, or perspectives in general? If the latter, and since you mentioned "psychological" I'd recommend Jesse Bering, The Belief Instinct The Psychology of souls, destiny and the meaning of life. I am interested in all perspectives, neither excluding or solely including the LDS perspective. I am mostly interested in your personal perspectives. I find that more helpful than something doctrinal or dogmatic. I have ordered the book you suggested. Thanks so much. Edited October 10, 2022 by Navidad Link to comment
OGHoosier Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 3 hours ago, Nofear said: From a physics type perspective there seems to be two basic kinds of determinate* matter in the universe what we call spirit and physical matter. There is a third "substance" which we call intelligence. I believe it is indeterminate**. Spirit matter seems to have the narrowest of interactions with physical matter and vice versa. Intelligence can interact with both physical and spirit matter. If, I, as a divine being only have a physical body, then much of the universe is invisible to me. If I only have a spirit body, much of the universe would also be invisible to me. Thus, it is very desirable to have perceptual access to both "sides" of the universe. More that can be said on the matter (hehe, pun). Of particular problem is the redundancy of memory with the brain, etc. I think there is perhaps something to the transducer concept (https://mindmatters.ai/2021/08/a-neuroscience-theory-that-actually-helps-explain-the-brain/). * Determinate: can only act when acted upon. ** Indeterminate: it can act without being acted upon -- though that breaks all kinds of physics. MindMatters is fine stuff. Dr. Egnor is a good introduction to Aristotelian theory of mind though there is much left to discover. I find them to be remarkably astute on the topic of AI as well. Link to comment
Navidad Posted October 10, 2022 Author Share Posted October 10, 2022 I am interested in your thoughts on the source of prejudices, biases, blind spots, emotions, confidence (or the lack thereof), guilt, anger - all the human stuff we deal with within ourselves and others day-to-day. Why so many differences between humans in their responses to things? Soul wounds? Perhaps in the LDS concept we don't have a soul, we are a soul made up of spirit and body. So the soul is not a particular part of us, but a name for the whole - in that sense humans are bipartite? Souls made up of bodies and spirits. If that is the case, what is the mind, why false memories? So much to figure out! Thanks for your thoughts. The more practical and day-to-day stuff, the more helpful will be your thoughts. Why do many humans resist change, while others embrace it? If we don't figure out why we are the way we are, how do we change? How do we teach change, encourage insightful reflection, lessen certainty? Link to comment
Teancum Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 16 hours ago, Navidad said: I would be very interested to hear your individual and collective thoughts on how the human soul, body, and spirit connect and interact with each other. I am interested in the spiritual, psychological, and physical implications of the same. Thanks. From what view point? LDS? Traditional Christianity? Skeptic? Link to comment
BlueDreams Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 53 minutes ago, Teancum said: From what view point? LDS? Traditional Christianity? Skeptic? He responded to a post a couple above yours saying all perspectives are welcome, preferably personal. with luv, BD 1 Link to comment
Eschaton Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 I believe the earliest forms of the Hebrew religion didn't have a concept of an immortal soul, which we find evidence of in Psalms: Psalm 6:5 For in death there is no remembrance of you; in Sheol who will give you praise? Psalm 115:17 The dead do not praise the Lord, nor do any who go down into silence. The concept undergoes a gradual syncretic evolution, kickstarted by the cultural and religious practices of those who conquered Israel and Judah. From An Introduction to the New Testament and the Origins of Christianity: Before the Babylonian captivity, ancient Israelites expected to experience a bleak existence after death in a gloomy, underground pit called “Sheol.” This was not a place of punishment, but simply a grave for all mortals. When the body entered the grave, whatever remained of human awareness went underground with it. The ancient Greeks had a similar underworld called “Hades.” For both cultures, any good that a person hoped to experience had to come before death – there would be none afterward. After the Babylonian captivity, the Jews absorbed new ideas from the Persian religion Zoroastrianism. According to this religion, a god of good and a god of evil waged a cosmic battle in which humans took part by following one or the other. At some time in the future, the forces of good would defeat the forces of evil. Humans who had died would be resurrected – raised from the dead with their bodies restored. The good god would hold a final judgment, rewarding some in paradise and punishing others in hell. Afterwards all would be purified in fire and ultimately saved. God would create a new world without death in which all would live happily ever after. Many Jews in the Persian period adopted some form of this new conception. When the Jews came under the dominion of the Greeks, their ideas underwent further developments. For one, Sheol came to be identified with Hades, which had become a place of reward and punishment for the soul. Souls could now undergo judgment immediately upon death, separated in different compartments of the underworld. This preliminary judgment did not necessarily rule out a later resurrection and final judgment. Link to comment
Eschaton Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 I should add that I think there is a difference between "spirit" and "shade." Shades seem to be similar to the idea of a shadow - it's connected to you somehow, but it's not really you - it's just whatever "shadow" of you remains. "Spirit" is more like the platonic ideal of what makes you a person - without any of the messy matter getting in the way. A spirit, even when disconnected from the body, seems to be alive in many of the same ways as a living person is alive, with all the same thoughts, feelings, desires, etc. Link to comment
Kenngo1969 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 (edited) 18 hours ago, InCognitus said: ... I think our personality and many other traits come primarily from our spirit, although I'm sure our physical body influences that to some degree (depending on brain physiology and other biological factors). Which is [one reason] why I am so looking forward to "shuffling off this mortal coil"! Hasten the day!!! Edited October 10, 2022 by Kenngo1969 1 Link to comment
Navidad Posted October 10, 2022 Author Share Posted October 10, 2022 2 hours ago, Teancum said: From what view point? LDS? Traditional Christianity? Skeptic? From all perspectives! Scientific, epigenetic, psychological, spiritual, musings . . . whatever are your thoughts on the subject. 1 Link to comment
BlueDreams Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 3 hours ago, Navidad said: I am interested in your thoughts on the source of prejudices, biases, blind spots, emotions, confidence (or the lack thereof), guilt, anger - all the human stuff we deal with within ourselves and others day-to-day. Why so many differences between humans in their responses to things? Soul wounds? Perhaps in the LDS concept we don't have a soul, we are a soul made up of spirit and body. So the soul is not a particular part of us, but a name for the whole - in that sense humans are bipartite? Souls made up of bodies and spirits. If that is the case, what is the mind, why false memories? So much to figure out! Thanks for your thoughts. The more practical and day-to-day stuff, the more helpful will be your thoughts. Why do many humans resist change, while others embrace it? If we don't figure out why we are the way we are, how do we change? How do we teach change, encourage insightful reflection, lessen certainty? That's quite a bit of stream-of-conscious questions. I'm going to start with the bold/basics and work outward. This is my current definition of the 3. Spirit is the eternal part of us that has always been that's made of light and truth. It's innately good unless it proactively chooses evil (ie lucifer). But at that point its nature changes. It's like saying a leaf is innately alive unless you cut it off from the main plant. The context can fundamentally change the nature. And that context are the choices we make or have made. The body is what the spirit is housed in both her and post resurrection. It isn't innately bad but it is innately fallen and in a state that can been more disordered. I don't have necessarily have a bipartite system. Both spirit and bodies are considered matter in LDS theology. What is currently dissonant to one degree or another is how those two work together mainly because of our misalligned bodies. Our purpose here is to start the process of overcome by growing in light/truth via the circumstances we are given. The soul is a little more innocuous. It can describe three states (spirits, humans here, humans resurrected/translated). If I had to give it an overarching definition, it's the whole of us at any given moment. The mind is simply how we process information in the current form. It's currently imperfect on several fronts. False memories thus are a byproduct of imperfect perception and processing mechanisms. Kay with that out of the way here's some of the other things. Working with people's pysche is kinda the thing I do. The people interact with things in diverse ways, there are definitely solid patterns. Psychology has found a number of ways to try and create models and means to describe these experiences. Some I like more than others. All of them are flawed and are by no means equally applicable. For example I have two client who have BPD. They present a little differently, but there's proven models of therapy that help. With one, I've tried to use that and it only got me so far so on a whim I used a complete different model that's newer and less proven and the 2 mixed together healed much of the concerns. Another I've tried doing something similar once I realized what was happening. Unfortunately the other model just doesn't jive with their psyche. Most models were made because a psychologist saw a specific pattern and found a way to work with it that quite often saw results. But what happens is that the outliars don't get incorporated into the models. They either leave before then or remain "resistant" to therapy. To me, it's just that we can't fully know the individual. God is innately diverse. We see it in nature (which denotes there is a God) where there are definite patterns but a hundred variations within each pattern. A kaleidoscope/rainbow of experiences and light. We are God's so we are diverse. Healing for me comes from truly knowing and tapping into the goodness of each individual to help them unlock their forms of light and truth to the degree they're ready to receive it. It takes careful attunement and recognizing my limits. I have people I'm not meant to help, but someone else might. I guess you could call that a blind spot. I'd say it comes from a serious of experiences and personality that clashes a little too or too quickly with another. Or a set of skills and abilities I haven't taken in that would better serve their needs. It's not that we can never allign. It's that something in this specific moment can't. Luckily I'm not asked to hold all the pains, struggles, and concerns of this world. That's Jesus. I just have to do my part in it. Prejudices, biases, and confidence/lack of are by-products of being here. I learned my prejudice towards conservative ev/protestants via bad experiences in the south as a member of the LDS faith. Others learn it in a variety of ways, but usually a mix of ignorance, negative experiences, and social learning that emphasizes group traits on earth as having fundamental significance. Not great, just is. Many can be unlearned or at least reduced. By seeking understanding, more diverse experiences, more knowledge, etc (ie more light and truth) these begin to naturally shed. Some bias though is inevitable in this life. Some may be good to some degree. For example if someone has a bias for positive healthy traits/knowledge. But event these if taken to an extreme can become their own vices. For example I have a strong bias towards healthy eating and care of ones body. No one's going to say that's bad. But if I become obsessive and hyper focused on this I can become unhealthy...sometimes critically so. Emotions, including anger, are different. They like bodies are both innately part of who we are. God is described more than once with varying emotions. Like our bodies, we are learning to work with them healthily. For example, I have a real propensity to anger. It's not seen her much, but it's there. My anger when it was out of allignment was a hot mess. I was volatile, easily aggitated, aggressive, etc. As I healed and grew spiritual my anger became a crucial source of information. It tells me when something is wrong whether in myself or with others. If I'm angry with my child I likely am out of balance and need a break. I honor the info given and find space to re-balance myself. In my work and daily like I'm really good at recognizing something is really wrong with relationships or an individual. It's informed by my anger. I don't have to express my anger like I did when i was a young disregulated teen. Now, my anger it most often expressed by speaking truth about the wrongness of a situation. I'm not perfect at it of course...thus Jesus and repentance. I guess that gets me to change. I have been both one who resists change and values it depending. I've learned in life to fear change. Change brought drama from my family situation a lot. At the same time change also rescued me from pain. So change that I can see the correlation to healing and growth, even if it is at first painful, I value. Change for change's sake I don't and can even become a little stressed about. My relationship with change was directly tied to my experiences with it. The other thing I seen in terms of "resisting" change is often the change we think a person should make is 2-5 steps ahead to the change they actually need and can really take in. So even if someone is logically convinced this would be good, personal obstacles whether emotional or contextual will get in the way for change to really stick or happen. Resisting change usually means I've moved faster than the person is willing or ready to move. It could also mean I'm wrong as to what needs to change. A personal example: my family was really skeptical about me being a vegetarian. They came from meat-heavy cultures and thus tended to have a strong value/bias towards meat being necessary for health. So whenever I got sick or had a health concern they'd immediately assume I needed to change my diet to look more like theirs. I resisted it because it simply wasn't true. Sure a vegetarian diet could be unhealthy, but mine wasn't and their answer to it/expectations around meat eating were also often excessive. You could also say they were resistant to change too. When I would cook say eggs with a lot of vegetables my step-dad especially would look at it skeptically and wouldn't eat it. He wouldn't become convinced that his diet needed any form of altering unfortunately until he got type 2 diabetes. Which probably answers the question of how we change without some form of insight....negative impacts may teach us fast that we have to change in some way. I have one other thing I'd want to say, but said kid needs me and the day calls. With luv, BD 3 Link to comment
CV75 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 (edited) 5 hours ago, Navidad said: I am interested in your thoughts on the source of prejudices, biases, blind spots, emotions, confidence (or the lack thereof), guilt, anger - all the human stuff we deal with within ourselves and others day-to-day. Why so many differences between humans in their responses to things? Soul wounds? Perhaps in the LDS concept we don't have a soul, we are a soul made up of spirit and body. So the soul is not a particular part of us, but a name for the whole - in that sense humans are bipartite? Souls made up of bodies and spirits. If that is the case, what is the mind, why false memories? So much to figure out! Thanks for your thoughts. The more practical and day-to-day stuff, the more helpful will be your thoughts. Why do many humans resist change, while others embrace it? If we don't figure out why we are the way we are, how do we change? How do we teach change, encourage insightful reflection, lessen certainty? I find the following model very helpful in understanding the differences we observe between souls in this mortal world: Moral foundations theory - Wikipedia as applied in The Righteous Mind - Wikipedia Changes in these innate modules, though heavily influenced by genetics and culture in mortality, spiritually speaking, are ultimately a function of agency since the Atonement of Jesus Christ settles all mortally imposed accidents and malfunctions, including false memories. Through Jesus Christ progress from low-spiritual power/intelligence to a higher level between the realms of pre-existence (we are spirits only) to mortality, and between mortality and becoming inseparably connected spirit and element. RE; Bipartite, it depends. Edited October 10, 2022 by CV75 1 Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 20 hours ago, InCognitus said: There is some common confusion in language between "spirit" and "soul". In some cases they are used interchangeably. But as you probably know, in Latter-day Saint doctrine, the "soul" of man is the spirit and body combined: "And the spirit and the body are the soul of man. And the resurrection from the dead is the redemption of the soul." (Doctrine and Covenants 88:15–16) And as in Gen 2:7 "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground [body], and breathed into his nostrils the breath [spirit] of life; and man became a living soul." I think those are the "physical" implications of what is a soul and what makes us who we are. I think our personality and many other traits come primarily from our spirit, although I'm sure our physical body influences that to some degree (depending on brain physiology and other biological factors). I think this was from a common phrase which has gone from contemporary English, where "soul", besides being virtually equivalent to "spirit", also meant "person". One can find accounts of disasters saying for example "15 souls were lost", meaning that 15 people were killed in the flood, etc. It did NOT mean that they went to hell. 2 Link to comment
rodheadlee Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 21 hours ago, InCognitus said: There is some common confusion in language between "spirit" and "soul". In some cases they are used interchangeably. But as you probably know, in Latter-day Saint doctrine, the "soul" of man is the spirit and body combined: "And the spirit and the body are the soul of man. And the resurrection from the dead is the redemption of the soul." (Doctrine and Covenants 88:15–16) And as in Gen 2:7 "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground [body], and breathed into his nostrils the breath [spirit] of life; and man became a living soul." I think those are the "physical" implications of what is a soul and what makes us who we are. I think our personality and many other traits come primarily from our spirit, although I'm sure our physical body influences that to some degree (depending on brain physiology and other biological factors). This is true in Maritime Communications also. When you make connection with a scheduled radio network or the Coast Guard in an emergency they ask you how many souls are on board. 3 Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 44 minutes ago, CV75 said: I find the following model very helpful in understanding the differences we observe between souls in this mortal world: Moral foundations theory - Wikipedia as applied in The Righteous Mind - Wikipedia Changes in these innate modules, though heavily influenced by genetics and culture in mortality, spiritually speaking, are ultimately a function of agency since the Atonement of Jesus Christ settles all mortally imposed accidents and malfunctions, including false memories. Through Jesus Christ progress from low-spiritual power/intelligence to a higher level between the realms of pre-existence (we are spirits only) to mortality, and between mortality and becoming inseparably connected spirit and element. RE; Bipartite, it depends. I love psychology, studying it, the importance of therapy, without which I might have been even crazier etc. But man, that wikipedia stuff sounds to me like 12th century metaphysics. Angels dancing on a pin, anyone ? Castles in the sky? Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 5 minutes ago, rodheadlee said: This is true in Maritime Communications also. When you make connection with a scheduled radio network or the Coast Guard in an emergency they ask you how many souls are on board. Hey, it's one syllable and non- sexist. Can't beat that for efficiency! 1 Link to comment
pogi Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 (edited) 7 hours ago, Navidad said: I am interested in your thoughts on the source of prejudices, biases, blind spots, emotions, confidence (or the lack thereof), guilt, anger - all the human stuff we deal with within ourselves and others day-to-day. Why so many differences between humans in their responses to things? Soul wounds? Perhaps in the LDS concept we don't have a soul, we are a soul made up of spirit and body. So the soul is not a particular part of us, but a name for the whole - in that sense humans are bipartite? Souls made up of bodies and spirits. If that is the case, what is the mind, why false memories? So much to figure out! Thanks for your thoughts. The more practical and day-to-day stuff, the more helpful will be your thoughts. Why do many humans resist change, while others embrace it? If we don't figure out why we are the way we are, how do we change? How do we teach change, encourage insightful reflection, lessen certainty? I believe the understanding you are in search of is the scriptural "heart". Proverbs 4:23 King James Version: “Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.” New International Version: “Above all else, guard your heart for it is the wellspring of life.” New Living Translation: “Above all else, guard your heart, for it determines the course of your life.” Quote “All the same,” said the Scarecrow, "I shall ask for brains instead of a heart; for a fool would not know what to do with a heart if he had one.” “I shall take the heart,” returned the Tin man; "for brains do not make one happy, and happiness is the best thing in the world." (L Frank Baum, The Wonderful Wizard of Oz) I don't know exactly what the scriptural heart is in relation to the spirit/body/soul, but it seems to be the driving force that determines all outcomes in life. In studying it, I have come to believe it is not our conscious mind and agency that drives the heart. It seems to have a mind all of its own. I think that Paul was describing how our hearts can work against our minds in the following passages: Quote “…for how to perform that which is good I find not. For the good that I would, I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.” He continues, Quote “For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members” (Romans 7:18,19,22,23). In modern English, Paul was basically saying, “I act in ways that my mind tells me I shouldn’t act, and I fail to act in ways that my mind wants to act.” In my journey of addiction recovery, I identified with this passage strongly. I learned that my mind and my will is not always in control. There is something deeper that drives patterns of behavior. I believe that which is in control of our "members' aka our body is the heart (in the scriptural and not physical/organ sense). The scriptures make clear that the battle ground for the soul is the the heart. To highlight its significance, the "heart" is referenced in the scriptures (LDS standard works) 1502 times, while "love/charity" is only mentioned 757 times. If I had to guess, the scriptural heart is our subconscious mind. At times, it is at odds with our conscious mind, causing us to act in ways that we wish we could change. It is a world which harbors all of or our deepest held beliefs about ourselves and about the world, which drives action. Our heart is described in scripture as a tablet which can be written upon by God and also by the adversary. Those engravings form our core subconscious beliefs which drive behavior, often contrary to our conscious will. It forms the perspective of our realities. What is written on our hearts is our reality as we know it. They are powerful and seem to have the force of gravity causing us to circle our lives around them, even while our conscious minds cry in objection. Quote Do not let kindness and truth leave you; Bind them around your neck, Write them on the tablet of your heart. -Proverbs 3:3 2 Corinthians 3:3 – we become epistles of Chris written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. 2 Corinthians 3:15-18 – the veil upon our hearts is taken away when our hearts turn to the Lord, so that we can understand scripture. Proverbs 7:3 - He will write his law upon your heart. Here are some things I have written previously: Quote As children, we enter the world with no guards protecting our heart. In the first few years of our lives graffiti adorns our once clean and innocent hearts as we interact with the world. We learn that our hearts are sensitive and pliable, easy to engrave upon. We learn that often these engravings cause pain as they cut deep, and so we put up walls to protect our hearts from the unwanted graffiti and often deep engravings, but unfortunately the damage has already been done. The deeper and more painful the engraving, the stronger and taller we build our wall around our hearts. I believe that the signatures engraven upon our hearts by others often become our own signature. This may evidenced by the victim/abuser phenomenon. If we were shamed as children, we often pass this shame on to all those that we come in contact with, especially those that we are closest to and love the most. “But those things which proceed out of the mouth come from the heart; and they defile the man (Matthew 15:18).” The Book of Mormon explains that Satan, the author of all sin, passes wickedness on from generation to generation by "getting hold upon the hearts of the children of men" (Helaman 6: 30) . Signatures are passed from generation to generation. They become viral to the point that Satan hardly has to work anymore, he simply sits back and watches us protect his original signature as if we treasured it more than life itself by protecting it with our fortress. In protecting our heart from further damage by building a wall around it, we reinforce damaging core beliefs about ourselves, God, and the world. By so doing, we also make it nearly impossible for healers to come in. That is why Satan aims for the heart, because if he can write his signature upon it, he knows that we will unknowingly guard and protect that signature as if our lives depended upon it, and by so doing, we pass it on. That is also why God aims for the same. The battle between the two kingdoms is for our alliance, affection and allegiance. Both kingdoms know that if you influence or capture a heart by imprinting upon it, you get the whole man or whole woman. The battle for the heart is real. Over time, our hearts become too polluted and corrupted through interactions with the world that drive us contrary to our wills or righteousness. What is required at this point is a new heart: Quote A new heart also will I give you....and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. - Ezekial 36:26 I believe the whole purpose of the gospel is to assist us on this path of tearing down the walls/fortress around our hearts and presenting ourselves fully exposed and vulnerably naked before God in broken heart and contrite spirit, in which he will bestow upon us a new heart with his law written upon it and cover our nakedness with the skins of the atonement. I believe that is how we ultimately become one of heart with God and finally overcome. Quite the process! Edited October 10, 2022 by pogi 1 Link to comment
CV75 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 1 hour ago, mfbukowski said: I love psychology, studying it, the importance of therapy, without which I might have been even crazier etc. But man, that wikipedia stuff sounds to me like 12th century metaphysics. Angels dancing on a pin, anyone ? Castles in the sky? Ha-ha, who knows -- pick a model and see where it takes you! Link to comment
CV75 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 2 hours ago, rodheadlee said: This is true in Maritime Communications also. When you make connection with a scheduled radio network or the Coast Guard in an emergency they ask you how many souls are on board. So, if Legion was on board, he would still count as one soul? Is only one spirit technically connected to a possessed person's element (the element having the original spirit-element connection) and the other(s) not? Link to comment
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